Battlefield something or another - woman empowerment

I see. so Subnautica having a female lead for their next DLC is fine?

because a lot of people are upset about that too, or the next GTA having a female lead? yup male internet exploded on that one too

No you can teach your daughter how you like, it isn't my place to dictate that to others. I just don't agree with what your saying, different parenting style I guess. I would rather my kids played with Lego and build cools stuff more than video games tbh.

I think my answer is more correct.

I'm not on a "side" I can represent myself thanks.

@tryit I would suggest that you allow your daughter to play any game within her age bracket that she wishes to play with the caveat of explaining the difference between real life violence and ficitonall... which 99% of kids already know.... its a lottery if you actually get a kid that would be affected by such things.

If you are applying different standards to your daughter, then you are part of the problem you claim others are apart of.

Subnautica and GTA drama? you mean drama like on this shitty forum where we argue about the stupidist things possible? The internet forums are for mindless venting of which we are all guilty.

They do not represent many people do they? statistically out of the millions that buy a game.

Those are both fictional games, not representing historical events based on franchises that always did that.... and there are female criminals .... always have been.

Meanwhile there wern't Black Jewish Nazies, or WW2 battlefields full of woman.... you are ignoring the key differences here.

I agree, the conversation about why most women are too meek and unable to stand up for themselves is definitely a conversation for later.

so refrain from calling it a SJW its hardly remotely that

I don't see anything wrong with either of those tbh. Genre's and games seem quite suitable for both.

Let's label it whatever is least annoying to both of us then. If I say SJW don't take it as an attack, it's just what I have in my vocabulary at the time.

I didnt say I would forbid her, I said I would encourage her.

its very obvious that you are just hunting for a reason one you think can fit. its painfully obvious.

a lot of men loose their minds over subnautica, over GTA...hell even a woman just saying that there are more male leads then female by a large margin.

YOu just feel this reason fits nicely, only it doesnt.

games are not historically accurate, BF is not nor never had been historically accurate.

Indeed, there is no one way to do this.

For example I would be the opposite.

I will encourage my kids to play games, I will encourage the playing of PC games too and introduce games like Minecraft because lets be honest, its lego on steroids and has more legs for a fraction of the cost.

From there, I would make simple programming exercises or "games" that are being offered to spark something witha rasberry pi for example.... I'd make sure they see how cool modded minecraft is and get use to modding it themselves (understanding Windows file structure, file types etc).

In my mind, that leads to a potential interest and career in I.T , I wouldn't discount Video Games as a good way to do things... I'd rather my kids be playing a video game where they develop reflexes and problem solving skills over TV or toys for example.

Yeah, rasberry pi and arduino's are awesome. I remember building a tesla coil with my dad, good fun.

Are our answers supposed to be the same?

I guess I normally don't play for pure historically reasons either, but I do like games trying to be realistic/ish, when they're set in a realistic framework. Not jumping out of second story windows into a combat roll while shooting a plane out of the sky with a rifle in the middle of melee battle. But to be fair, I'm still not sure we've actually seen any gameplay, so this is all talk about a useless trailer.

Exactly, functional accuracy. BF might not be a sim, but it does have a foot in the functional accuracy pond. You've seen the trailer, correct? Does that trailer make you think, "Oh, yeah, my grandpa (or grandma) totally did that?". Maybe I'm wrong, but I would say no, at least for my part. I want to be in a bombed out building, waiting to take my shot, while listening to make sure someone isn't coming up behind me. I want to feel (to a degree) like I'm there. And if I see Cap-Tina Hook come summer-salting by and guzzling a Powerade...I might lose some of that immersion.

What claim are you talking about?

Ah, so you were just strawmanning me again for the n-th time.

Which means nothing of value was lost.

@kali-b1rd: so, no data then? Lol, as usual, you being the worse pathetic user of this board taking things from your ass and unable to prove them.

Lol, owned by yourself again.

only if I get to call you an unrealistic SJW for having a problem with a female lead as an option in a game for all, then you throw your SJW card all you want and what I say I would teach my childern

I dont give a fu*ck.

lets focus on the conversation, not the side conversation over me thinking there is too much violence in video games and too much stereotypical aggressive focused on roles for men.

that is a DIFFERENT conversation

Attention

Deficit

Disorder

when the completely and totally CONTRADICT each other then yeah.

one is saying that is GOOD to have female role in this game BUT.....bla bla bla

while the other is saying its NOT GOOD to have a female role in this game.

so yeah....fix it

You brought your daughter in as an example.

You have provided no proof that there is anything close to equality in terms of male to female ratios in these games.

This entire thread is f*cking pointless as it is.

Some people are miffed franchises that tried to be somewhat as "Authentic" in THEME as possible are now going full DISNEY, some are not. there is no debate to be had. Just virtue signalling and white knighting and overdramatising critisms.

you are all over the map.

what is it you want me to prove that is related to having female leads in games and specifically BF?

