This topic is locked from further discussion.
how do you get them?[QUOTE="almasdeathchild"]
there are plenty of mods on consoles not as insanly hardcore as pc.but there was a few.i modded oblivion and morrowind way back when
sethman410
EDIT: lol we got the same sig.
like you use a usb drive and use a system called moddio and you take your account and put it on there and you can do wonders.look up videos i cant really explain it well[QUOTE="milannoir"][QUOTE="lowe0"] This is a shining example of elitism - assuming that people only hold the opinions they do because they can't have what you have (which is in and of itself ridiculous; if we wanted mods that much, wouldn't we just switch?).lowe0
Ah, yes elitism.:roll: The Godwin point of consolites.
And I suppose it was also elitism, when we enjoyed online and consoles didn't, and we laughed when console-only gamers dismissed online? :D
Oh, and obviously, we were also being elitist jerks, when we praised HD, when consoles didn't have it, and console-only gamers went "who cares about HD?". :lol:
No, and no. Quit trying to erect straw man arguments.Yes and yes. I've seen plenty of console only players defend those points over the years, with many more rushing to back them up. When in a few years' time consoles get mods and consolites claim ownage, will you claim what you just posted never happened? :P
No, and no. Quit trying to erect straw man arguments.[QUOTE="lowe0"][QUOTE="milannoir"]
Ah, yes elitism.:roll: The Godwin point of consolites.
And I suppose it was also elitism, when we enjoyed online and consoles didn't, and we laughed when console-only gamers dismissed online? :D
Oh, and obviously, we were also being elitist jerks, when we praised HD, when consoles didn't have it, and console-only gamers went "who cares about HD?". :lol:
milannoir
Yes and yes. I've seen plenty of console only players defend those points over the years, with many more rushing to back them up. When in a few years' time consoles get mods and consolites claim ownage, will you claim what you just posted never happened? :P
No, I won't. However, those things still won't be elitism. Elitism isn't bragging about your platform; it's the assumption that everyone would choose the same as you if given the opportunity. Attempting to cast ordinary bragging as elitism is simply a straw man argument; it's a diversion from answering the original argument (which, tellingly, you haven't).[QUOTE="milannoir"][QUOTE="lowe0"] No, and no. Quit trying to erect straw man arguments.lowe0
Yes and yes. I've seen plenty of console only players defend those points over the years, with many more rushing to back them up. When in a few years' time consoles get mods and consolites claim ownage, will you claim what you just posted never happened? :P
No, I won't. However, those things still won't be elitism. Elitism isn't bragging about your platform; it's the assumption that everyone would choose the same as you if given the opportunity. Attempting to cast ordinary bragging as elitism is simply a straw man argument; it's a diversion from answering the original argument (which, tellingly, you haven't).Ummm no. Elitism is saying that I am better than you because I have know how and have the skill to be a PC gamer. Trying to explain why your choice of entertainment has made everyone's overall experience better is not. Do you see the difference? One is promoting myself over you, the other is promoting my opinion (but not necessarily over yours). His examples were spot on by the way and were not straw men arguments. Straw men arguments are arguments that are completely silly that have no weight whatsoever and thus are just straw men. At one point in time consoles did not have online play and PC did. Consolites shrugged it off that it wasn't so hot and said things like "who wants to play with total strangers anyway?". At one point all consoles were SD and most PC's were HD. Consolites shrugged it off (probably because they didn't understand the term, also it wasnt called HD at the time) as another "Who cares?". Now that you have HD (or nearly HD) it's all you can talk about. The same will happen with Mods if they ever make it to console, which is doubtful because publishers want to force that DLC down your throat that you so readily open up to swallow. DLC does nothing to further the industry except line the pockets of publishers.
The point has been made over and over again. Console players benefit from mods that were originated on the PC platform. Those mods are only possible because the PC gives it's user base the freedom to create and do whatever it wants. Consoles do not, they only restrict and serve as a cash cow for whoever made them.
No, I won't. However, those things still won't be elitism. Elitism isn't bragging about your platform; it's the assumption that everyone would choose the same as you if given the opportunity. Attempting to cast ordinary bragging as elitism is simply a straw man argument; it's a diversion from answering the original argument (which, tellingly, you haven't).[QUOTE="lowe0"][QUOTE="milannoir"]
Yes and yes. I've seen plenty of console only players defend those points over the years, with many more rushing to back them up. When in a few years' time consoles get mods and consolites claim ownage, will you claim what you just posted never happened? :P
menes777
Ummm no. Elitism is saying that I am better than you because I have know how and have the skill to be a PC gamer. Trying to explain why your choice of entertainment has made everyone's overall experience better is not. Do you see the difference? One is promoting myself over you, the other is promoting my opinion (but not necessarily over yours). His examples were spot on by the way and were not straw men arguments. Straw men arguments are arguments that are completely silly that have no weight whatsoever and thus are just straw men. At one point in time consoles did not have online play and PC did. Consolites shrugged it off that it wasn't so hot and said things like "who wants to play with total strangers anyway?". At one point all consoles were SD and most PC's were HD. Consolites shrugged it off (probably because they didn't understand the term, also it wasnt called HD at the time) as another "Who cares?". Now that you have HD (or nearly HD) it's all you can talk about. The same will happen with Mods if they ever make it to console, which is doubtful because publishers want to force that DLC down your throat that you so readily open up to swallow. DLC does nothing to further the industry except line the pockets of publishers.
