Console players should love PC game mods too.

[QUOTE="menes777"]

[QUOTE="Chris_Williams"]

i wanna play the game the way the devs made it, if i'm missing out on some really cool mods, oh well

Chris_Williams

Actually you're playing the game the way that publishers managed to squeeze into X time frame on X budget. If games were made the way the devs wanted to make them, they would be vastly different. Some would be better, some worse. The end result though is what could be done with the resources that the publisher wanted to and could afford to spend on it.

That's perfectly ok. :) Still doesn't change the fact that Mods have an impact on game development. Actually many developers started as modders and the ones that didn't had to do some form of game developing prior to getting their "big break". You can't build games using consoles alone, you have to learn on the PC.

The part after the smiley was to continue the OP, wasn't directed just to you. :)

[QUOTE="menes777"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]The real-time strategy genre was created by modders? Now this is getting silly.

KC_Hokie

What?? No, you are being silly. Warcraft III is the RTS. DOTA is the genre that has come from it. It even has it's own game now, DOTA2. And no DOTA isn't a genre, it's just a name, but the gameplay type is a genre.

LOL Ok, I see you aren't being serious at this point. Either you don't understand what genre means or you just don't care.

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="menes777"]

What?? No, you are being silly. Warcraft III is the RTS. DOTA is the genre that has come from it. It even has it's own game now, DOTA2. And no DOTA isn't a genre, it's just a name, but the gameplay type is a genre.

menes777

LOL Ok, I see you aren't being serious at this point. Either you don't understand what genre means or you just don't care.

[QUOTE="menes777"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]DOTA isn't a genre. Neither is Starcraft or Warcraft III.KC_Hokie

LOL Ok, I see you aren't being serious at this point. Either you don't understand what genre means or you just don't care.

Actually I was wrong DOTA is the genre name.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dota_(genre)

It's also called ARTS and MOBA too. That's funny it's a genre and the name of a game as well. Imagine a game called First Person Shooter! :lol:

[QUOTE="menes777"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]DOTA isn't a genre. Neither is Starcraft or Warcraft III.KC_Hokie

LOL Ok, I see you aren't being serious at this point. Either you don't understand what genre means or you just don't care.

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="menes777"]

LOL Ok, I see you aren't being serious at this point. Either you don't understand what genre means or you just don't care.

menes777

Actually I was wrong DOTA is the genre name.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dota_(genre)

It's also called ARTS and MOBA too.

Again, modders wanted to create a new genre or whatever but they actually ended up with a RTS so they then said 'aahhh.....it's a subgenre'.

If you put lipstick on a pig...it's still a pig.

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="menes777"]

LOL Ok, I see you aren't being serious at this point. Either you don't understand what genre means or you just don't care.

siLVURcross

He's right, modders aren't declaring anything.

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="menes777"]

LOL Ok, I see you aren't being serious at this point. Either you don't understand what genre means or you just don't care.

siLVURcross

Again, you can put lipstick on a pig but it's till a pig.

[QUOTE="siLVURcross"][QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Just because modders declared they created a sub-genre of RTS genre doesn't mean RTS were all of sudden created by modders. It's a silly argument. menes777

He's right, modders aren't declaring anything.

[QUOTE="menes777"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Just because modders declared they created a sub-genre of RTS genre doesn't mean RTS were all of sudden created by modders. It's a silly argument. KC_Hokie

Actually I was wrong DOTA is the genre name.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dota_(genre)

It's also called ARTS and MOBA too.

Again, modders wanted to create a new genre or whatever but they actually ended up with a RTS so they then said 'aahhh.....it's a subgenre'.

If you put lipstick on a pig...it's still a pig.

By that logic, Call of Duty and Contra are the same genre. One is a shooter, the other is a first person shooter! So they are both shooters! Yet when you compare them side by side they play nothing alike and have very different elements and gameplay types. And since when has anyone defined a FPS as a subgenre of shooters? That's what defines a genre is that something distinguishes it enough to consider it different. It might have the same root name, but it's still different. Tower defense games are essentially RTS games with a limited scope, but they are not referred to as TDRTS (Tower Defense RTS) or DBRTS (Defenseive Buildings RTS) games are they? Someone could even twist semantics and use that logic to say nothing much has evolved beyond pong because they are all still games!

One of the main reasons I game on PC are mods. Some of my favourite games ever began as mods: Red Orchestra, Day of Defeat, Left 4 Dead.

