Console players should love PC game mods too.

The main problem I have with Mods is that they don't always work. Unlike an actual developer that runs as a business, a hobby doesn't necessarily have what you call Quality Control (at least at the level of a full blown developer, or something like the "Nintendo Seal of Approval" that every Nintendo game must get before being declared RTM). After all these things are just hobbies (i.e. they aren't High Priority stuff, so things like Real Life have priority over them), not businesses which have to get things right if they are to survive.

Sailor_Enlil

That's why we have sites like moddb ;)

[QUOTE="Sailor_Enlil"]

The main problem I have with Mods is that they don't always work. Unlike an actual developer that runs as a business, a hobby doesn't necessarily have what you call Quality Control (at least at the level of a full blown developer, or something like the "Nintendo Seal of Approval" that every Nintendo game must get before being declared RTM). After all these things are just hobbies (i.e. they aren't High Priority stuff, so things like Real Life have priority over them), not businesses which have to get things right if they are to survive.

ducati101

That's why we have sites like moddb ;)

LOL I actually just came from there looking for Half-Life 2 mods. And majority of the entries? I see complaints like "this mod doesn't work!" or "file xxx.bsp is missing!" or "the latest Steam update screwed things up!".

[QUOTE="ducati101"]

[QUOTE="Sailor_Enlil"]

The main problem I have with Mods is that they don't always work. Unlike an actual developer that runs as a business, a hobby doesn't necessarily have what you call Quality Control (at least at the level of a full blown developer, or something like the "Nintendo Seal of Approval" that every Nintendo game must get before being declared RTM). After all these things are just hobbies (i.e. they aren't High Priority stuff, so things like Real Life have priority over them), not businesses which have to get things right if they are to survive.

Sailor_Enlil

That's why we have sites like moddb ;)

LOL I actually just came from there looking for Half-Life 2 mods. And majority of the entries? I see complaints like "this mod doesn't work!" or "file xxx.bsp is missing!" or "the latest Steam update screwed things up!".

Most of the time mods don't work because someone failed to follow directions. But rather than trying to figure out what they did wrong they just blame the mod. The same happens with Minecraft mods. Somoene leaves out a file and all of a sudden the mod is broken. Yet there are countless others that use the mod that don't have any problems. The squeaky wheel is getting your attention when most of the time those errors are user based not mod based.

arto1223

I agree they are important and I'm happy there's a community that enjoys and supports them.

I agree they influence the industry.

I disagree with your title and its implication that because they are important people should like them as a source of content.

Personally, I find they are like apps on the app store in that you know there is good content there, but its submerged under hundreds of bits of bad content that gets just as much exposure. Also, like the app store, you can rarely trust the recommendations on free content because they are often held to different standards, leading to a great waste of time if your not careful.

When I've seen people respond by lamenting that a mod breaks with the developers intention, its usually in the context of a specific mod and not mods in general, and they have every right to feel that way about the mod, as I do about some of the mods that alter Oblivion's levelling, for instance.

I've also seen people mention developer intention when someone tries to make a claim about a game based on a mod, and I again think they are right to do so. Mod-makers should get credit for their mods, the underlying modified product should not; although obviously varying amounts of credit is due the tool-set and engine makers.

I can't say I see many console gamers often attacking mods unless they are brought up as a great feature of PC-gaming, which is when they dismiss it as something they wouldn't care about, which is probably true for the most part (after all, if it did attract them they would be PC gamers, now wouldn't they?). Further, to an extent it can be seen by the few games that allow mods and UCC on consoles, which is explored a bit by most owners of such games, but only enthusiastically embraced by a small number of users. More awareness of what modding has brought to some console games may raise the appreciation of modding in general, but active community participation is always going to be limited to a minority, as in any other kind of group participation, from politics to sports to gaming. Enthusiasts are the exception, not the rule.

Besides, I think its very rare that any gamer, even console-only gamers aren't somewhat aware of what modding or UCC in general offers. It would be rare to find people on the forum unaware that Counter-Strike began as a mod, or Team Fortress 2, or that Skyrim wasn't influenced by the community. As a matter of fact, I suspect many believe mods to be behind things that were never mods. For instance, I've seen Portal and Left 4 Dead both sourced to mods, which is untrue in both cases with the former sourced to a freeware student game and the latter was never free, nor going to be free, in any form.