The point has been made over and over again. Console players benefit from mods that were originated on the PC platform. Those mods are only possible because the PC gives it's user base the freedom to create and do whatever it wants. Consoles do not, they only restrict and serve as a cash cow for whoever made them.
What do you think the logical conclusion of "everyone would choose the same as me if..." is? It's that they can't, due to whatever perceived inferiority they like (money, intelligence, whatever).And no, that's not the definition of a straw man argument. A straw man argument is where you form an intentionally weak argument and try to equate it to your opponent's argument, attempting to cast it as equally weak. There's really no excuse for not taking 30 seconds to look up the definition of "straw man" before posting, but since you apparently didn't, here it is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
[QUOTE="menes777"]
[QUOTE="lowe0"] No, I won't. However, those things still won't be elitism. Elitism isn't bragging about your platform; it's the assumption that everyone would choose the same as you if given the opportunity. Attempting to cast ordinary bragging as elitism is simply a straw man argument; it's a diversion from answering the original argument (which, tellingly, you haven't).lowe0
Ummm no. Elitism is saying that I am better than you because I have know how and have the skill to be a PC gamer. Trying to explain why your choice of entertainment has made everyone's overall experience better is not. Do you see the difference? One is promoting myself over you, the other is promoting my opinion (but not necessarily over yours). His examples were spot on by the way and were not straw men arguments. Straw men arguments are arguments that are completely silly that have no weight whatsoever and thus are just straw men. At one point in time consoles did not have online play and PC did. Consolites shrugged it off that it wasn't so hot and said things like "who wants to play with total strangers anyway?". At one point all consoles were SD and most PC's were HD. Consolites shrugged it off (probably because they didn't understand the term, also it wasnt called HD at the time) as another "Who cares?". Now that you have HD (or nearly HD) it's all you can talk about. The same will happen with Mods if they ever make it to console, which is doubtful because publishers want to force that DLC down your throat that you so readily open up to swallow. DLC does nothing to further the industry except line the pockets of publishers.
The point has been made over and over again. Console players benefit from mods that were originated on the PC platform. Those mods are only possible because the PC gives it's user base the freedom to create and do whatever it wants. Consoles do not, they only restrict and serve as a cash cow for whoever made them.
What do you think the logical conclusion of "everyone would choose the same as me if..." is? It's that they can't, due to whatever perceived inferiority they like (money, intelligence, whatever).And no, that's not the definition of a straw man argument. A straw man argument is where you form an intentionally weak argument and try to equate it to your opponent's argument, attempting to cast it as equally weak. There's really no excuse for not taking 30 seconds to look up the definition of "straw man" before posting, but since you apparently didn't, here it is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
I guess reading comprehension isn't your strong suite, because that's what I said. Also do you have any rebuttal besides that? Or are you just to the point of arguing semantics now? At one point consoles did not have online play and PC did, that is fact. Consoles played it down, not so much fact more heresay. But still a logical and reasonable statement that I am sure many others on this site can collaborate. At point consoles did not have HD and PC did (some may argue consoles still do not), that is fact. Consolites again play it down lik it's no big deal. Again still not a definite fact, but not within the realm of impossibility. Nothing weak about either argument. Both have basis in fact and both are reasonable and logical.
The real point here and the whole topic is have mods expanded gameplay? If you have proof or arguments showing they have not then show it. Otherwise you are just spouting off crap to avoid admitting the truth. Modders are not just programmers who do their work out of fun and not as a job. They also have a little more freedom because they aren't under the publishers prying eyes and can afford to take risks. And even if 9 out of 10 mods flop there is still so many modders and so many mods being created that it doesn't matter. It still has a significant and lasting impact on the industry that flows over even to the console side.
What do you think the logical conclusion of "everyone would choose the same as me if..." is? It's that they can't, due to whatever perceived inferiority they like (money, intelligence, whatever).[QUOTE="lowe0"]
[QUOTE="menes777"]
Ummm no. Elitism is saying that I am better than you because I have know how and have the skill to be a PC gamer. Trying to explain why your choice of entertainment has made everyone's overall experience better is not. Do you see the difference? One is promoting myself over you, the other is promoting my opinion (but not necessarily over yours). His examples were spot on by the way and were not straw men arguments. Straw men arguments are arguments that are completely silly that have no weight whatsoever and thus are just straw men. At one point in time consoles did not have online play and PC did. Consolites shrugged it off that it wasn't so hot and said things like "who wants to play with total strangers anyway?". At one point all consoles were SD and most PC's were HD. Consolites shrugged it off (probably because they didn't understand the term, also it wasnt called HD at the time) as another "Who cares?". Now that you have HD (or nearly HD) it's all you can talk about. The same will happen with Mods if they ever make it to console, which is doubtful because publishers want to force that DLC down your throat that you so readily open up to swallow. DLC does nothing to further the industry except line the pockets of publishers.
