Digital Foundry: It's Too Late For PS4 NEO

All console gamers are PC gamers. Haven't you heard the news. We will all be on Xbox Live.

Doesn't seem like it would be that difficult to overclock, add better cooling and more memory. After all Sony sent out Ps4 dev kits with only 4gb memory.

You poor lems act like Sony won't release a PS5 two years from now.

And just like that power doesn't matter to cows anymore lol

You cannot win a console war with your message being "No exclusive reason to own our console, but just buy it anyway"

You think I'm telling you this because I hate MS and want them to fail ? I said similar things at the start of this gen. Xbone lost EVERYTHING that made it unique.. Kinect, exclusives, better online. It's no mystery they are and will continue to get thrashed and pounded by Sony.

But hey, don't listen to me... Please believe them. See you holiday '17 ;)

I would say that we're all "Xbox gamers".. different pieces of hardware, different price points, different specs but the same Xbox Live community, same Windows 10 core, same Azure cloud..

It should be painfully obvious from the Microsoft E3 brief: Xbox is a gaming platform and Windows 10 is the core of that platform.. Play without boundaries..

The Neo's specs were already leaked. Even if this is Xbox's full-fledged next-gen system, there hasn't been a whisper of a full-fledged next-gen release for Sony. Which would be weird.

Power always matters, thats why people will play Xbox games on PC now.

It's undeniable that Neo is now screwed in a raw power lineup. But to me that's irrelevant- I heartily disagree that the power difference was the ps4's "only" edge so far this generation... specifically, although PS4 got off to a slower start than X1 in this domain it has a substantially larger and more appealing library to me. Ignoring the inevitable "lol indies" "lol artsy fartsy" "lol weaboo" snarls from the Bros, it's a fact that Sony is offering more games of my taste.

So, given that, what am I to think about the power disparity? Nothing much, in truth. The PS2 and Dreamcast were in exactly this position and we're by far my preferred consoles from that Era. And, indeed, the ps2 performed as well in sales as its library was big

Games, games, games. That's what matters to me. Nintendo and Sony are nailing it harder than MS in that space.

Note, this is not to negate the cool games MS has in the pipeline (e.g., ReCore). And of course, this being SW I'm sure someone is going to throw a list at me, but people always seem to forget about the ever critical factor: personal taste. Gears of War is not a selling point for me. But stuff like ReCore is. As it happens, PS and Nintendo offer numerically more titles to my taste

Except that there are still plenty of people who will only use consoles, as evidenced in multiple PC Vs. Console threads on this board. To those people, the Xbox will still be relevant.

@Chozofication: All we have to go on is that leaked document about the neo. All Sony have done is acknowledged it's existence also you make a good point.

Screw you personal list. All that matters is my list and my list only. Now get to stepping. :D

See you on Xbox Live.

The take home with both of these, since neither company has the guts to actually move onto this hardware--unless of course it just flew off the shelves, then their story about no one left behind would change. Your not getting any unique games on the system. Dead Rising 4 will look slightly better IF you bought a 4K TV. VR will run slightly better if you shell out for all the VR components. All their selling is "these things will be a little better, if you buy a bunch of stuff on top of the system." What's the point. I guess for those that just have to have 4K, its good for them. But UC4 looks fine to me, the way it is now. And I would assume, tell me if I'm wrong, the framerate in MP games has to be consistent across the board.

Weren't lems crying foul bc of NEO......but now it's OK to start a generation 4 years into the last?

Either way it won't have any games, so I'll stick to my PS4.

damn son you mad as hell,lulz

you forgot gears of war.

+1 , you're doing the right thing , getting the best performance and cheap games is why I'm still a PC gamer -I love Nintendo but it's hard for me to afford the cost of two platforms- , I said it many times here and in other boards, a game should never be exclusive unless the developer decides to make it exclusive ....XCOM2 is a good example of that , also Star Citizen , wouldn't it be good if we could play Bloodborne on PC , ...IDK why Sony fear to share it's library with PC , their exclusives never been as profitable as their multiplat titles

You can down port games as well look at shadows of mordor for example Designed from the ground up for Current gen consoles but then Down ported to the Ps3 and 360

The Last of Us, Uncharted, God of War, etc says hello.

I concur. I want to be able to play the same game at one cost across any platform of my choosing. Xbox is heading in that direction. I hope its success forces Sony to do the same. I want to ideally play all of my games on one platform and not multiple.

So you didn't buy a Wii U ?

I always think Nintendo is the perfect compliment for PC... Because it always used to be the case that PC did not get 3D and 2D Platformers, which I absolutely love.