Who said they didn't? They don't hate it, they just want them on consoles too.

SPYDER0416

I've seen people on SW going: 'I don't like mods. I want to play my game like the developer intended':roll:

So mods like Nehrim for Oblivion (which is practically an entire game itself), all the modded maps in L4D such as "I Hate Mountains" and the Indiana Jones Adventure ride (A Disneyland map), and mods like STALKER Complete are just gimmicks like cheat codes?SW__Troll

Don't even try to talk to him. From what I have seen in his posts, he will not like anything PC gaming related. Mods can be much more than GTA cheats, for example, the ones I have already listed that have become full on features marketed by the publisher of the sequels. Something like 'gun game' in CoD:BOs was based on a mod in CS. Mods are like DLC but often better and always cheaper (since they're free). Mods are also a great way for people to get into the industry. Just look at the group that made Portal.

Mods coming years after i have finished a game 10 times, is not really the most appealing thing to me, in fact i have never used any besides the Heroes 3 huge mod, that added like a whole new game in there in one go, that was a great one i have to admit

loosingENDS

Years??? Mods are out for games within a week. Mods that fix glitches and bugs are generally out within 24 hours. The really big mods that are total conversion mods or mass graphical overhaul do take time. But you will have new weapons, features, modes, items, quests/missions/story, vehicles, etc within a week.

One of the main reasons I game on PC are mods. Some of my favourite games ever began as mods: Red Orchestra, Day of Defeat, Left 4 Dead.

[QUOTE="SPYDER0416"]

Who said they didn't? They don't hate it, they just want them on consoles too.

R4gn4r0k

I've seen people on SW going: 'I don't like mods. I want to play my game like the developer intended':roll:

Again, I love RO and DoD but left them out because of their PC exclusivity.

And yes, people on SW all the time give hatred and reasons against mods. In this thread alone, the 'I don't like mods. I want to play my game like the developer intended' reason has already been given.

One of the main reasons I game on PC are mods. Some of my favourite games ever began as mods: Red Orchestra, Day of Defeat, Left 4 Dead.

[QUOTE="SPYDER0416"]

Who said they didn't? They don't hate it, they just want them on consoles too.

R4gn4r0k

I've seen people on SW going: 'I don't like mods. I want to play my game like the developer intended':roll:

[QUOTE="menes777"]

[QUOTE="siLVURcross"] Pretty sure modders didn't declare anything. It just got popular enough to be it's own sub-genre.KC_Hokie

He's right, modders aren't declaring anything.

No the flying spaghetti monster! A subgenre of the spaghetti monsters! LOL

Sorry I don't know who would define a genre. I think it's like anything else. Someone uses the phrase sometime, somewhere and then everyone else picks up on it. I don't think any entity besides maybe a one that didn't intend to defined RTS as to what we know it now. People even still argue what that genre really is. Does it include base building, does it not? Does it include resource gathering or not? There is no ten commandments written in stone anywhere on what a genre should and should not be and please quote where a modder declared something as a genre. I even challenge you to show me who coined the genre RTS! I doubt Westwood did despite making it popular.

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

[QUOTE="menes777"]

Actually I was wrong DOTA is the genre name.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dota_(genre)

It's also called ARTS and MOBA too.

menes777

Again, modders wanted to create a new genre or whatever but they actually ended up with a RTS so they then said 'aahhh.....it's a subgenre'.

If you put lipstick on a pig...it's still a pig.

By that logic, Call of Duty and Contra are the same genre. One is a shooter, the other is a first person shooter! So they are both shooters! Yet when you compare them side by side they play nothing alike and have very different elements and gameplay types. And since when has anyone defined a FPS as a subgenre of shooters? That's what defines a genre is that something distinguishes it enough to consider it different. It might have the same root name, but it's still different. Tower defense games are essentially RTS games with a limited scope, but they are not referred to as TDRTS (Tower Defense RTS) or DBRTS (Defenseive Buildings RTS) games are they? Someone could even twist semantics and use that logic to say nothing much has evolved beyond pong because they are all still games!

However, StarCraft 2, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Company of Heroes AND DOTA are all RTS games.

Whatever, this thread is getting silly and I couldn't disagree with the OP any more.

[QUOTE="R4gn4r0k"]

One of the main reasons I game on PC are mods. Some of my favourite games ever began as mods: Red Orchestra, Day of Defeat, Left 4 Dead.

