crytek boss says ps3 and 360 hold back pc

[QUOTE="AnnoyedDragon"]

I see Crytek are being just as deluded as ever.

These are the people that expected Halo 3 sales from Crysis. A new IP, built to utilize hardware that didn't even exist.

You are rarely going to get console sales on PC, consoles are a much broader audiences than PC. Why would I want PC to be as broad a audience as consoles? That means streamlining and accessibility accommodation for more casual audiences.

alexside1

but that doesn't necessarily translate to sales. casuals will purchase games occasionally, or support one franchise year after year despite having little or now improvement (CoD, Halo, etc.). hardcore gamers generally buy more games than casuals and purchase games of genres that most casuals don't like RPG's and strategy games. but hardcore gamers aren't idiots and tend to wait for sales on games they want but aren't desperate to buy. they wait for the price to lower or buy it used. or to put the whole thing in simpler terms, casuals will buy one game in droves, but those customers don't purchase often. hardcore gamers buy games frequently, but at lower costs/used, but still, they are long term customers and sales to them can sustain a company.

Or he simply realised that there aren't enough high end PC gamers to support the games he truly want to develop. It's either being willing to compromise or go out of business.

JLF1

The thing about PC gaming, is the games are scalable. So you can accommodate the high end without alienating the low end.

Crysis could run on a 7900GT if you really wanted to play it.

To those who are making claims about the reasons why PC games aren't selling "like they used to"-

-First, what are the numbers? I honestly don't know. Have PC game sales dropped a lot since the 1990's?

-Secondly- Saying that "you didn't used to need a video card to play PC games" and "They're not selling now because you need to buy a video card" is pretty ignorant. Saying that "they should go back to supporting software rendering" is ignoring the simple fact that pretty much all IGPs (integrated or "onboard" video cards) since 2001+ have supported 3d acceleration. Software rendering has no place when every computer that comes out supports 3d acceleration. People, for the most parts, can play the vast majority of new games on these IGPs, provided their computer isn't more than 4 or 5 years old. Sure, they're not going to get the same graphics quality as someone who buys a nice discrete GPU. People using software rendering in the 1990's didn't get nearly as nice a graphical experience as people with early 3d cards, either. Nothing has really changed there.

-Every PC ever made that's been hooked up to a monitor has had some kind of video card. Some are integrated into the motherboard, and some are discreet.

-Current Integrated Video Chipsets are capable of playing almost all games. Just like back in the 1990's, you need to buy a nice video card to make the games look their best. Nothing has changed there.

[QUOTE="6matt6"]He also said that developers won't start putting more effort into PC until it starts pulling sales numbers close to what the consoles give them.doom1marine

11k people on fallout new vegas (its a steam game, yes?)very low, 600k on black ops at the moment on xbox360, on pc (steam) 73k.

Game quality may be better and mods are great, but nobody can deny consoles give them more money.

[QUOTE="JLF1"]

Or he simply realised that there aren't enough high end PC gamers to support the games he truly want to develop. It's either being willing to compromise or go out of business.

AnnoyedDragon

The thing about PC gaming, is the games are scalable. So you can accommodate the high end without alienating the low end.

Crysis could run on a 7900GT if you really wanted to play it.

Exactly. You could actually put a PC together for less than $400 that would be capable of playing the game on all "high" settings up to about 1680x1050 with a decent framerate.

The thing about PC gaming, is the games are scalable. So you can accommodate the high end without alienating the low end.

Crysis could run on a 7900GT if you really wanted to play it.

AnnoyedDragon

Well then why are he developing on the consoles in the first place?

Why doesn't EA make KOTOR look fantasic and then scale like you say they can.

Hell, why do Blizzard, EA and Valve release much weaker PC games than the best you can have on PC? They all look technically and artistically great but so does PS3/360 and Wii games when they do them right.

The reality is that the actually big PC developers are doing the exact thing that multiplat PC devs are attacked for doing. Developing the PC games for the lowest common denominator.

The reality is that the actually big PC developers are doing the exact thing that multiplat PC devs are attacked for doing. Developing the PC games for the lowest common denominator.

JLF1

The lowest common denominator PC still has platform specific advantages over consoles.