[QUOTE="EvanTheGamer"]It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.KC_Hokie

And that's the difference. An ordinary Mod as we know ofisn't expected to generate profit for its maker, and thus have the need to be worked on as a "priority project".
Eg how long are you willing to wait for that "Black Mesa Source" mod for Half-Life 2 (which was announced like 2 or 3 years ago and until now still has no release)?

Sailor_Enlil

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="EvanTheGamer"]It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.sethman410

The worse I've had a mod do was crash the game on launch, til I realized I did something wrong and fixed it.

[QUOTE="Sailor_Enlil"]

[QUOTE="ducati101"]

That's why we have sites like moddb ;)

menes777

LOL I actually just came from there looking for Half-Life 2 mods. And majority of the entries? I see complaints like "this mod doesn't work!" or "file xxx.bsp is missing!" or "the latest Steam update screwed things up!".

Most of the time mods don't work because someone failed to follow directions. But rather than trying to figure out what they did wrong they just blame the mod. The same happens with Minecraft mods. Somoene leaves out a file and all of a sudden the mod is broken. Yet there are countless others that use the mod that don't have any problems. The squeaky wheel is getting your attention when most of the time those errors are user based not mod based.

Explain why some fiddling had to be done to the GAMEINFO.TXT files of several mods after a certain Steam Update (this happened to the Ravenholm and Mistake of Pythagoras mods).

Anyway the only really interesting "mod" for me in HL2 nowadaysis this one (i.e. see who I replaced Alyx with):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9vVIRtDCAw

Mainly because it's related to a recent hobby of mine (which is now one of the main things I do on the PC instead of gaming, another reason gaming is relegated to my PS3), which includes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TkF7PmCDqQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvFXLkPc--M

[QUOTE="Sailor_Enlil"]

And that's the difference. An ordinary Mod as we know ofisn't expected to generate profit for its maker, and thus have the need to be worked on as a "priority project".
Eg how long are you willing to wait for that "Black Mesa Source" mod for Half-Life 2 (which was announced like 2 or 3 years ago and until now still has no release)?

Am_Confucius

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="EvanTheGamer"]It would greatly help if 99% of PC mods weren't crap that crashes your comp.sethman410

The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.

Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.

The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."

After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.

you really have to wade through **** before you find really good ones.

savagetwinkie

The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.

Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.

The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."

After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.

ZombieKiller7

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] you really have to wade through **** before you find really good ones.

Am_Confucius

[QUOTE="Am_Confucius"]

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] you really have to wade through **** before you find really good ones.

savagetwinkie

Or you can watch some gameplay on youtube to see if its interesting enough to play it ?

BF 1942's desert combat mod is the reason why we had BF2 in a modern setting, which is what made DICE who they are today.

BF 1942's desert combat mod is the reason why we had BF2 in a modern setting, which is what made DICE who they are today.

Mystic-G

and gave us a half pc lead developed title :P

BF 1942's desert combat mod is the reason why we had BF2 in a modern setting, which is what made DICE who they are today.

Mystic-G

[QUOTE="Mystic-G"]

BF 1942's desert combat mod is the reason why we had BF2 in a modern setting, which is what made DICE who they are today.

NoodleFighter

and gave us a half pc lead developed title :P

BF 1942's desert combat mod is the reason why we had BF2 in a modern setting, which is what made DICE who they are today.

Mystic-G

Yeah and there was more:

Vietnam mod > BF Vietnam

Star Wars mod > Battlefront

Lots of people ITT missing the point of the OP. It doesn't matter if the mods don't work or if you have time for them, the OP itself is not about you using mods it's about the influence of MODs. For instance, Obsidian noticed that weapon customization was one of the big and popular mods for FO3, so in NV they put it into the game (this is where it affects you, console gamers!)

Lots of people ITT missing the point of the OP. It doesn't matter if the mods don't work or if you have time for them, the OP itself is not about you using mods it's about the influence of MODs. For instance, Obsidian noticed that weapon customization was one of the big and popular mods for FO3, so in NV they put it into the game (this is where it affects you, console gamers!)

GD1551

I don't think they're missing the point.

I think they're largely ignoring the point because it offers very little in the way of fodder for debate or system wars.

Instead they're reacting to the title at face value, which naturally, rightly, and intentionally puts them on the defensive.

There are some plenty of cool mods out there definately. But alot of them are just dumb like someone recommend some mods to me for Oblvion and they were just mods that made women's breasts bigger, I just rolled my eyes and said "really guys? This is just sad" I want cool mods that are awesome, not dumb stuff like that, I'm scared to meet the people that download those mods.