[QUOTE="SPYDER0416"]

Who said they didn't? They don't hate it, they just want them on consoles too.

arto1223

I've seen people on SW going: 'I don't like mods. I want to play my game like the developer intended':roll:

Again, I love RO and DoD but left them out because of their PC exclusivity.

And yes, people on SW all the time give hatred and reasons against mods. In this thread alone, the 'I don't like mods. I want to play my game like the developer intended' reason has already been given.

[QUOTE="R4gn4r0k"]

One of the main reasons I game on PC are mods. Some of my favourite games ever began as mods: Red Orchestra, Day of Defeat, Left 4 Dead.

[QUOTE="SPYDER0416"]

Who said they didn't? They don't hate it, they just want them on consoles too.

Chris_Williams

I've seen people on SW going: 'I don't like mods. I want to play my game like the developer intended':roll:

The real frustration behind your comment is that it's OT. It's like starting a topic about how milk is good for the body and you post a topic that you don't prefer milk. That's fine, we get it, but it's not really relevant to the topic at hand it's one of those typical consolite remarks because they don't have anything better to rebut with.

[QUOTE="menes777"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Yea, ARTS is just RTS with an A in front of it. lol!

Again, modders wanted to create a new genre or whatever but they actually ended up with a RTS so they then said 'aahhh.....it's a subgenre'.

If you put lipstick on a pig...it's still a pig.

KC_Hokie

By that logic, Call of Duty and Contra are the same genre. One is a shooter, the other is a first person shooter! So they are both shooters! Yet when you compare them side by side they play nothing alike and have very different elements and gameplay types. And since when has anyone defined a FPS as a subgenre of shooters? That's what defines a genre is that something distinguishes it enough to consider it different. It might have the same root name, but it's still different. Tower defense games are essentially RTS games with a limited scope, but they are not referred to as TDRTS (Tower Defense RTS) or DBRTS (Defenseive Buildings RTS) games are they? Someone could even twist semantics and use that logic to say nothing much has evolved beyond pong because they are all still games!

However, StarCraft 2, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Company of Heroes AND DOTA are all RTS games.

Whatever, this thread is getting silly and I couldn't disagree with the OP any more.

Why is it getting silly?.Is that your running out of things to argue with?

It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.EvanTheGamer

[QUOTE="arto1223"]

[QUOTE="R4gn4r0k"]

I've seen people on SW going: 'I don't like mods. I want to play my game like the developer intended':roll:

Chris_Williams

Again, I love RO and DoD but left them out because of their PC exclusivity.

And yes, people on SW all the time give hatred and reasons against mods. In this thread alone, the 'I don't like mods. I want to play my game like the developer intended' reason has already been given.

[QUOTE="menes777"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Yea, ARTS is just RTS with an A in front of it. lol!

Again, modders wanted to create a new genre or whatever but they actually ended up with a RTS so they then said 'aahhh.....it's a subgenre'.

If you put lipstick on a pig...it's still a pig.

KC_Hokie

By that logic, Call of Duty and Contra are the same genre. One is a shooter, the other is a first person shooter! So they are both shooters! Yet when you compare them side by side they play nothing alike and have very different elements and gameplay types. And since when has anyone defined a FPS as a subgenre of shooters? That's what defines a genre is that something distinguishes it enough to consider it different. It might have the same root name, but it's still different. Tower defense games are essentially RTS games with a limited scope, but they are not referred to as TDRTS (Tower Defense RTS) or DBRTS (Defenseive Buildings RTS) games are they? Someone could even twist semantics and use that logic to say nothing much has evolved beyond pong because they are all still games!

However, StarCraft 2, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Company of Heroes AND DOTA are all RTS games.

Whatever, this thread is getting silly and I couldn't disagree with the OP any more.

Contra is a shooter, always will be. That's ok, we know you don't like mods.

yes, i'm that guy, is that a problem? if mods came to consoles cool but i still wouldn't care... then again i have a decent pc so if i wanted to game with mods i very well could its just i don't care for them, i don't understand why thats a hard thing to understand here.Chris_Williams

Mods are just one word to describe lots of things:

There are small mods that add more features to the game exanding on the original game (oblivion has a lot of those).