So far Sony has brought some smaller games to PC: Helldivers and Everyone's gone to the rapture. I'm not expecting UC4 or Ratchet and Clank or anything; But getting Bloodborne a year or so down the line wouldn't hurt their sales imo.

Well well, cows always say how great DF is. Here you go cows, next gen didn't even start it and you lost already.

Also lol @ the tears

@Tessellation: Not mad at all actually... I'm pumped the 7 year cycle of weak hardware is finished. And BC is now a priority for both. To me this is awesome for console gaming.

LMFAO

Look at all the butthurt scared Cows in here and their "toned down" passive aggressiveness in their posts.

Karma's a bitch. I know.

Greatness Awaits (literally) for MS fans and gamers. You asked and you got it. Developers wanted it and they also got it!

Now they only need to make all their games multi-platform. :D

Xbox exclusives are now MS exclusives. Amazing that you can buy on PC or Xbox and get it for both platforms. You still can't play those games on a PlayStation console. Then you have the choice, spend $2000-2500 for a high end computer with gtx 1080 cards and the latest CPU/RAM combo, or $400-500 for a high end console (scorpio). Meanwhile, PS4Neo will still have it's precious exclusives, but they will be made for an under powered console for whatever that's worth. MS has a good strategy on this cross buy plan, and in a way it's getting Sony back for their last minute upgrades when the PS4 came out.

There are more than a few things floating around this thread that are just wrong.

Devs do Not have to develop for different systems. They have UWP, write one code and it works for all. Sony does not have that, and does not own anything in the PC place so since MS does, and the game code has already been written, why not release it on the Windows store?

Sony was the first to open this Pandora's box and now it is biting them in the ass. MS is putting out a monster!

And please with Gamestop Best Buy shoppers. I have seen a-holes come out of the wood work to tell an Xbox shopper that PS4 is 40% more powerful. Now different a-holes will come out of the wood work to tell PS Neo shoppers Scorpio is 200% more powerful.

Let's face it the reality of difference between One and Four, is not that big but it still hurt sales. Next consoles will have huge differences. Xbox being weaker will not be an excuse anymore.

And finally Sony will put out PS 5 in 2 years? I hope they do. That sounds disastrous! Most PS4 owners at pissed about Neo. Now after they buy one, PS 5 is coming out?

A high end PC is $500 less than your price range.

The Scorpio was truly a megaton for this year's E3. Sony caught wind of it a few days before E3, they panicked, confirmed the NeO but hid it from sight because of embarrassment as they were shocked and awed on how the hell did MS beat them to the punch and MS having the strongest punch. It really left Sony speechless so that's why they didn't even talk at all during their conference.

Even before the confirmation of the NeO, many developers were already not happy with the NeO because of the policies Sony set. They had to develop around it instead for it. Now with the confirmation of the Scorpio and Microsoft being known for being welcoming and accommodating for developers, many developers will favor the Scorpio and make it the lead platform. I'm no sure what Sony should do now, maybe they should just scrap the whole NeO thing, wait a few more years and come out with a PS5. PSVR is going to fail anyway, so scrap that too and maybe they could just release a slim PS4 with 4K video instead. #GreatmessAwaits

Nope but NX is on my wishlist , and I agree releasing any exclusive wouldn't hurt their sales , PC doesn't belong to Microsoft , Valve or any other companies , even Sony can get into it if they know how

What will happen if Sony decides to put their titles on PC as well?

What intrigues me is the price point of both, SCORPIO and NEO; but SCORPIO sounds really expensive...

@Pedro: I'd disagree with that ... exclusives allow extra attention to the hardware. Not to mention both Sony and MS would spend much less if they weren't trying to push there own ecosystems.

Does it really matter at this point? This isnt ew gen tech. I predict many arent even going to be buying these unless you live in your parents basement, are single with no life, or super rich.

The prospect of buying a whole new console in the same gen for a few fps and a resolution bump for a television i dont own would be well moronic.

If this was a new gen i could see the power difference mean something. But most console owners dont go in for power, they go in for price. Look at the ps4 launch, that $100 difference was everyrhing. If xbone was $400 at launch and ps4 was $500, this gen would be reversed (and if ms didnt screw over gamers with drm announcments and kinnect)

Then you also have to take into account the people already invested in ps4, more than double the bone. These people arent going to drop all their downloaded games and friends list for a bone ver2 with a few more pixels on the same gen. It would be like snes people shelling out for a genesis with 32x combo...it just is not going to happen besides a small minority of loud rich lemmings.