[QUOTE="Am_Confucius"]

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] you really have to wade through **** before you find really good ones.

savagetwinkie

There are some plenty of cool mods out there definately. But alot of them are just dumb like someone recommend some mods to me for Oblvion and they were just mods that made women's breasts bigger, I just rolled my eyes and said "really guys? This is just sad" I want cool mods that are awesome, not dumb stuff like that, I'm scared to meet the people that download those mods.

ShadowMoses900

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

There are some plenty of cool mods out there definately. But alot of them are just dumb like someone recommend some mods to me for Oblvion and they were just mods that made women's breasts bigger, I just rolled my eyes and said "really guys? This is just sad" I want cool mods that are awesome, not dumb stuff like that, I'm scared to meet the people that download those mods.

Am_Confucius

lol I hope not, those guys need to get girlfriends....

[QUOTE="nitekids2004"]

[QUOTE="ducati101"]

So extra content for your favourite game is not a good thing?

mitu123

I've only played a few mods in my life (CS, DotA).

They're a plus. But they're also grossly overrated by hermits. If all mods suddenly vanish, it won't bother me much.

:lol: like I said, I've got too many original games in my list I haven't played yet.

Why should I care for user created additions?

Btw, I game on consoles, PC and handhelds.:lol:

:lol: like I said, I've got too many original games in my list I haven't played yet.

Why should I care for user created additions?

Btw, I game on consoles, PC and handhelds.:lol:

nitekids2004

Why should you care? Look at mods for Stalker, which complete overhaul the games. Or look at mods for Bethesda's offerings, which fix 1000's of bugs.

[QUOTE="nitekids2004"]

:lol: like I said, I've got too many original games in my list I haven't played yet.

Why should I care for user created additions?

Btw, I game on consoles, PC and handhelds.:lol:

lundy86_4

Why should you care? Look at mods for Stalker, which complete overhaul the games. Or look at mods for Bethesda's offerings, which fix 1000's of bugs.

You see, the main thing is....I haven't played the un-modded Stalker yet...so what incentive do I have in playing the Stalker's Mod?

Bethseda shouldn't release a game full of bugs and praying it would get salvaged by the community. It's a poor practice in their part.

Lol at the guy who thinks DOTA is an RTS, get a clue :lol:

You see, the main thing is....I haven't played the un-modded Stalker yet...so what incentive do I have in playing the Stalker's Mod?

Bethseda shouldn't release a game full of bugs and praying it would get salvaged by the community. It's a poor practice in their part.

nitekids2004

Trust me. Between un-modded Stalker and modded Stalker, take the compltely modded Stalker. It fixes many issues (such as localization issues) and adds a number of things as well.

Bethesda certainly shouldn't do that, but unfortunately they do, and they get away with it. Fortunately the modding ocmmunity for their games is gigantic, and mods are released quickly.

Not all mods are good, naturally. Exactly how not all games are good. However, like games, there are a plethora of ones that add to the experience, or just generally fix the crappy experience.

A lot of people here don't seem to think mods can't improve the game the first time you play it. I played New Vegas on consoles and disliked it, but after playing it on the PC with realism mods, visual mods, no HUD, and no quick travel it warranted a purchase.

The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.

Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.

The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."

After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.

ZombieKiller7

[QUOTE="ZombieKiller7"]

The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.

Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.

The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."

After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.

mitu123

Yep, and you never know, mods can turn that "man I got ripped off" game to "Holy ****, this game is awesome".

[QUOTE="ZombieKiller7"]

The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.

Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.

The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."

After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.

mitu123

[QUOTE="mitu123"]

[QUOTE="ZombieKiller7"]

The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.

Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.

The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."

After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.

lowe0

Money's cheap. Time isn't. (And before you say "then why are you here", I'm in line for a hot dog. This is time I'm not getting back.)lowe0

[QUOTE="lowe0"]Money's cheap. Time isn't. (And before you say "then why are you here", I'm in line for a hot dog. This is time I'm not getting back.)skrat_01

I became a PC gamer because of mods. Back in the day, pro evolution soccer was unplayable on consoles because of the fake kits. On PC it was perfect :)

[QUOTE="Mystic-G"]

BF 1942's desert combat mod is the reason why we had BF2 in a modern setting, which is what made DICE who they are today.

R4gn4r0k

Yeah and there was more:

Vietnam mod > BF Vietnam

Star Wars mod > Battlefront

what where is proof on that?