BF has never been historically accurate nor should it be.

Is a whole topic necessary a female character model is wonderful but it's not worth a whole topic. If anything female options should be the norm that way people will stop raising a stink about it

ITT tryit looks like a fool.

You and Recloud say "I dont think there is a gap in these games anymore" ... pulling it out of nowhere with no evidence whatsoever.

The themes have been, as was earlier call of duty, but you are probably putting some crazy-high expectations on there just to win a arguement, or mixing game mechanics with theme to try and butcher my arguement. Yea.. I know people didn't do dougnut 360 no scopes out of planes and jump back in. But generally speaking most of the Themes remained solid.

Again, you can't counter-argue against "Jewish Female Black Nazis" in a WW2 game, none of you have had a decent response to that.

No evidence, no nothing.

Everytime a thread like this is brought up there is:

80% - Virtue Signaling instantly defending whatever "non white male" is supposedly being attacked (which is not true in this case at all). Screaming louder than any of the actual critism going on.

15% - People pointing out that forced equality of outcome and cencorship of certain things that "may or may not be offensive" (E.G ... HISTORICAL NAZI SYMBOL) is another form of cencorship outside of rationallity.

5% - Actually hating the [supposed minority] that started the arguement.

This is pointless.

Don’t have time to read but I hate revisionist history.

First CoD pretends Nazis never existed in WW2 and now Battlefield pretends 50,000 women stormed the beaches of Normandy. Just LOL. Whatever.

1. by 'gap' I assume you mean between men and women and no I did NOT say that. I said, three times

i

dont

know

what

the

numbers

are

now

so you just wasted a lot of words on nothing.

so which reason are you on right now? historical or consumer demographics? it keeps flipping

besides its the next response would just be 'well women dont play because there arent that many games targeted to them with a female lead' so dont trap yourself

Its flat out cencorship, people who virtue signal and pat themselves on the back for the last 10 years of politically correct cencorship get moral good feelings off distorting history.

We shouldn't be hiding things like NAZISM in our media that represents those times.... just because of a few rust belt american twats worship a fake version. History needs to be remembered and presented on how it was.

In games, in movies, in books. Make up stories sure? have that "MULAN" moment where a woman is in the role of a soldier (somehow) and saves the day? great...

But yea, no Nazis, Black Jewish Germans and woman storming the beaches....

forces revisionism, propping up one gender in something they hadn't earned at the time.

Nobody is complaining about woman in modern shooters though... because it fits more.

Why not both?

That is not a trap..... that is just "yea but why not the opposite, because I want this to never end".

Computer Science, console games, pc games, were largely male dominant, the overall statistic evened out based on phone games and things like solitaire.

There are thousands of products/tv shows/media that cater to specific groups.

You can call me that if you like, names never hurt me any.

But I am not against a female lead in a game or for this game for that matter. Doesn't bother me one bit, I am just arguing the other point.

How about we just call it different parenting styles then.

oh for the love of Christ.

Do you know why I dont play AAA games? because they dont have any games that are of interest to me.

Do you think that maybe IF there are less women playing video games that it might because their isnt enough games with female leads (aka games they are not interested in)?

I have no idea if today there is more female gamers or not compared to the past but it I also know that it doesnt matter. If a developer wants to put in a female lead to attract more sales then FINE....do it

you need to stick to one reason and see that logic thru, not jump around because it makes it look like your are just fishing for a reason that will fit nicely and you havent found one yet

Is this a shot at me or the new conversation? Anyway, math is awesome, so electricity, guess that's why I made a profession out of it :D

I'm going to get smacked for this so i'll pre-wince *wince*.

BF was pretty historically accurate about the amount of men represented in the wars the game was themed after. Maybe not that future one though.

I really really really really really really really really do not want to talk about my parenting statement in this thread.

I will join you if you make a dedicated thread on the subject but the topic of conversation we have now is already too complex for most people to keep up on, lets not interject that.

Ok, no problem. Didn't mean to make it a topic of conversation man. Sorry.

none of that matters.

when a game developer makes a game they pick and choose various aspects of history, some things are historically accurate other things are not. They also can change what they pick if they choose.

and dont even try the 'yeah but most people play this game because of its historical accurate depiction of men in battle'

give it up...far to transparent. I was right the whole time, its just fury because of women lead in a video game and people looking for a reason that they can hammer into a square hole and hope it fits.

its lame and obvious

I'm actually in favor of the developers choice argument so no retort from me on that end.

I just didn't like how anyone who opposed it was automatically called a sexist, bigot or otherwise directly or indirectly in the thread.

That is not the developers/publishers fault.... that is the market, it is up to people who want this other content to come into the industry, same with introducing any new group into an industry, there are games with female leads, there are pleanty of games where you can choose a female avatar.... this issue is overblown beyond a joke.