,

@dynamitecop: i agree with you , the thing is i don't think they can nail 4K ... as you know 4K res requires a significant amount of power, unless they tune down the settings ...like 4K on Medium or sth

If the PS4 NEO is priced lower than the X1 Scorpio, the NEO will sell better. 4K in games is still a small market, most people have 1080p TV's, and the people that have 4K TV's use it for movies. At 1080p/60fps, 4.4 TFLOPS in the NEO is enough. Especially considering that all games will still have to be made with the original X1 and PS4 in mind.

We're not far away from a new generation either, so paying too much for an upgraded version of a console now would be pretty stupid.

That what we all wanted right? That's what I was expecting MS to come out swinging, now Sony in turn will attempt to do the same. All we need now is to see the price point and how well these monsters will sell.

I'm buying day 1 just like Ive said for 3 years now.

awwww yeahhhh

@draign: They never will. Not as long as they make hardware.

Games, games, games would make sense if that was how the real world works. Exclusives fall off the sales chart within a month if they ever chart at all. Look at Bloodborne (charted once) Sunset Overdrive (never charted) Forza 6 (never charted) Infamous Second Son (charted once) just to name a few. Exclusives have not pushed console sales for some time now. And lets not act like there are far fewer exclusives now then there have ever been. Multiplats push hardware and sell millions more than exclusives ever will. So why not push to have the best version of those multiplats? Sony having marketing rights to COD is a bigger deal for them revenue wise than Horizon or God of War will ever be.

Bringing up the PS2 era doesn't play any more. Things changed in the 360/PS3 era. People starting caring about things like "the cell processor" and HD graphics. Digital Foundry became a thing. People starting talking about GDDR5 not knowing what the hell it was or what it did. Power means more now than it ever did in terms of marketing and word of mouth. And if M$ can pull a VR deal with Oculus that could be a big blow to Sony. For one, they wouldn't have to spend any R&D, manufacturing or marketing money, and 2 their new box will be far more VR capable.

i wasn't being serious anyways haha

From the size of GDDR5 memory module, Scorpio SoC seems to be smaller than PS4's 348 mm^2. The top picture is 7870/7850 PCB.

The following is PS4's SoC.

Some of fanboys will rage out and threaten Sony that they will sell their PS4s and other people oblivious to this stupid console wars keep playing on the platform they like

Power only matter on SW and other rabid forums. Did I just say that?

But it totally looks like MS was Tired of having the inferior system and decided to end it and bring up a Powerful system. I mean 6 Teraflops is Impressive , it really is .
I'm also sure Sony wanted to reveal PS4 neo in this E3 but after Xbox's conference they panicked and decided not to show anything of it.
There is still a lot to be revealed . Most Important being the PRICE . if Microsoft goes for a really cheap Price for this much power , there is big Win for them . lots of Gamers will Jump and buy that System ( except hardcore Play station fans who hate Microsoft like MS has Stole their Girlfriends or something ) . the Price has to be reasonably cheaper than PC's with the same power so that people don't just upgrade their PCs , specially since all of Xbox's Exclusives are also on PC .
Right now I'm still sticking with PC but if Scorpio's Price and detailed spec impress me then I'm buying one .

@GoldenElementXL: you may be right when it comes to the mindless hordes looking to buy based on power. My answer was for myself, as I tried to make clear. I'm a PC gamer first and foremost, so I have never bought consoles for their power but rather for the unique experiences they could offer (same for PC as well, in fact, [e.g., Total War Warhammer, Starcraft, etc] - the number crunching has never been my thing, but if it were I'd not need consoles at all)

I like consoles because they are potentially a cheap addition to my gaming tech that allows me to expand my library. I have no need for an expensive console whose games are already on my platform

Again, this is strictly speaking for myself- I'm sure you are right that the Scorpio is great ammo for the console wars

Sure, but a $1500-2000 PC is still many times more than $400-500 console.

Sony started the generation having a huge edge on price point. It's certainly possible that the Neo will cost $100 less than the Scorpio. Sony would be fine if that were the case. Microsoft is indicating that "nobody will be left behind" and that they will make all games on the Scorpio playable on the Xbone. That will severely limit the type of games that will show up on the Scorpio. Sony will still have a huge advantage on install base, and if they also have a price advantage on their high-end hardware, the Xbone will remain difficult to sell. Microsoft should have gone all in on a new console.

MS only needs to do 2 things now that Scorpio sent Sony running for the hills.

1. Knock the price of the OG Xbox 1 to $199 and the price of the S model to $249 at next years E3. This will be excellent entry point prices to enter the xbox ecosystem and I bet that it would sell like hot cakes.

2. Wait until Sony announces the price of Neo and the day after, announce the same price point for Scorpio. MS could price out Neo before it launches and kill the one advantage Neo could have over it.

Neo still got advantage over Scorpio, Neo got exclusives...