The problem is most of us don't play a game long enough to USE a mod.

Simple fact is that in the last 10 years there's maybe 3-4 games that stand out and you play over and over.

The vast majority of stuff, 2 hours after you start playing it you're like "man I got ripped off."

After playing thru F:NV the first time, I wanted to hurl it into the trash, not get authentic rifle sounds and play it again.

ZombieKiller7

STOP TALKING ABOUT PLAYING MODS WHEN THEY ARE STILL MODS! Sorry for use of caps but I feel like some of these people are simply trying not to read what I have been saying.

In CoD: MW1 for the PC, mods were released that added in the pilotable AC-130 as a killstreak, a player controlled, off-site rocket, and a carpet bomb version of the airstrike. Each of these had their own kill count required. Then, in MW2, the PS3, 360 and PC versions had these three killstreaks as actual features of the game. Many other MW1 PC mods like dual-wielding, upgradable perks, and others were added as features to MW2 as well. Gamers who played MW2 were indirectly effected by those MW1 PC mods, whether you played MW1 or not and whether you play on consoles or PC.

This is what my thread is about, please stop derailing it into, 'I don't need realistic weapon skins or upgradded textures' because that is not what I am talking about. You may not even own a PC nor even ever touched one, but if you have played a majority of the sequels out there on consoles, your gaming experience has been effected by PC game mods. I am making the assumption that you enjoy some of the features added (I don't enjoy all, in fact most of the reasons I dislike CoD games after 2-3 weeks is because all those features are too unbalanced).

Mods are much more than authentic rifle sounds and the games coming out every month are evidence of this. Yes, simple mods like that exist, but there are many... many mods that are much more than 99% of DLC that publishers charge for.

Mods can even change the game, total conversion mods anyone?

there are plenty of mods on consoles not as insanly hardcore as pc.but there was a few.i modded oblivion and morrowind way back when

there are plenty of mods on consoles not as insanly hardcore as pc.but there was a few.i modded oblivion and morrowind way back when

almasdeathchild

EDIT: lol we got the same sig.

[QUOTE="milannoir"]

I love how console-only gamers dismiss mods, and then swarm to DLC. Mods are free DLC....

I think this discussion won't go anywhere, anyway. Of course console players know mods are awesome; they would love to have them, but since they can't, and would rather be skinned than have to recognize the PC any advantage, they pretend mods suck/are irrelevant.

Just an immature posture; you can be sure that some day, when consoles at last enter the 21st century and support mods, they'll claim ownage over PC gaming :lol:

lowe0

Ah, yes elitism.:roll: The Godwin point of consolites.

And I suppose it was also elitism, when we enjoyed online and consoles didn't, and we laughed when console-only gamers dismissed online? :D

Oh, and obviously, we were also being elitist jerks, when we praised HD, when consoles didn't have it, and console-only gamers went "who cares about HD?". :lol:

Mods can even change the game, total conversion mods anyone?

mitu123

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

Lots of people ITT missing the point of the OP. It doesn't matter if the mods don't work or if you have time for them, the OP itself is not about you using mods it's about the influence of MODs. For instance, Obsidian noticed that weapon customization was one of the big and popular mods for FO3, so in NV they put it into the game (this is where it affects you, console gamers!)

Seiki_sands

I don't think they're missing the point.

I think they're largely ignoring the point because it offers very little in the way of fodder for debate or system wars.

Instead they're reacting to the title at face value, which naturally, rightly, and intentionally puts them on the defensive.

PC mods are better than the alternative

[QUOTE="lowe0"][QUOTE="milannoir"]

I love how console-only gamers dismiss mods, and then swarm to DLC. Mods are free DLC....

I think this discussion won't go anywhere, anyway. Of course console players know mods are awesome; they would love to have them, but since they can't, and would rather be skinned than have to recognize the PC any advantage, they pretend mods suck/are irrelevant.

Just an immature posture; you can be sure that some day, when consoles at last enter the 21st century and support mods, they'll claim ownage over PC gaming :lol:

milannoir

Ah, yes elitism.:roll: The Godwin point of consolites.

And I suppose it was also elitism, when we enjoyed online and consoles didn't, and we laughed when console-only gamers dismissed online? :D

Oh, and obviously, we were also being elitist jerks, when we praised HD, when consoles didn't have it, and console-only gamers went "who cares about HD?". :lol: