Arstechnica : Xbox One users largely ignore backward-compatible Xbox 360 games

@mowgly1: Highly Requested=people care.

LOL so then your X1S is exactly what I am saying. Its powered on and not playing games because it is used as a control device for your TV.

Facts do Matter. Sony got burned... And that dire news piece damaging control for Sony, should be taken down.

@loe12k said:

Facts do Matter. Sony got burned... And that dire news piece damaging control for Sony, should be taken down.

A thread like this is the result of what happens when you assess a random 1/30th or so of a population.

Hell, they could have gotten most of the people who don't use it.

@gordonfreeman said:

@loe12k said:

Facts do Matter. Sony got burned... And that dire news piece damaging control for Sony, should be taken down.

A thread like this is the result of what happens when you assess a random 1/30th or so of a population.

Hell, they could have gotten most of the people who don't use it.

So true.

^ ^ ? nyadc and TigerSuperman quoting each other and posting the same damage control in the same thread. This thread is going places lol. Congrats OP.

Who cares if the thread goes somewhere if its foundation is based off of 3% of the whole, grow up and try being logical for a change.

? I'll grow up when you stop using your countless alt accounts.

I cant tell if you've just become a troll over the past few months or if youre genuinely this salty over BC.

@drrollinstein: Salty over MS' half-ass BC? You've gotta be joking. I still own all my old systems. You don't need BC when you still own a PS1, PS2, and two PS3s. I'm enjoying trolling lems because they deserve it after all the shit talk about BC this gen only for it to turn out that they spend more time on Netflix and Hulu than BC lol. It's embarrassing and watching them trying to damage control this is very entertaining.

@loe12k: man MS just wrecked the **** outta these Sony fans lol holy shit.

Lol cows are being put in their place really quickly lately. Microsoft is easily going to win E3 this year. 3 in a row

@FastRobby: ? You mean 4th loss in a row. They've been losing every E3 easily since E3 2013. Talk about lemming denial.

Man, seeing Lems handle this L is like watching a band geek who just got dumped by their first hot girlfriend. Man, here's hoping that Scorpio reveal goes well for them.

@VERTIGO47: Always remember, when the Quad falls to image posting he is in distress mode.

LOL, he's been in distress mode since Xbox's debut back in 2001.

Half-ass BC? They took a console that was never meant to or supposed to play these games and technologically willed its ability to into existence, there's nothing half-assed about that, it's a technological feat on every level.

There's also absolutely nothing to damage control, it's a random pool of one million users and within this random pool the usage was 1.5%. They could have gotten a completely different pool of one million users and it could have been 25%. You're illogically trying to leverage this percentage is indicative as a whole for the entire platform based upon 3% available data, you're completely excluding the 97% of users not accounted for in this assessment.

The only thing that is embarrassing in this thread are posts such as yours, they exist completely outside of the bounds of logicality, rationality and reason, for a lack of better words they are posts comprised of pure stupidity.

@quadknight: Sure you don't need it, but it would be extremely convenient if your ps4 could play your ps3 games. That's the only reason I still have a ps3 hooked up. I started with a 360 and got a ps3 a bit late in the game, so I didn't have the time to finish all of its games.

BC is a major convenience and denying that is sad. And as has been said, it isn't half assed. Just on a game perspective, they have tons of major name titles on there, and they add more every other week or so.

@Pedro said:

@RicanV said:

PS Now: Should not be mentioned in discussions regarding backwards compatibility. It is a subscription based service streaming service that offers you access to a library where you may or may not have owned a title in the past. This is also available on PC and Sony TV's (until recently where it was discontinued). It's easier to implement because it's being streamed but is also subject to issues with your network.

PSNow is the only way you can access PS3 games on the PS4 and currently only plays last gen and older games. Making it relevant to any conversation about BC or having access to older games on current gen systems.

If want to be all technical, Xbox One does not have BC because it requires the games to be downloaded and the games have been recompiled specifically for the Xbox One platform. Your disc only serves the purpose of proof a valid licensee. So, one can effectively argue there is no BC for any of the current platforms.

Again, PS Now is a subscription based service offering accessibility to a library through streaming regardless of architecture. This is not backwards compatibility.

To put things in perspective this service existed for the PS3. Would you call the ability to play PS3 games on your PS3 backwards compatibility?

The reason why it no longer exists on PS3 (or Vita) is because people want newer and fresher experiences.