The point has been made over and over again. Console players benefit from mods that were originated on the PC platform. Those mods are only possible because the PC gives it's user base the freedom to create and do whatever it wants. Consoles do not, they only restrict and serve as a cash cow for whoever made them.
menes777
And no, that's not the definition of a straw man argument. A straw man argument is where you form an intentionally weak argument and try to equate it to your opponent's argument, attempting to cast it as equally weak. There's really no excuse for not taking 30 seconds to look up the definition of "straw man" before posting, but since you apparently didn't, here it is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
I guess reading comprehension isn't your strong suite, because that's what I said. Also do you have any rebuttal besides that? Or are you just to the point of arguing semantics now? At one point consoles did not have online play and PC did, that is fact. Consoles played it down, not so much fact more heresay. But still a logical and reasonable statement that I am sure many others on this site can collaborate. At point consoles did not have HD and PC did (some may argue consoles still do not), that is fact. Consolites again play it down lik it's no big deal. Again still not a definite fact, but not within the realm of impossibility. Nothing weak about either argument. Both have basis in fact and both are reasonable and logical.
The real point here and the whole topic is have mods expanded gameplay? If you have proof or arguments showing they have not then show it. Otherwise you are just spouting off crap to avoid admitting the truth. Modders are not just programmers who do their work out of fun and not as a job. They also have a little more freedom because they aren't under the publishers prying eyes and can afford to take risks. And even if 9 out of 10 mods flop there is still so many modders and so many mods being created that it doesn't matter. It still has a significant and lasting impact on the industry that flows over even to the console side.
None of which I said anything about. I attacked the elitist comment that we only have the opinions we do because we don't have mods. I really don't have an opinion on whether the gaming industry would have developed those features without mods.[QUOTE="menes777"][QUOTE="lowe0"] What do you think the logical conclusion of "everyone would choose the same as me if..." is? It's that they can't, due to whatever perceived inferiority they like (money, intelligence, whatever).
And no, that's not the definition of a straw man argument. A straw man argument is where you form an intentionally weak argument and try to equate it to your opponent's argument, attempting to cast it as equally weak. There's really no excuse for not taking 30 seconds to look up the definition of "straw man" before posting, but since you apparently didn't, here it is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
lowe0
I guess reading comprehension isn't your strong suite, because that's what I said. Also do you have any rebuttal besides that? Or are you just to the point of arguing semantics now? At one point consoles did not have online play and PC did, that is fact. Consoles played it down, not so much fact more heresay. But still a logical and reasonable statement that I am sure many others on this site can collaborate. At point consoles did not have HD and PC did (some may argue consoles still do not), that is fact. Consolites again play it down lik it's no big deal. Again still not a definite fact, but not within the realm of impossibility. Nothing weak about either argument. Both have basis in fact and both are reasonable and logical.
The real point here and the whole topic is have mods expanded gameplay? If you have proof or arguments showing they have not then show it. Otherwise you are just spouting off crap to avoid admitting the truth. Modders are not just programmers who do their work out of fun and not as a job. They also have a little more freedom because they aren't under the publishers prying eyes and can afford to take risks. And even if 9 out of 10 mods flop there is still so many modders and so many mods being created that it doesn't matter. It still has a significant and lasting impact on the industry that flows over even to the console side.
None of which I said anything about. I attacked the elitist comment that we only have the opinions we do because we don't have mods. I really don't have an opinion on whether the gaming industry would have developed those features without mods.The elitist comment is based on perfectly valid and comparable examples from the near past (online + HD). Do you claim that the majority of 360 and PS3 gamers dismiss online gaming and HD as irrelevant today? Do you deny that prior to this gen, every time a PC gamer praised online or HD the consolites would rush in to scream that HD was useless, and online brought nothing? I was there, I saw them do it.
Sorry if the analogy hurt your feelings, but it's perfectly valid since we're facing the exact same situation : console gamers dismissing a feature that takes nothing away, but adds real value to a game, just because they don't have it on their platforms.
Actually, I can prove it with facts : console gamers love mods when they can have them; in fact they're even ready to pay for them: it's called DLC and they buy craploads of it.
Oh, and before you try the desperate "DLC is not like mods" card, you're right. Mods are better : more choice, and free. And the other desperate argument "99% of mods are trash that will make your PC BSOD" is pathetic too : even the ultimate idiot is capable of typing "best mod for [insert game name here]" in Google. I always do this, and get a short list of the very best mods for my games.
None of which I said anything about. I attacked the elitist comment that we only have the opinions we do because we don't have mods. I really don't have an opinion on whether the gaming industry would have developed those features without mods.[QUOTE="lowe0"][QUOTE="menes777"]
I guess reading comprehension isn't your strong suite, because that's what I said. Also do you have any rebuttal besides that? Or are you just to the point of arguing semantics now? At one point consoles did not have online play and PC did, that is fact. Consoles played it down, not so much fact more heresay. But still a logical and reasonable statement that I am sure many others on this site can collaborate. At point consoles did not have HD and PC did (some may argue consoles still do not), that is fact. Consolites again play it down lik it's no big deal. Again still not a definite fact, but not within the realm of impossibility. Nothing weak about either argument. Both have basis in fact and both are reasonable and logical.