There are graphic mods that up the graphic fidelity of a game by a great amount (cinematic mod, ENB series, STALKER complete, crysis mods)

There are custom maps that sometimes offer a completely new genre within a game (Tower defense, DOTA for Warcraft 3) or again expand upon the game (L4D has what ? 5 maps ? Custom maps add dozens of hours upon that)

Than there are the Total Conversions, my favourite, that offer a complete game (for free !) for a game you already bought (As I said: Day of Defeat, Counter-Strike, Red Orchestra, Desert Combat, Firerarms, and lots & lots more)

Why don't you like mods ?

and there you guys throwing around the hate word, i don't hate mods, i don't dislike mods, i think mods are amazing and what the community does with them are crazy, i just like playing games the way they were made, i know i'm probably missing out on some amazing mods but i understand that and i'm alright with that. so i don't hate mods or have anything against them, mods are legit i'm just whatever about them. Chris_Williams

Sorry than I misread. Because I quoted 'I don't like mods' because someone actually said that don't know who.

And than you replied: I'm that guy

Call of Duty is a first person shooter. Contra is a side scrolling action game. Big difference.

However, StarCraft 2, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Company of Heroes AND DOTA are all RTS games.

Whatever, this thread is getting silly and I couldn't disagree with the OP any more.

KC_Hokie

Semantics I guess.

Shooters are a genre. FPS, TPS, side scrolling shooters are subgenres.

Strategy is a genre. RTS, TBS, 4X, RTT and DOTA are subgenres.

[QUOTE="menes777"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Yea, ARTS is just RTS with an A in front of it. lol!

Again, modders wanted to create a new genre or whatever but they actually ended up with a RTS so they then said 'aahhh.....it's a subgenre'.

If you put lipstick on a pig...it's still a pig.

KC_Hokie

By that logic, Call of Duty and Contra are the same genre. One is a shooter, the other is a first person shooter! So they are both shooters! Yet when you compare them side by side they play nothing alike and have very different elements and gameplay types. And since when has anyone defined a FPS as a subgenre of shooters? That's what defines a genre is that something distinguishes it enough to consider it different. It might have the same root name, but it's still different. Tower defense games are essentially RTS games with a limited scope, but they are not referred to as TDRTS (Tower Defense RTS) or DBRTS (Defenseive Buildings RTS) games are they? Someone could even twist semantics and use that logic to say nothing much has evolved beyond pong because they are all still games!

However, StarCraft 2, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Company of Heroes AND DOTA are all RTS games.

Whatever, this thread is getting silly and I couldn't disagree with the OP any more.

DOTA ISNT AN RTS GAME

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

Call of Duty is a first person shooter. Contra is a side scrolling action game. Big difference.

However, StarCraft 2, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Company of Heroes AND DOTA are all RTS games.

Whatever, this thread is getting silly and I couldn't disagree with the OP any more.

R4gn4r0k

Semantics I guess.

Shooters are a genre. FPS, TPS, side scrolling shooters are subgenres.

Strategy is a genre. RTS, TBS, 4X, RTT and DOTA are subgenres.

That's why I said the argument was getting silly. And who decided it was a subgenre of a subgenre...modders. Why? Because it's a popular game.

So it's a subgenre of a subgenre because modders like it. And that's why mods are so important....or something.

It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.EvanTheGamer

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

[QUOTE="menes777"]

By that logic, Call of Duty and Contra are the same genre. One is a shooter, the other is a first person shooter! So they are both shooters! Yet when you compare them side by side they play nothing alike and have very different elements and gameplay types. And since when has anyone defined a FPS as a subgenre of shooters? That's what defines a genre is that something distinguishes it enough to consider it different. It might have the same root name, but it's still different. Tower defense games are essentially RTS games with a limited scope, but they are not referred to as TDRTS (Tower Defense RTS) or DBRTS (Defenseive Buildings RTS) games are they? Someone could even twist semantics and use that logic to say nothing much has evolved beyond pong because they are all still games!

cobrax55

However, StarCraft 2, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Company of Heroes AND DOTA are all RTS games.

Whatever, this thread is getting silly and I couldn't disagree with the OP any more.

DOTA ISNT AN RTS GAME

[QUOTE="EvanTheGamer"]It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.Kevz0

[QUOTE="cobrax55"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Call of Duty is a first person shooter. Contra is a side scrolling action game. Big difference.

However, StarCraft 2, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Company of Heroes AND DOTA are all RTS games.