For example Crysis 2 was converted from a level loading to a streaming based memory management model. Even a lowest common denominator PC has enough ram to handle Crysis scale levels, it was a change done entirely to accommodate console ram. Another thing is even a budget gaming GPU has 512mb of vram these days, allowing better art assets such as textures than consoles.

Even if a budget gaming PC were to be factored in the development of a PC game, it still wouldn't be as limiting a factor as if consoles were involved.

At the end of the day, cost is a far greater limiting factor than hardware this generation.

[QUOTE="badtaker"]

sorry but Ea and THQ doesn't agree with You.JLF1

They can disagee all they want but he is still right.

Unless they want to change their games from "product" to "lease" in which case EA will have to stop with every bad tactics they currently do now or they will be sued to hell and back.

[QUOTE="AnnoyedDragon"]

The thing about PC gaming, is the games are scalable. So you can accommodate the high end without alienating the low end.

Crysis could run on a 7900GT if you really wanted to play it.

JLF1

Well then why are he developing on the consoles in the first place?

Why doesn't EA make KOTOR look fantasic and then scale like you say they can.

Hell, why do Blizzard, EA and Valve release much weaker PC games than the best you can have on PC? They all look technically and artistically great but so does PS3/360 and Wii games when they do them right.

The reality is that the actually big PC developers are doing the exact thing that multiplat PC devs are attacked for doing. Developing the PC games for the lowest common denominator.

We're starting to get to the point where more and more PC games are requiring a Geforce 8 series and up GPU. Some are now requiring Directx10. There are games that push the envelope, just not that many of them.

Crysis will run on almost anything from the last 6 years. It just won't run in all it's glory unless you have a beastly GPU. Metro 2033 is the same way, although I'm not sure that it scales as well to lower-end hardware. It is quite a bit newer than Crysis afterall.

The bottom line is this- Devs don't feel they can make enough money to justify making lots of PC exclusives right now, and they certainly can't make enough by making games that will only run on PC's with a triple or quad-core CPU and a GTX 260 or better. I wish we would see a game like that, because it would look spectacular. I'm ok with the general state of PC graphics right now.. I just don't like the dumbed-down, stiff gameplay mechanics that so many console ports have.

[QUOTE="JLF1"]

[QUOTE="badtaker"]

sorry but Ea and THQ doesn't agree with You.Vandalvideo

They can disagee all they want but he is still right.

Unless they want to change their games from "product" to "lease" in which case EA will have to stop with every bad tactics they currently do now or they will be sued to hell and back.

Yes, because all we understand is games right. Much like you.

Yes, because all we understand is games right. Much like you.JLF1

There is a difference between understanding law and knowing law. Anyone who talks in absolutes about what the law is gives themselves away as a non-law student. Generally speaking, I'd refrain from discussing copyright law and video games.

Vandalvideo

Every dev in bed with microsoft comes out and makes a comment like this...

[QUOTE="alexside1"][QUOTE="AnnoyedDragon"]

I see Crytek are being just as deluded as ever.

These are the people that expected Halo 3 sales from Crysis. A new IP, built to utilize hardware that didn't even exist.

You are rarely going to get console sales on PC, consoles are a much broader audiences than PC. Why would I want PC to be as broad a audience as consoles? That means streamlining and accessibility accommodation for more casual audiences.

cowgriller

but that doesn't necessarily translate to sales. casuals will purchase games occasionally, or support one franchise year after year despite having little or now improvement (CoD, Halo, etc.). hardcore gamers generally buy more games than casuals and purchase games of genres that most casuals don't like RPG's and strategy games. but hardcore gamers aren't idiots and tend to wait for sales on games they want but aren't desperate to buy. they wait for the price to lower or buy it used. or to put the whole thing in simpler terms, casuals will buy one game in droves, but those customers don't purchase often. hardcore gamers buy games frequently, but at lower costs/used, but still, they are long term customers and sales to them can sustain a company.

That's a very narrow minded view of Casual/Hardcore gamers. I've seen gamers in both categories shell out cash for the same game year after year, and I see plenty of casual gamers purchase a wide variety of games. It isn't exclusive to one demographic, and please don't tell me it doesn't happen as often with "Hardcore" gamers, because it does quite frequently.