The real point here and the whole topic is have mods expanded gameplay? If you have proof or arguments showing they have not then show it. Otherwise you are just spouting off crap to avoid admitting the truth. Modders are not just programmers who do their work out of fun and not as a job. They also have a little more freedom because they aren't under the publishers prying eyes and can afford to take risks. And even if 9 out of 10 mods flop there is still so many modders and so many mods being created that it doesn't matter. It still has a significant and lasting impact on the industry that flows over even to the console side.
milannoir
The elitist comment is based on perfectly valid and comparable examples from the near past (online + HD). Do you claim that the majority of 360 and PS3 gamers dismiss online gaming and HD as irrelevant today? Do you deny that prior to this gen, every time a PC gamer praised online or HD the consolites would rush in to scream that HD was useless, and online brought nothing? I was there, I saw them do it.
Sorry if the analogy hurt your feelings, but it's perfectly valid since we're facing the exact same situation : console gamers dismissing a feature that takes nothing away, but adds real value to a game, just because they don't have it on their platforms.
Actually, I can prove it with facts : console gamers love mods when they can have them; in fact they're even ready to pay for them: it's called DLC and they buy craploads of it.
Oh, and before you try the desperate "DLC is not like mods" card, you're right. Mods are better : more choice, and free. And the other desperate argument "99% of mods are trash that will make your PC BSOD" is pathetic too : even the ultimate idiot is capable of typing "best mod for [insert game name here]" in Google. I always do this, and get a short list of the very best mods for my games.
You really think the reason I don't like mods is because they're not on consoles?[QUOTE="ZombieKiller7"]
The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.
Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.
The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."
After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.
arto1223
STOP TALKING ABOUT PLAYING MODS WHEN THEY ARE STILL MODS! Sorry for use of caps but I feel like some of these people are simply trying not to read what I have been saying.
In CoD: MW1 for the PC, mods were released that added in the pilotable AC-130 as a killstreak, a player controlled, off-site rocket, and a carpet bomb version of the airstrike. Each of these had their own kill count required. Then, in MW2, the PS3, 360 and PC versions had these three killstreaks as actual features of the game. Many other MW1 PC mods like dual-wielding, upgradable perks, and others were added as features to MW2 as well. Gamers who played MW2 were indirectly effected by those MW1 PC mods, whether you played MW1 or not and whether you play on consoles or PC.
This is what my thread is about, please stop derailing it into, 'I don't need realistic weapon skins or upgradded textures' because that is not what I am talking about. You may not even own a PC nor even ever touched one, but if you have played a majority of the sequels out there on consoles, your gaming experience has been effected by PC game mods. I am making the assumption that you enjoy some of the features added (I don't enjoy all, in fact most of the reasons I dislike CoD games after 2-3 weeks is because all those features are too unbalanced).
Mods are much more than authentic rifle sounds and the games coming out every month are evidence of this. Yes, simple mods like that exist, but there are many... many mods that are much more than 99% of DLC that publishers charge for.
I guess no one saw this post... Oh well, this thread was worth a shot.
how do you get them?[QUOTE="sethman410"]
[QUOTE="almasdeathchild"]
there are plenty of mods on consoles not as insanly hardcore as pc.but there was a few.i modded oblivion and morrowind way back when
almasdeathchild
EDIT: lol we got the same sig.
like you use a usb drive and use a system called moddio and you take your account and put it on there and you can do wonders.look up videos i cant really explain it well Sorry, I would like to alter the game and actually add new things besides savegame files.[QUOTE="arto1223"]
[QUOTE="ZombieKiller7"]
The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.
Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.
The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."
After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.
arto1223
STOP TALKING ABOUT PLAYING MODS WHEN THEY ARE STILL MODS! Sorry for use of caps but I feel like some of these people are simply trying not to read what I have been saying.
In CoD: MW1 for the PC, mods were released that added in the pilotable AC-130 as a killstreak, a player controlled, off-site rocket, and a carpet bomb version of the airstrike. Each of these had their own kill count required. Then, in MW2, the PS3, 360 and PC versions had these three killstreaks as actual features of the game. Many other MW1 PC mods like dual-wielding, upgradable perks, and others were added as features to MW2 as well. Gamers who played MW2 were indirectly effected by those MW1 PC mods, whether you played MW1 or not and whether you play on consoles or PC.
This is what my thread is about, please stop derailing it into, 'I don't need realistic weapon skins or upgradded textures' because that is not what I am talking about. You may not even own a PC nor even ever touched one, but if you have played a majority of the sequels out there on consoles, your gaming experience has been effected by PC game mods. I am making the assumption that you enjoy some of the features added (I don't enjoy all, in fact most of the reasons I dislike CoD games after 2-3 weeks is because all those features are too unbalanced).
Mods are much more than authentic rifle sounds and the games coming out every month are evidence of this. Yes, simple mods like that exist, but there are many... many mods that are much more than 99% of DLC that publishers charge for.
I guess no one saw this post... Oh well, this thread was worth a shot.
I saw it, I just didn't respond to it.[QUOTE="arto1223"]
[QUOTE="ZombieKiller7"]
The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.
Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.
The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."
After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.
arto1223
STOP TALKING ABOUT PLAYING MODS WHEN THEY ARE STILL MODS! Sorry for use of caps but I feel like some of these people are simply trying not to read what I have been saying.