@RicanV said:

@Pedro said:

@RicanV said:

PS Now: Should not be mentioned in discussions regarding backwards compatibility. It is a subscription based service streaming service that offers you access to a library where you may or may not have owned a title in the past. This is also available on PC and Sony TV's (until recently where it was discontinued). It's easier to implement because it's being streamed but is also subject to issues with your network.

PSNow is the only way you can access PS3 games on the PS4 and currently only plays last gen and older games. Making it relevant to any conversation about BC or having access to older games on current gen systems.

If want to be all technical, Xbox One does not have BC because it requires the games to be downloaded and the games have been recompiled specifically for the Xbox One platform. Your disc only serves the purpose of proof a valid licensee. So, one can effectively argue there is no BC for any of the current platforms.

Again, PS Now is a subscription based service offering accessibility to a library through streaming regardless of architecture. This is not backwards compatibility.

To put things in perspective this service existed for the PS3. Would you call the ability to play PS3 games on your PS3 backwards compatibility?

The reason why it no longer exists on PS3 (or Vita) is because people want newer and fresher experiences.

Rapidly maturing PS3 emulation on PC has diminished PS Now PS3 streaming's value. Why pay for PS Now PS3 when my PC is powerful enough to emulate the entire PS3 at playable frame rates?

Making Bayonetta available on PC was a good move by PG since this game was an emulation target.

https://hothardware.com/news/xbox-one-backwards-compatibility-took-sony-completely-by-surprise

Xbox One Backwards Compatibility Took Sony Completely By Surprise

"It was surprising," admitted Sony Worldwide Studios president Shuhei Yoshida. "I didn't think it was possible. There must be lots of engineering effort. They talked about 100 games, but what kind of games will be included. Is it smaller games or big games? We don't know."

Here's a primer, since you seem to have an issue with not every person being queried. And if the results are skewed, since BC requires you to go online and this study only uses people that went online, it would more likely skew in favor of BC usage relative to the whole.

It's good you saw reason. Though, with your first sentence, I wasn't even going to relate the non-gaming usage to BC usage and infer how much more use the users got from TV and streaming apps compared to BC, thus my elimination of those portions and only looking at the gaming use. I also rounded up.

MS pre-complied PPC format (big endian) into X86 format (little endian) i.e. it's like sharing Apple's Rosattea PPC-to-X86 cached translated applications.

This is known as static translated emulation, but JIT re-compiler is required for situations that the static translation doesn't handle. This is cutting edge emulation technology and has caused IBM to take over Transitive Corporation (i.e. IP that enables Apple's Rosetta) and shutdown their PPC-to-X86 emulation technology offerings.

MS is too large for IBM takeover and MS is not serious on destroying PowerPC in the server market.

Damn. This is....pretty painful to watch actually. There's not catching a break, and then there's this. Lems have been so utterly destroyed this gen. BC was their last possible defense, and now they've lost even that. I don't think I've ever seen so many lemming meltdowns in one thread. This is one for the history books.

As I have said before, if you want to get technical then the same can be argued for Xbox One "BC" because the games don't run the original games but re-compiled versions of the original games. This is not backwards compatibility either. And thats my point, you are creating argument rules for your convenience.

Modern X86 CPUs has hardware translator engines with some modern X86 CPUs even has translation cache i.e. a new feature for Ryzen and has been included with Intel CPUs for a long time. This is hardware based dynamic translation engine.

X86 CPU's translation cache can reduce the workload for X86 decoder engines, reduce pipeline latency and increase instruction issue per cycle rate when operating with hardware decoders in parallel.

My point, native silicon instructions was been dead since Intel Pentium Pro and AMD K5. AMD K5 still offers native mode programming that bypass the X86 decoders.

X86's microcode engine are kept encrypted by Intel i.e. native access to X86 RISC core is not for anybody.

Native CISC CPUs are dead and X86 has assimilated RISC technology, hence killing off MIPS Windows NT, Alpha Windows NT, PowerPC Windows NT and Itanium Windows NT.

Pre-compiling PPC to X86 reduces the look up table workload hence reducing the per instruction latency translation time.

I'd love to know if you actually believe the shit that you type, or you're just having a troll... either way, wow.

First off I'd wager that over well over 90% of people who own these modern systems including the PS4 have them connected to the internet, they're almost worthless without an internet connection and a lot of games cannot even be properly played without downloading something. Also this yet again is only surveying a tiny fraction of the user base, furthermore you don't need an internet connection to use backward compatibility, you only need it to download the game to the system.