Honestly, the only REAL difference between casual gamers and the "Hardcore Gamers" (don't know why people use this term, it sounds insanely elitist and lame), is that casuals will play games, CASUALLY. Skill, passion, genre, and system they play on is NOT a deciding factor on who are casual gamers, or who play video games as a hobby ("Hardcore"....gah, it sounds stupid no matter what it's used for).

[QUOTE="doom1marine"][QUOTE="6matt6"]He also said that developers won't start putting more effort into PC until it starts pulling sales numbers close to what the consoles give them.firefluff3

11k people on fallout new vegas (its a steam game, yes?)very low, 600k on black ops at the moment on xbox360, on pc (steam) 73k.

Game quality may be better and mods are great, but nobody can deny consoles give them more money.

[QUOTE="firefluff3"]

[QUOTE="doom1marine"] console game's selling better is bs dude, more people have pc's. back in the day people didnt need to buy graphics cards to play pc games, cpu/software driven. stuff need's to switch back to that.TerrorRizzing

11k people on fallout new vegas (its a steam game, yes?)very low, 600k on black ops at the moment on xbox360, on pc (steam) 73k.

Game quality may be better and mods are great, but nobody can deny consoles give them more money.

[QUOTE="TerrorRizzing"][QUOTE="firefluff3"]

11k people on fallout new vegas (its a steam game, yes?)very low, 600k on black ops at the moment on xbox360, on pc (steam) 73k.

Game quality may be better and mods are great, but nobody can deny consoles give them more money.

alexside1

I see Crytek are being just as deluded as ever.

These are the people that expected Halo 3 sales from Crysis. A new IP, built to utilize hardware that didn't even exist.

You are rarely going to get console sales on PC, consoles are a much broader audiences than PC. Why would I want PC to be as broad a audience as consoles? That means streamlining and accessibility accommodation for more casual audiences.

AnnoyedDragon

Sales of one man indie game hit, Minecraft, have now reached $350,000 in a single day.

According to data provided by developer, Mojang, one copy of the €9.95 ($13) game is currently being purchased every 3 seconds, representing sales of $15,000 per hour.

Update Sept 29: Since reaching a peak of almost $350,000 in one 24 hour period, on September 22, Minecraft has been selling well over $100,000 every day, despite server outages that have sometimes prevented sales or registrations.

[QUOTE="AnnoyedDragon"]

I see Crytek are being just as deluded as ever.

These are the people that expected Halo 3 sales from Crysis. A new IP, built to utilize hardware that didn't even exist.

You are rarely going to get console sales on PC, consoles are a much broader audiences than PC. Why would I want PC to be as broad a audience as consoles? That means streamlining and accessibility accommodation for more casual audiences.

devious742

Sales of one man indie game hit, Minecraft, have now reached $350,000 in a single day.

According to data provided by developer, Mojang, one copy of the €9.95 ($13) game is currently being purchased every 3 seconds, representing sales of $15,000 per hour.

Every dev in bed with microsoft comes out and makes a comment like this...

TerrorRizzing

[QUOTE="AnnoyedDragon"]

I see Crytek are being just as deluded as ever.

These are the people that expected Halo 3 sales from Crysis. A new IP, built to utilize hardware that didn't even exist.

You are rarely going to get console sales on PC, consoles are a much broader audiences than PC. Why would I want PC to be as broad a audience as consoles? That means streamlining and accessibility accommodation for more casual audiences.

devious742

Sales of one man indie game hit, Minecraft, have now reached $350,000 in a single day.

According to data provided by developer, Mojang, one copy of the €9.95 ($13) game is currently being purchased every 3 seconds, representing sales of $15,000 per hour.

Update Sept 29: Since reaching a peak of almost $350,000 in one 24 hour period, on September 22, Minecraft has been selling well over $100,000 every day, despite server outages that have sometimes prevented sales or registrations.

[QUOTE="JLF1"]

Or he simply realised that there aren't enough high end PC gamers to support the games he truly want to develop. It's either being willing to compromise or go out of business.

AnnoyedDragon

The thing about PC gaming, is the games are scalable. So you can accommodate the high end without alienating the low end.

Crysis could run on a 7900GT if you really wanted to play it.

I managed to get Crysis running pretty smoothly at 30FPS on a mix of medium and low settings with 2GB of Ram, 2.2 Core 2 Duo CPU, and a 7900GS (which is weaker than the GT).