I think there are many factors involved, that being but one segment. Just like in most faccettes of society where men and woman tend to have very different tastes in certain areas, and nothing is a bigger example than the job market. In countries where Equality of Outcome is at its highest, the stereotypical gneder-roles were even more prominant. So yea, I'm saying Woman may generally not be as interesting in violence and killing eachother competitivly or otherwise an "interesting" theme and will less likely buy in.

Nothing wrong with female leads, that was never the point, and there is no REAL shortage of them, given most games these days have avatars representing the player. Just don't expect fans of franchises that tried to be reasonable authentic get annoyed when re-visionism takes centre stage suddenly as a "sell out".

Why can't woman play as white men? it works both ways.... if a woman is playing a game that resembles WW2 and for example includes D-Day for example... how is not entitled sexism to demand 50% of the soldiers be woman and insult the fact that MEN had to fight that historic battle while Woman were safe at home? (Devils Advocate statement... just incase you overblow it.)

You can't handle 2 strings of a conversation at once? that is not my problem.

None of it matters to you, you only care because the situation is in the direction you want. if it was the other way around it would "matter".

well get over it.

because the issue is beyond amazingly ridiculous and not worth defending.

I wouldnt want to be caught 20 miles from that radioactive shit pile of logic

so what you are saying is that if a developers says 'you know there is a large section of possible gamers out there we could try to pull them in'

they should not do that because of some asinine SJW moralist theory about pandering?

If AAA developers want to sell more games to possible players who like building games there is nothing wrong with AAA companies making games with building in them.

your logic seems to suggest that they should not.

this is beyond ridiculous.

let the developer put in a female lead into a game if they want to REGARDLESS of the reason

Don't worry, I was never under it. I am just arguing a point.

It's worth defending if people are getting unscrupulous tarred for opinions that aren't sexist or bigoted.

you either need to A. consider your battles and what side you wish to defend more carefully or B. be more honest.

The problem here is that it's being made by EA. I don't trust EA.

I'm trying to be as honest as I can be. I'm not interested in picking battles just so I can "win" an internet medal, as it is nobody wins a discussion on the internet anyway. Everyone can just dig their heels in and that's that. Stalemate as both sides won't budge.

But honest, I try to be honest as much as I can.

Ofcourse, every product should be mass-market instead of trying to create something authentic.

I represented the arguement on the other side, and yes, alot of this is inclusion for the sake of inclusion, despite representing history in some form or another.

But ok TRYIT - **** it, lets do it your way. The next ROME TOTAL WAR should have Japanese Ninjas and Samurai in thier armies.

The Next Medevil Total War - should have the battle for britain where every token race and gender is in the same army, fighting an army, with every other token race/gender that was clearly not present.

Because its a game, because it can sell more...

I'l go knock on Tom Hanks door and say "sorry, your film was intense and a clear representation of the struggles of men in these dark days, but I'm going to "Remaster" the film, and it will now be called Saving Private Rebecca and Captain Samantha Miller starred by Amanda Tapping will bring in more tickets at the box office!" Since its "just a movie"

Hell, why not go onto the history channel and re-write the tale of the British vs the Zulu's , chuck some woman , some asians, some canadians in there, maybe include the hulk, why not? "Its just a movie"

This logic is boring.

The choice is the developers, nobody is saying otherwise, but people are free to critiscise and I can totally see why it is selling out.

yeah you pick the sides you feel is more appropriate.

which is why you are not getting any cookies points from me, I know better.

nope..

stopped reading right there.

your logic is that developers should not make changes to a game with the thought in mind that it can bring in new customers.

nobody said anything about 'mass-market'. or 'authentic' which are not mutually exclusive statements in the first place.

try again.

Dang, I heard you make pretty good cookies too.

Up to 13 pages of people crying about girls in Battlefield. You people need some real world problems to deal with.

whoa, never ending circle of logic.

I state my side of the fence, your moronic "so what you are saying" interpretation is yours and only yours.

I'm done, the 4 sentence is just laughable because in this very scenario... its absolutely is mutally exclusive, well, at least expanding the market to these demographics as you claim by shoe horning them into fake history.

terrible.... just digging your heels in for the sake of it now.

And really, lets be honest, you didn't stop reading, you just had no valid retort to the logic presented.

1. I am not suggesting they target mass marke, but if they want to sure, if they dont, that is cool too.

2. something can be authentic or not authentic and can be mass market or not mass market so the two do not relate to each other.

3. Developers should be allowed to have a woman lead AS A FRIGGIN OPTION!!!!!!!!!! if they want to, regardless of the reason. And you should put your SJW away and not pry into the why and just let them do it

4. and like I said in the outset (i think to you) the more your side pushes, the more developers will do this. because the optics on it from people on my side makes it look unbelievable ridiculous and makes people like me inclined to buy the game just to stick to people who have a problem with it

In regards to 4, i'm sure it's the same on the other side of the fence.

It's like offensive jokes, they are the BEST! the more someone is politically correct the better the reaction. It's awesome!