I'm all for riling people up and having a laugh but the things they say are just dumb. Not even dumb in the sense that they don't know what they're talking about, dumb in the sense that they can be proven completely wrong or that their information is unreliable and still continue to push their agenda.

You could throw an undeniable fact right at them, they will read it, and continue to push what they're saying, it's insanity and the worst abuse of the no true scotsman fallacy I have ever witnessed.

First off, that's still not 100%, and I'd wager that the people that never go online, don't play Xbox 360 games on their Xbox One. You should also re-read that link and the associated articles to understand that nearly one million out of around 30 million is a pretty robust sample size and many accepted and peer reviewed statistical analysis have even had less. And lastly, that is just what I said. I never said you had to be online every time you use it, but it does require online access at least once for each title.

Come on, dude. Every member of the lem squad is in here in full damage control mode. You gotta admit, this news has devastated you guys.

Well, what do ya know. The one thing left to lemmings--the "popularity" of backwards compatibility--is taken from them, and Nyadc shows up in prime damage control form to point out the "inconsistencies" of the study. Shocking, absolutely shocking.

Countering stupidity and the misuse of data to intentionally take it out of context is not damage control, it's course correction for shit posting.

There are checks and balances for anything, you say stupid things, we highlight these stupid things you've said and the no true scotsman fallacy ends you as you continually ignore what is being said and form an ever growing diatribe of nonsense.

@gordonfreeman: Don't waste your time... he's just a troll (or completely delusional).

Yeah, it's damage control.

Also, "ever growing diatribe of nonsense" actually made me smile. Then, when I read over your reply and imagined you saying it in one long breath with your face becoming increasingly flushed, I smiled a little bigger. So thanks for that.

No, I am not creating argument rules. You just refuse to accept the fact that it's a streaming service regardless of the architecture.

Another example, which will be ignored as well, is the ability to use PS Now on your windows PC. Does that constitute as backwards compatibility?

You bringing up compiling has no bearing on PS Now being a service and not backwards compatibility. The workload for PS Now is done on the server end and without that you are unable to continue. For X1 once the title has been downloaded and your account given access you are able to download and play the game using the hardware independent of outside equipment.

PS Now has nothing to do with BC. It's merely a service offered on multiple platforms.

That's just a loose guess, I said that for margin of error, I'm sure it's actually higher because as I said internet is a near fundamental requirement for system and game operation.

1:179 people on Earth have HIV, you could parse a sample of people millions of times larger and not have a single person in this parsed group with HIV, it's completely flawed methodology for examination. As I said, the group they parsed could be at 1.5% usage, they could have got another group that was 25%, or 18%, or 0.5% etc.

Without knowing what the other 97% of the user base is doing this information is absolutely meaningless, 100% undeniably meaningless.

Damage control would imply there's some kind of damage being done, there is none.

See the above.

@gordonfreeman: Then why are you in damage control mode. See the above (as in everything you've posted thus far in this thread).

Try your bait elsewhere, I've drawn this discussion to conclusion.

How do you download x360 free games even of they are backward compatible they still impossible to dowload.

What?

@gordonfreeman: Point is, a report damaging to MS is published and posted here, and you show up trying to prove that said report is hogwash. And you're telling me that does not constitute damage control. Seriously, dude, you can't possibly truly believe that.

A. I have already factually shown that it's not damaging as it's flawed methodology.

B. I didn't try to prove that anything is hogwash, I proved that it's flawed methodology, something I shouldn't have had to do in the first place as it's expressly inherent in the fact that it only accounts for a random 3% of the userbase.

C. Damage control is taking place in zero capacity, you're actually trying to incite damage by contextually warping a 3 percentile of data and dishonestly inferring that it applies to the remaining 97 percentile.

This is you.

Your posts are a complete waste of storage space on this site, internet archiving and in general are wasting bandwidth that could be better spent on actually posting something of value.

If you have Red Dead Redemption, for example, you just put the disc in.

The game will tell you that an update is available (like a patch).

That "patch" is the full game download.

You download the game and play just like any other game on Xbox One

@gordonfreeman: Says he's not damage controlling; proceeds, once again, to provide an argument as to why a published report damaging to MS is false. Or, sorry, "flawed",

Again, you cannot possibly believe yourself.

@gordonfreeman:

I can donwload xbox one ganes easy

while free with gold x360 games dont have the option always redirect to payment option

Lol, that cow denial