[QUOTE="devious742"]

[QUOTE="AnnoyedDragon"]

I see Crytek are being just as deluded as ever.

These are the people that expected Halo 3 sales from Crysis. A new IP, built to utilize hardware that didn't even exist.

You are rarely going to get console sales on PC, consoles are a much broader audiences than PC. Why would I want PC to be as broad a audience as consoles? That means streamlining and accessibility accommodation for more casual audiences.

Teufelhuhn

Sales of one man indie game hit, Minecraft, have now reached $350,000 in a single day.

According to data provided by developer, Mojang, one copy of the €9.95 ($13) game is currently being purchased every 3 seconds, representing sales of $15,000 per hour.

Update Sept 29: Since reaching a peak of almost $350,000 in one 24 hour period, on September 22, Minecraft has been selling well over $100,000 every day, despite server outages that have sometimes prevented sales or registrations.

I think Crytek are funny guys. First they made a game that even the best PCs of the time couldn't run great, then tey said that consoles could never handle Crysis (although a Pentium 4 PC could), then they said Crysis 2 will be for consoles and that the PC version won't suffer, but now they are whining that the consoles hold them back. But the real irony is that they are independant developes and it was their own decision to make Crysis 2 for the consoles.

So instead of whining, they could do a console-only Crysis game and a "proper" sequel for the PC.

My point was.. when you make a proper pc game thats aimed towards pc gamers..you reap the rewards..just look at STALKER or The Witcher..please dont be a smart alec

devious742

[QUOTE="devious742"]

My point was.. when you make a proper pc game thats aimed towards pc gamers..you reap the rewards..just look at STALKER or The Witcher..please dont be a smart alec

Teufelhuhn

EA: Crysis Sales Strong - Exceeded Expectations

After listening to the Q3 2008 Electronic Arts Earnings Conference Call we have learned that Crysis has been a strong performer with sales having exceeded expectations. EA also reported Crysis reaching the platinum mark meaning over 1 million copies of the game have been sold worldwide.

"Speaking at the outset of this year's Leipzig Games Convention, Crytek boss Cevat Yerli revealed that the developer's graphical tour de force, Crysis, cost an estimated $22 million to create. Yerli has previously lamented the effect piracy has had on the title, but reiterated that it's still recouped the development costs, saying, 'If it wasn't profitable I wouldn't be able to stand here.'"

Every dev in bed with microsoft comes out and makes a comment like this...

TerrorRizzing

[QUOTE="TerrorRizzing"]

Every dev in bed with microsoft comes out and makes a comment like this...

lawlessx

[QUOTE="TerrorRizzing"]

Every dev in bed with microsoft comes out and makes a comment like this...

ferret-gamer

[QUOTE="ferret-gamer"][QUOTE="TerrorRizzing"]

Every dev in bed with microsoft comes out and makes a comment like this...

TerrorRizzing

[QUOTE="TerrorRizzing"][QUOTE="ferret-gamer"] What in the world? Are you sure they arent saying this, maybe because it is true? And pretty much common sense? And perhaps you are missing something but Crytek also said the XBOX is holdng the PC back as well. How does that working in your conspiracy theory? Why would microsoft pay Crytek to dis their main gaming platform?ferret-gamer

[QUOTE="ferret-gamer"][QUOTE="TerrorRizzing"] Explain to me what numbers make the ps3 and 360 as capable of platforms as the PC. You really arent making any sense what so ever.TerrorRizzing

Im the one who cant follow? Look at the title and main point of the thread: "crytek boss says ps3 and 360 hold back pc" the topic of the thread is about the PC's capabilities being held back by consoles.

You made this statement, unconnected to any quote chain implying that it was in direct response to the thread topic:

Every dev in bed with microsoft comes out and makes a comment like this...

TerrorRizzing

[QUOTE="TerrorRizzing"][QUOTE="ferret-gamer"] well lets go back and read what his entire argument was... not my fault you cant follow. Ive even explained whats really going on, its a multiplat world now because thats how you can make the most money. Its not a console vs pc thing at all, you can even look at big pc exclusive or pc focused games... they are made to run on most gaming computers not just the high end ones. Pc gaming isnt about making the consumer upgrade, its about selling them games they can play on the machine they already have.ferret-gamer

Im the one who cant follow? Look at the title and main point of the thread: "crytek boss says ps3 and 360 hold back pc" the topic of the thread is about the PC's capabilities being held back by consoles.