In CoD: MW1 for the PC, mods were released that added in the pilotable AC-130 as a killstreak, a player controlled, off-site rocket, and a carpet bomb version of the airstrike. Each of these had their own kill count required. Then, in MW2, the PS3, 360 and PC versions had these three killstreaks as actual features of the game. Many other MW1 PC mods like dual-wielding, upgradable perks, and others were added as features to MW2 as well. Gamers who played MW2 were indirectly effected by those MW1 PC mods, whether you played MW1 or not and whether you play on consoles or PC.
This is what my thread is about, please stop derailing it into, 'I don't need realistic weapon skins or upgradded textures' because that is not what I am talking about. You may not even own a PC nor even ever touched one, but if you have played a majority of the sequels out there on consoles, your gaming experience has been effected by PC game mods. I am making the assumption that you enjoy some of the features added (I don't enjoy all, in fact most of the reasons I dislike CoD games after 2-3 weeks is because all those features are too unbalanced).
Mods are much more than authentic rifle sounds and the games coming out every month are evidence of this. Yes, simple mods like that exist, but there are many... many mods that are much more than 99% of DLC that publishers charge for.
I guess no one saw this post... Oh well, this thread was worth a shot.
Well the fact is nobody can bring an argument against that so thats why some go: "I don't like mods" "I don't care about mods"
Only total conversion mod I ever played was Project Reality. >.> Completely different FPS title altogether. I put in tons and tons of hours and I can easily say, DICE took a lot of their ideas for BF3. Shame they didn't take their 'scale' as well.[QUOTE="mitu123"]
Mods can even change the game, total conversion mods anyone?
Mystic-G
When I got UT2004 I put in more time playing total conversions than I did in the actual game.
There were just so many great ones. Reason for that being the fact that Epic put up a contest.
It's sad that Epic has turned it back to PC gaming. Not that they should bring Gears to PC but because they were such supporters of mod developers.
Tripwire interactive was able to make Red Orchestra 2 because they won the contest and got money & a license to use the UT3 engine.
[QUOTE="milannoir"][QUOTE="lowe0"] None of which I said anything about. I attacked the elitist comment that we only have the opinions we do because we don't have mods. I really don't have an opinion on whether the gaming industry would have developed those features without mods.lowe0
The elitist comment is based on perfectly valid and comparable examples from the near past (online + HD). Do you claim that the majority of 360 and PS3 gamers dismiss online gaming and HD as irrelevant today? Do you deny that prior to this gen, every time a PC gamer praised online or HD the consolites would rush in to scream that HD was useless, and online brought nothing? I was there, I saw them do it.
Sorry if the analogy hurt your feelings, but it's perfectly valid since we're facing the exact same situation : console gamers dismissing a feature that takes nothing away, but adds real value to a game, just because they don't have it on their platforms.
Actually, I can prove it with facts : console gamers love mods when they can have them; in fact they're even ready to pay for them: it's called DLC and they buy craploads of it.
Oh, and before you try the desperate "DLC is not like mods" card, you're right. Mods are better : more choice, and free. And the other desperate argument "99% of mods are trash that will make your PC BSOD" is pathetic too : even the ultimate idiot is capable of typing "best mod for [insert game name here]" in Google. I always do this, and get a short list of the very best mods for my games.
You really think the reason I don't like mods is because they're not on consoles?I don't give a **** what you specifically like or dislike, and why. And discussing it is completely irrelevant here; you could be sincere, or some fakeboy saying he's got all systems and blablabla.
What I do know is that when console gamers don't have a feature (like HD, online, or mods) the huge majority of those I deal with IRL or on forums like this one say the feature is irrelevant/broken/hurts gameplay. And everytime I've seen that feature come (at last) to consoles, I've seen a massive switch of opinion. Now you have 360 and PS3 players dismissing the Wii because it can't do HD and has superficial online!!!! The irony....
Since you weren't able to address any argument I put forward, in my previous post, I think all I can do is ask again:
"Do you claim that the majority of 360 and PS3 gamers dismiss online gaming and HD as irrelevant today? Do you deny that prior to this gen, every time a PC gamer praised online or HD the consolites would rush in to scream that HD was useless, and online brought nothing? I was there, I saw them do it."
The same goes for mods.
Okay, let's return to your original post. If you don't care what we think, then why bring it up? On top of that, you still haven't addressed my original assertion: that you shouldn't presume people's reasons stem from a lack of any given feature. What's the point of debate if every response is going to be "you're just saying that because you don't have that"?I love how console-only gamers dismiss mods, and then swarm to DLC. Mods are free DLC....
I think this discussion won't go anywhere, anyway. Of course console players know mods are awesome; they would love to have them, but since they can't, and would rather be skinned than have to recognize the PC any advantage, they pretend mods suck/are irrelevant.