Whatever, this thread is getting silly and I couldn't disagree with the OP any more.

KC_Hokie

DOTA ISNT AN RTS GAME

Except its not, you have no idea what your talking about as per usual. How many RTS's have you seen where you only control one unit.....? Dota has more in common with a game like Diablo then with RTS's.

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="cobrax55"]

DOTA ISNT AN RTS GAME

cobrax55

Except its not, you have no idea what your talking about as per usual. How many RTS's have you seen where you only control one unit.....? Dota has more in common with a game like Diablo then with RTS's.

pc gamers are always getting so defensive if someone doesn't agree with their views, some people love mods and some people don't or others aren't even aware of mods. Who cares

I agree with him and have downloaded plenty of mods over the years. You can spend weeks finding a decent one worth playing. KC_Hokie

Ever heard of Moddb ?

pc gamers are always getting so defensive if someone doesn't agree with their views, some people love mods and some people don't or others aren't even aware of mods. Who cares

Chris_Williams

You never answered my question:

Why don't you like mods ?

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]I agree with him and have downloaded plenty of mods over the years. You can spend weeks finding a decent one worth playing. R4gn4r0k

Ever heard of Moddb ?

pc gamers are always getting so defensive if someone doesn't agree with their views, some people love mods and some people don't or others aren't even aware of mods. Who cares

Chris_Williams

You never answered my question:

Why don't you like mods ?

i'm not answering your question because i never said i didn't like mods.

[QUOTE="SW__Troll"]I can't recall a single instance of seeing a developer actually praise a modding team for help with their sequel (if their sequel borrows ideas from mods).KC_Hokie

More like a chance to praise PC mods than anything.

Oh I can give you plenty of examples. Just recently Bethesda praised the modding community for their work on Oblivion. Commenting how they felt the level scaling in Oblivion was a mistake, where a mod on PC version resolved it! Or the fact that the bow and arrow mod from Oblivion has made it's way into Skyrim?

This sounds very similar, goes something like this; When PC had online play and consoles didn't, all you heard was who needs online play hermit! When PC had 720p as standard and consoles were stuck in SD, all you heard was who needs HD, it's hardly any different! When consoles finally got HD (barely 720p) all you heard was HD GAMING FTW! Now that PC's have moved to 1080p and beyond, your getting the same argument as above. Wait until 1080p becomes standard on consoles ;) Same thing with mods, as soon as consoles get mods it will be the best thing ever!ducati101

It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.EvanTheGamer

[QUOTE="Kevz0"][QUOTE="EvanTheGamer"]It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.KC_Hokie

[QUOTE="cobrax55"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Yes it is...an ARTS to be specific. Again, a subgenre of a subgenre....supposedly. KC_Hokie

Except its not, you have no idea what your talking about as per usual. How many RTS's have you seen where you only control one unit.....? Dota has more in common with a game like Diablo then with RTS's.

It doesn't play like an RTS (as typically defined) at all. I'd argue Dota-like games are their own genre. Also, you're dismissing a genre that has a huge following and is nearing SC-level competitiveness?

[QUOTE="EvanTheGamer"]It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.ducati101

I love how console-only gamers dismiss mods, and then swarm to DLC. Mods are free DLC....

I think this discussion won't go anywhere, anyway. Of course console players know mods are awesome; they would love to have them, but since they can't, and would rather be skinned than have to recognize the PC any advantage, they pretend mods suck/are irrelevant.

Just an immature posture; you can be sure that some day, when consoles at last enter the 21st century and support mods, they'll claim ownage over PC gaming :lol:

milannoir

[QUOTE="EvanTheGamer"]It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.Kevz0

[QUOTE="ducati101"][QUOTE="EvanTheGamer"]It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.EvanTheGamer

[QUOTE="ducati101"][QUOTE="EvanTheGamer"]It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.EvanTheGamer

And only 1% of all games ever made are good. Your argument fails.

[QUOTE="milannoir"]

I love how console-only gamers dismiss mods, and then swarm to DLC. Mods are free DLC....

I think this discussion won't go anywhere, anyway. Of course console players know mods are awesome; they would love to have them, but since they can't, and would rather be skinned than have to recognize the PC any advantage, they pretend mods suck/are irrelevant.

Just an immature posture; you can be sure that some day, when consoles at last enter the 21st century and support mods, they'll claim ownage over PC gaming :lol:

lowe0