You made this statement, unconnected to any quote chain implying that it was in direct response to the thread topic:

Every dev in bed with microsoft comes out and makes a comment like this...

TerrorRizzing

[QUOTE="ferret-gamer"]

[QUOTE="TerrorRizzing"]

Im the one who cant follow? Look at the title and main point of the thread: "crytek boss says ps3 and 360 hold back pc" the topic of the thread is about the PC's capabilities being held back by consoles.

You made this statement, unconnected to any quote chain implying that it was in direct response to the thread topic:

[QUOTE="TerrorRizzing"]

Every dev in bed with microsoft comes out and makes a comment like this...

TerrorRizzing

This gen has a serious problem with the development cost.

I'm pretty sure that Crysis sold between 2 and 3 millions, even if most of the sales were at reduced price, but I can see how Crytek wanted to achieve 4-6 millions sold as in AAA exclusives like in exclusives from consoles as Gears Of War, Halo 3, Modern Warfare or Metal Gear Solid 4.

The thing is: barely a few number of franchises can achieve those numbers currently, even going multiplat. Probably they are aiming to the BC 2 success, a game capable to sold over 2 millions in each platform. But I can see how going multi is nerfing the Crysis 2 development. The same goes with id Software and Rage, but since Rage is a new franchise, is no room for nerf.

I don't believe that's true.. I believe its a success when the developer was able to recoup the money from developing and yet still make money off it.. the only thing I see that's making these other devs successful.... is that they are creating a franchise..improving upon the original and aiming their games towards PC gamers/fanbase.. something that Crytek isn't..

EA: Crysis Sales Strong - Exceeded Expectations

After listening to the Q3 2008 Electronic Arts Earnings Conference Call we have learned that Crysis has been a strong performer with sales having exceeded expectations. EA also reported Crysis reaching the platinum mark meaning over 1 million copies of the game have been sold worldwide.

"Speaking at the outset of this year's Leipzig Games Convention, Crytek boss Cevat Yerli revealed that the developer's graphical tour de force, Crysis, cost an estimated $22 million to create. Yerli has previously lamented the effect piracy has had on the title, but reiterated that it's still recouped the development costs, saying, 'If it wasn't profitable I wouldn't be able to stand here.'"

devious742

This gen has a serious problem with the development cost.

I'm pretty sure that Crysis sold between 2 and 3 millions, even if most of the sales were at reduced price, but I can see how Crytek wanted to achieve 4-6 millions sold as in AAA exclusives like in exclusives from consoles as Gears Of War, Halo 3, Modern Warfare or Metal Gear Solid 4.

The thing is: barely a few number of franchises can achieve those numbers currently, even going multiplat. Probably they are aiming to the BC 2 success, a game capable to sold over 2 millions in each platform. But I can see how going multi is nerfing the Crysis 2 development. The same goes with id Software and Rage, but since Rage is a new franchise, is no room for nerf.

Ondoval

[QUOTE="devious742"]

I don't believe that's true.. I believe its a success when the developer was able to recoup the money from developing and yet still make money off it.. the only thing I see that's making these other devs successful.... is that they are creating a franchise..improving upon the original and aiming their games towards PC gamers/fanbase.. something that Crytek isn't..

EA: Crysis Sales Strong - Exceeded Expectations

After listening to the Q3 2008 Electronic Arts Earnings Conference Call we have learned that Crysis has been a strong performer with sales having exceeded expectations. EA also reported Crysis reaching the platinum mark meaning over 1 million copies of the game have been sold worldwide.

"Speaking at the outset of this year's Leipzig Games Convention, Crytek boss Cevat Yerli revealed that the developer's graphical tour de force, Crysis, cost an estimated $22 million to create. Yerli has previously lamented the effect piracy has had on the title, but reiterated that it's still recouped the development costs, saying, 'If it wasn't profitable I wouldn't be able to stand here.'"

Teufelhuhn

what a bro

cant wait for Crysis 2, i dont care if they gimped the maps, 60fps is better than 30fps, Crysis 2 runs more easy than 1 right? thats what ive heard alot

This gen has a serious problem with the development cost.

I'm pretty sure that Crysis sold between 2 and 3 millions, even if most of the sales were at reduced price, but I can see how Crytek wanted to achieve 4-6 millions sold as in AAA exclusives like in exclusives from consoles as Gears Of War, Halo 3, Modern Warfare or Metal Gear Solid 4.

The thing is: barely a few number of franchises can achieve those numbers currently, even going multiplat. Probably they are aiming to the BC 2 success, a game capable to sold over 2 millions in each platform. But I can see how going multi is nerfing the Crysis 2 development. The same goes with id Software and Rage, but since Rage is a new franchise, is no room for nerf.

Ondoval

Carmack has said many times the 360 has been gimping Rage, Id are sellouts, Id are ignoring the fact their whole fanbase is on PC and PC gamers just dont like Console ports, dont know why Carmack is bothering gimping Rage for the 360, it will be outsold by the next hyped shooter anyway

Rage has a good chance of doing poorly on PC, id will blame Piracy, but in truth all PC gamers picked up Stalker 2 instead

Carmack has said many times the 360 has been gimping Rage, Id are sellouts, Id are ignoring the fact their whole fanbase is on PC and PC gamers just don't like Console ports, don't know why Carmack is bothering gimping Rage for the 360, it will be outsold by the next hyped shooter anyway

Rage has a good chance of doing poorly on PC, id will blame Piracy, but in truth all PC gamers picked up Stalker 2 instead

HaloinventedFPS

There's not a huge expectation for Rage in PC at all, anyway; id Software was in a much stronger position back in the days of Quake III Arena, when his game was as played as Counter Strike and his engine the more prolific. Carmack said that 60 fps is the aiming of Rage, not the top visual quality (this target will be achieved with Doom 4, according his words) so people searching for deep technical advances will wait a time, also. The game isn't much focused in multiplayer, and I doubt that Rage would beat things as The Witcher in the campaign, so the prediction about sales is hard to do, even in consoles.

But don't be so fast to bury the PC: this will not happen and anyway, no PC game market means no Nvidia or ATI and this means no graphic chips for next gen consoles aside from cr4py Intel and IBM chips.

Crytek boss Cervat Yerli has claimed that developers' focus on PS3 and 360 is holding back game quality on PC - a format he believes is already "a generation ahead" of modern day consoles.doom1marine

Of course it holds PC back, but frankly graphics are amazing nowadays in most games, so they are not as important as they used to be

Carmack has said many times the 360 has been gimping Rage, Id are sellouts, Id are ignoring the fact their whole fanbase is on PC and PC gamers just dont like Console ports, dont know why Carmack is bothering gimping Rage for the 360, it will be outsold by the next hyped shooter anyway

Rage has a good chance of doing poorly on PC, id will blame Piracy, but in truth all PC gamers picked up Stalker 2 instead

HaloinventedFPS

Stalker 2 is confirmed for consoles actually too

Stalker 2 is confirmed for consoles actually too

AbleFa3

my HP pavilion 6535 the intergrated chipset didnt support direct x, it only supported open gl.

if games didnt support software rendering back then, i couldnt of even ran some games.

they need to start supporting software rendering again.

[QUOTE="AbleFa3"]Stalker 2 is confirmed for consoles actually too

ferret-gamer

http://www.systemwars.com/forums/showthread.php?78857-Stalker-2-in-development-console-bound

http://www.neoseeker.com/news/14618-stalker-2-confirmed-going-multi-platform/

Confirmed, like Withcer 2 and Diablo 3, these games are made for cosoles, they are not offically announced, but that does not mean anything

[QUOTE="ferret-gamer"]

[QUOTE="AbleFa3"]Stalker 2 is confirmed for consoles actually too

AbleFa3

http://www.systemwars.com/forums/showthread.php?78857-Stalker-2-in-development-console-bound

http://www.neoseeker.com/news/14618-stalker-2-confirmed-going-multi-platform/

Confirmed, like Withcer 2 and Diablo 3, these games are made for cosoles, they are not offically announced, but that does not mean anything

Withcer 2/D3/ Stalker 2 are all being made on PC and ported to consoles, Rage is being made on 360 and ported to PC, which is just fail, yeah all of id's sales are from PC but lets move to consoles and give them a port, this is just as bad as what epic games did