Just an immature posture; you can be sure that some day, when consoles at last enter the 21st century and support mods, they'll claim ownage over PC gaming :lol:
milannoir
I use mods but I don't love them.
to me the best mod out there is forgotten Hope for BF 1942. that imo is the biggest battlefield game ever, and what it should of been
[QUOTE="milannoir"]Okay, let's return to your original post. If you don't care what we think, then why bring it up? On top of that, you still haven't addressed my original assertion: that you shouldn't presume people's reasons stem from a lack of any given feature. What's the point of debate if every response is going to be "you're just saying that because you don't have that"?I love how console-only gamers dismiss mods, and then swarm to DLC. Mods are free DLC....
I think this discussion won't go anywhere, anyway. Of course console players know mods are awesome; they would love to have them, but since they can't, and would rather be skinned than have to recognize the PC any advantage, they pretend mods suck/are irrelevant.
Just an immature posture; you can be sure that some day, when consoles at last enter the 21st century and support mods, they'll claim ownage over PC gaming :lol:
lowe0
I already answered that by bringing up the HD/online analogy, and by talking about DLC (which console gamers buy tons of, and are just paid mods..). You're running in circles.
So according to you, I can't assume console-only gamers would like to have free DLC, when they enjoy non-free DLC? Okaaaaay.
But since we're in SW, and console gamers have proven time and again that anything they have is awesome, and anything they don't get is useless, they'd rather argue about mods not being comparable to DLC, or being totally irrelevant.
Which is funny, because as TC very competently explained, console gaming is actually swarming with games/features that exist in their present state thanks to modders, and the awesome work they've offered us all for free. Again, an example of "if it's only on PC it sucks, but when we get it it's great". Deny it if you want, but don't ask to be taken seriously.
[QUOTE="arto1223"]
[QUOTE="arto1223"]
STOP TALKING ABOUT PLAYING MODS WHEN THEY ARE STILL MODS! Sorry for use of caps but I feel like some of these people are simply trying not to read what I have been saying.
In CoD: MW1 for the PC, mods were released that added in the pilotable AC-130 as a killstreak, a player controlled, off-site rocket, and a carpet bomb version of the airstrike. Each of these had their own kill count required. Then, in MW2, the PS3, 360 and PC versions had these three killstreaks as actual features of the game. Many other MW1 PC mods like dual-wielding, upgradable perks, and others were added as features to MW2 as well. Gamers who played MW2 were indirectly effected by those MW1 PC mods, whether you played MW1 or not and whether you play on consoles or PC.
This is what my thread is about, please stop derailing it into, 'I don't need realistic weapon skins or upgradded textures' because that is not what I am talking about. You may not even own a PC nor even ever touched one, but if you have played a majority of the sequels out there on consoles, your gaming experience has been effected by PC game mods. I am making the assumption that you enjoy some of the features added (I don't enjoy all, in fact most of the reasons I dislike CoD games after 2-3 weeks is because all those features are too unbalanced).
Mods are much more than authentic rifle sounds and the games coming out every month are evidence of this. Yes, simple mods like that exist, but there are many... many mods that are much more than 99% of DLC that publishers charge for.
mitu123
I guess no one saw this post... Oh well, this thread was worth a shot.
I saw it, I just didn't respond to it.Oh, well you were not exactly one of the ones I was directing it to.Correct; you cannot make that assumption. If you want to know why anyone here (not just me) has the opinions they do, ASK THEM instead of chalking it up to jealousy.lowe0
Way to not understand one bit of what I wrote. I see full denial mode is engaged.
I have yet to see you counter any argument made in favour of mods and their very real impact on the gaming industry in this thread.
Oh, and when you ask blatantly jealous people if they're jealous, what do they usually answer according to you? :P
Unless you play Japanese games. :|
Seems like jealousy is the only sensible answer...
Who doesn't like improvements / more content / more choice / free content you pick and choose?
I've NEVER had a mod do anything to my PC, ever. 15 years of modding.
Noobs ...
GeorgeCScott
Choice can be a good thing, but it isn't a good thing in of itself. I got bored of the content available in Sim City 4, so I went to add buildings from other users. And it's a complicated mess. There's plenty of content available, but wading through the sea of requirements is not an easy task. When I move to a new PC, Im going to have a hard time.
It should be said that developers know that people mod their games. They know that people fix their issues and add content that often times should have been there in the first place. This awareness reduces the incentive to excel. It reduces the incentive to create a complete product from the beginning. Some console games are experiencing a similar problem thorugh DLC.
[QUOTE="lowe0"]Correct; you cannot make that assumption. If you want to know why anyone here (not just me) has the opinions they do, ASK THEM instead of chalking it up to jealousy.milannoir
Way to not understand one bit of what I wrote. I see full denial mode is engaged.
I have yet to see you counter any argument made in favour of mods and their very real impact on the gaming industry in this thread.
Oh, and when you ask blatantly jealous people if they're jealous, what do they usually answer according to you? :P
Denying what? I really don't mind if people want to discuss the influence of mods on modern gaming. And your non-answer forces me to ask again: do you really think I'm jealous of mods, or that it drives my opinions?Another thing about mods is there is the possibility of losing artistic cohesiveness and uniformity. In other words, you can increase the resolution of textures in a game, but at the same time this may also have an impact on the art direction. This is judging from modded screens of RE4.
[QUOTE="skrat_01"][QUOTE="lowe0"]Money's cheap. Time isn't. (And before you say "then why are you here", I'm in line for a hot dog. This is time I'm not getting back.)lowe0The value of what you spend your time on is relative to the person. Time spent on an interesting or enjoyable mod is time well spent. Quite frankly my time spent playing things like The Stanley Parable for an hour this year, was better spent then playing certain triple A games. Go figure. And I'd rather spend my time working through my backlog of Battlefield, Uncharted, etc.. Which of us is right and which is wrong?Neither. Again, relative to the person. Just because you rather those doesn't diminish the redeeming values of mods, and vice versa.
No, I won't. However, those things still won't be elitism. Elitism isn't bragging about your platform; it's the assumption that everyone would choose the same as you if given the opportunity. Attempting to cast ordinary bragging as elitism is simply a straw man argument; it's a diversion from answering the original argument (which, tellingly, you haven't).lowe0Elitism is simply an unfounded sense of superiority. I wouldn't be quick to call others elitist either, you're terribly quick to point the finger when it comes to gritting and frowning at PC gamers on SW. If anything I'd say you're casting yourself into that category of jumping to conclusions, which isn't doing any favours for your once staunch argument. I'm only pointing this out now after seeing it enough times to raise an eyebrow; an observation, take it or leave it.
Unless you play Japanese games. :|
hakanakumono
Ooooh anthor thing we could mod Japanese games to other langauge packs if we wanted :P
[QUOTE="lowe0"]No, I won't. However, those things still won't be elitism. Elitism isn't bragging about your platform; it's the assumption that everyone would choose the same as you if given the opportunity. Attempting to cast ordinary bragging as elitism is simply a straw man argument; it's a diversion from answering the original argument (which, tellingly, you haven't).skrat_01Elitism is simply an unfounded sense of superiority. I wouldn't be quick to call others elitist either, you're terribly quick to point the finger when it comes to gritting and frowning at PC gamers on SW. If anything I'd say you're casting yourself into that category of jumping to conclusions, which isn't doing any favours for your once staunch argument. I'm only pointing this out now after seeing it enough times to raise an eyebrow; an observation, take it or leave it. I point the finger at anyone who leaves an opportunity to do so. I identify as a console gamer, but I've torn into plenty of PS3 gamers for elitism (check my post history from the $599 days).
[QUOTE="milannoir"][QUOTE="lowe0"]Correct; you cannot make that assumption. If you want to know why anyone here (not just me) has the opinions they do, ASK THEM instead of chalking it up to jealousy.lowe0
Way to not understand one bit of what I wrote. I see full denial mode is engaged.
I have yet to see you counter any argument made in favour of mods and their very real impact on the gaming industry in this thread.
Oh, and when you ask blatantly jealous people if they're jealous, what do they usually answer according to you? :P
Denying what? I really don't mind if people want to discuss the influence of mods on modern gaming. And your non-answer forces me to ask again: do you really think I'm jealous of mods, or that it drives my opinions?I've already said your specific opinion meant less than nothing. You haven't answered anything in this thread, just kept on repeating the same weak argument that has already been debunked ten times. You specifically being jealous of mods or not makes no difference to everything I said.
I thought you'd be able to understand why, but then again you seem to have trouble reading and understanding posts that contradict you (not hard to do). If you want a general answer to your question (and not your insignificant personal case), I refer you to previous posts, where everything has already been answered. Just... Read. And understand.
Denying what? I really don't mind if people want to discuss the influence of mods on modern gaming. And your non-answer forces me to ask again: do you really think I'm jealous of mods, or that it drives my opinions?[QUOTE="lowe0"][QUOTE="milannoir"]
Way to not understand one bit of what I wrote. I see full denial mode is engaged.
I have yet to see you counter any argument made in favour of mods and their very real impact on the gaming industry in this thread.
Oh, and when you ask blatantly jealous people if they're jealous, what do they usually answer according to you? :P
milannoir
I've already said your specific opinion meant less than nothing. You haven't answered anything in this thread, just kept on repeating the same weak argument that has already been debunked ten times. You specifically being jealous of mods or not makes no difference to everything I said.
I thought you'd be able to understand why, but then again you seem to have trouble reading and understanding posts that contradict you (not hard to do). If you want a general answer to your question (and not your insignificant personal case), I refer you to previous posts, where everything has already been answered. Just... Read. And understand.
I'm not asking you to ascribe significance to my opinion; quite the opposite. However, since you made a comment specifically about the motivation behind that opinion, it's a fair question. Perhaps you shouldn't have done that?[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]
Unless you play Japanese games. :|
NoodleFighter
Ooooh anthor thing we could mod Japanese games to other langauge packs if we wanted :P
Well, legitimately I guess. Although Japanese developers most likely wouldnt welcome mods for their PC games.
Well since people clearly will not get off the topic of mods while they are still mods or the topic of mods apparently only being capable of adding realistic gun sounds, here is a nice little mod that makes CoD4: MW look better than not only MW2 but also MW3.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXFaT2TywBo
I still think that BF3 on PC looks better than this mod, but I would say that this mod looks better than BF3 on console.
Oh, that's impressive. Here's another good one: http://youtu.be/SeYo7idrYloWell since people clearly will not get off the topic of mods while they are still mods or the topic of mods apparently only being capable of adding realistic gun sounds, here is a nice little mod that makes CoD4: MW look better than not only MW2 but also MW3.
I still think that BF3 on PC looks better than this mod, but I would say that this mod looks better than BF3 on console.
arto1223
Texture resolutions shouldnt change the art direction. You probably saw a screen with the ENBseries on, in which I sometimes agree in that the settings some people use robs a game of its saturation, colour palette and whatnot. I remember there was this FO3 mod that made the colours more natural -- but in doing that stripped the game of its sense of post-apocalyptia.Another thing about mods is there is the possibility of losing artistic cohesiveness and uniformity. In other words, you can increase the resolution of textures in a game, but at the same time this may also have an impact on the art direction. This is judging from modded screens of RE4.
hakanakumono
[QUOTE="skrat_01"][QUOTE="lowe0"]No, I won't. However, those things still won't be elitism. Elitism isn't bragging about your platform; it's the assumption that everyone would choose the same as you if given the opportunity. Attempting to cast ordinary bragging as elitism is simply a straw man argument; it's a diversion from answering the original argument (which, tellingly, you haven't).lowe0Elitism is simply an unfounded sense of superiority. I wouldn't be quick to call others elitist either, you're terribly quick to point the finger when it comes to gritting and frowning at PC gamers on SW. If anything I'd say you're casting yourself into that category of jumping to conclusions, which isn't doing any favours for your once staunch argument. I'm only pointing this out now after seeing it enough times to raise an eyebrow; an observation, take it or leave it. I point the finger at anyone who leaves an opportunity to do so. I identify as a console gamer, but I've torn into plenty of PS3 gamers for elitism (check my post history from the $599 days). Just wow..
Thank god you're here to point fingers at people at tear up those elitists, otherwise this place might go unchecked. How noble of you. Just wow...
I point the finger at anyone who leaves an opportunity to do so. I identify as a console gamer, but I've torn into plenty of PS3 gamers for elitism (check my post history from the $599 days). Just wow..[QUOTE="lowe0"][QUOTE="skrat_01"] Elitism is simply an unfounded sense of superiority. I wouldn't be quick to call others elitist either, you're terribly quick to point the finger when it comes to gritting and frowning at PC gamers on SW. If anything I'd say you're casting yourself into that category of jumping to conclusions, which isn't doing any favours for your once staunch argument. I'm only pointing this out now after seeing it enough times to raise an eyebrow; an observation, take it or leave it. GeneralShowzer
Thank god you're here to point fingers at people at tear up those elitists, otherwise this place might go unchecked. How noble of you. Just wow...
My God this thread's still going on? Thought what's-his-face had grown tired of repeating the same flawed argument over and over again and asking the same irrelevant question.
I love how he tries to posture as some sort of objective noble fighter of the Truth. SW is really a special place.
I've still got to see him explain why console gamers love paid DLC, and dismiss free DLC, if it's not because they just can't have it.
Oh, yes I know "yeah man, you haven't answered my question, are you saying I'm jealous of mods cuz I can't have them?". No, I'm saying you didn't once prove my logic wrong in this thread, and trying to establish a general truth from your individual situation proves you don't understand the way trends/statistics work. Oh, and answering questions with questions is shooting yourself in the knee.
They play their part but you shouldn't have to care about them.
I'd be happy to explain why I do like DLC: Licensing. The vast majority of my DLC is for Rock Band, and you're not going to get the source material to do that right without a license from the label. Quality control. Yes, mods do open betas, but look at the BF3 beta for an example of why that model fails. What percentage of open beta participants properly document bugs, identify reproduction steps, and regression test the eventual fix? Proper testing is miserable work, but it has to be done on consoles, because certification is expensive. That's not to say console games or content are bug-free, but at least the major game-breaking bugs get filtered out. Integration. I can grab content and start playing from in-game. Yes, that's just selling convenience, but a lot of successful business models could be described that way.lowe0
So... what has your argument been this thread? That mods are irrelevant and DLC is the way to go?
[QUOTE="lowe0"]I'd be happy to explain why I do like DLC: Licensing. The vast majority of my DLC is for Rock Band, and you're not going to get the source material to do that right without a license from the label. Quality control. Yes, mods do open betas, but look at the BF3 beta for an example of why that model fails. What percentage of open beta participants properly document bugs, identify reproduction steps, and regression test the eventual fix? Proper testing is miserable work, but it has to be done on consoles, because certification is expensive. That's not to say console games or content are bug-free, but at least the major game-breaking bugs get filtered out. Integration. I can grab content and start playing from in-game. Yes, that's just selling convenience, but a lot of successful business models could be described that way.rpgs_shall_rule
So... what has your argument been this thread? That mods are irrelevant and DLC is the way to go?
No. I have no problem with mods. My argument has been that claiming we only dislike mods because we're jealous of them is elitist (and simply not true).I wished more COD games looked like that.D=Well since people clearly will not get off the topic of mods while they are still mods or the topic of mods apparently only being capable of adding realistic gun sounds, here is a nice little mod that makes CoD4: MW look better than not only MW2 but also MW3.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXFaT2TywBo
I still think that BF3 on PC looks better than this mod, but I would say that this mod looks better than BF3 on console.
arto1223
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