Final Fantasy brand greatly damaged, says Square CEO

Why do people hate FFXIII so much? It's a good game.

turtlethetaffer

[QUOTE="da_illest101"][QUOTE="commonfate"]

Final Fantasy VII - 10 million copies sold

Metacritic score - 92

Final Fantasy VIII - 8+ million copies sold

Metacritic score - 90

Final Fantasy IX - 5+ million copies sold

Metacritic score - 94

Final Fantasy X - 6+ million copies sold

Metacritic score - 92

Final Fantasy XI - Peaked at 2 million subscriptions. Not sure of actual numbers

Metacritic Score - 85

Final Fantasy XII - 5+ million copies sold

Metacritic Score - 92

Final Fantasy XIII - 6+ million copies sold

Metacritic Score - 83

Final Fantasy XIV - Less than 1 million copies sold

Metacritic Score - 42

Now someone explain to me how any of the titles besides XIV damaged the brand name?

commonfate

I understand that. There are going to be plenty of people who dislike each game on the list but so many people are saying XIII specifically "damaged" the brand name aside from it being a crticial and commercial success.

Some people have a warped idea of fact they tend to get it mixed up with opinion. Thats basicly your answer.

From what I've seen, more damage was done by FFXIII than FFIV.IronBass

[QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

Why do people hate FFXIII so much? It's a good game.

savebattery

story and cahacters are opinions. Repeptitive can be used for all FF then since you basicly walk and fight in all of them over and over. Shallow combat opinion. Barely control over AI is not really a negative look at persona 3. Pacing felt fine put that up for opinion. I dont see the problom with leveling system. Its a fact there were no town but that didint bother me at all. I dont really care about them anymore since the npc in them never are helpful in any way shap or form. You have the right to have these opinions but kinda feels like your trying to pass them off as fact.

-Linear
-Easy
-Bad story, characters
-Extremely repetitive
-Shallow combat, barely in control over AI party members
-Poor pacing
-Leveling system
-No towns

Sure was pretty, though.savebattery

Most FF games are, this one to an extreme rivaling FFX, though.
Not quite. Just right difficulty.
Poorly fleshed out story, character development.
Can't argue it reached that point.
Combat was sufficiently engrossing despite this. AI was more than competent.
Agreed.
No different than FFX, FFXII.
Towns did exist, you just couldn't mingle in them. And story related; they're fugitives.

It darn well was pretty. ;)

They started going downhill after FFVII.

Well announcing a new Final Fantasy game still excites most fans, I think he's talking about 14 and the biggest mistake they are doing is consider/shoehorn an online based FF game as their main numbered games, they should separate the two franchises, this way the brand name for every main FF is as strong as ever.

how about FF online or a subheading for the MMOs?

Come to think of it the only truly great Final Fantasies were 4, 6 and 7.

Cant help but think that most of the 13 haters never actually played the game themselves, or didnt play it much.

Cant help but think that most of the 13 haters never actually played the game themselves, or didnt play it much.

crimsonman1245

I bought the PS3 version and played 37 hours. It sucked. Beautiful. Perhaps the best looking game of this gen. But it sucked.

From what I've seen, more damage was done by FFXIII than FFIV.IronBass

As a longtime FF fan, I'd go much further back and say FFX-2 was the begining of the end. Square/Enix have only themselves to blame. It isn't FF14's fault. If they were still making quality interesting and exciting RPGs that people cared about, people would still be buying them.

well how about this, regardless of what any one persons opinion is(those who say that XIII was a HUGE letdown), on AVERAGE it got reviews around 8.5 by critics and fans, XIV got reviews around the 4.0 range:cry:

Whether you judge these games critically or financially, XIV did far more damage in BOTH categories than XIII ever did.

mztazmz

I already adressed that. It's about expectations. No one expected anything of XIV, and that's why XIII has got much more backlash, despite scoring higher.

[QUOTE="IronBass"]From what I've seen, more damage was done by FFXIII than FFIV.finalfantasy94

Yea cause we all know that a actual broken mess of a game ff14 did less damage then a game which is not broken ff13 and that some people dont like. I mean it just makes perfect sense.....

Cant help but think that most of the 13 haters never actually played the game themselves, or didnt play it much.

crimsonman1245

[QUOTE="finalfantasy94"]

[QUOTE="IronBass"]From what I've seen, more damage was done by FFXIII than FFIV.lightleggy

Yea cause we all know that a actual broken mess of a game ff14 did less damage then a game which is not broken ff13 and that some people dont like. I mean it just makes perfect sense.....

All i heard about FF13 from this post was opinion.

[QUOTE="mztazmz"]well how about this, regardless of what any one persons opinion is(those who say that XIII was a HUGE letdown), on AVERAGE it got reviews around 8.5 by critics and fans, XIV got reviews around the 4.0 range:cry:

Whether you judge these games critically or financially, XIV did far more damage in BOTH categories than XIII ever did.

IronBass

I already adressed that. It's about expectations. No one expected anything of XIV, and that's why XIII has got much more backlash, despite scoring higher.

[QUOTE="IronBass"]From what I've seen, more damage was done by FFXIII than FFIV.ZIMdoom

As a longtime FF fan, I'd go much further back and say FFX-2 was the begining of the end. Square/Enix have only themselves to blame. It isn't FF14's fault. If they were still making quality interesting and exciting RPGs that people cared about, people would still be buying them.

What do you mean people would still be buying them? Final Fantasy XII and XIII sold over 5 million copies each.

You just described majority of JRPGs.finalfantasy94

All this talk of FFXIII damaging the FF brand is nonsense. It sold well and scored well. I seriously doubt that SE lost face over a few forum dwellers' negative comments, half of which were unjustified and uninformed.

The only thing that damaged the FF brand was making some of the main series games MMOs and trying to cater to the Western audiences and being influenced by Western developers.

"We'll continue with our reform work, which basically amounts to fully redoing the game, and hope to revive the FFXIV that should have been released."

I assume by this he means they will just scrap the game and start some other project because there's pretty much no saving it.

[QUOTE="TheGuardian03"]

Is XIV still coming to ps3 after it flopped so hard on the PC ?

Crossel777

Midiswell forget about the PS3 and just be ported to the PS4 then.

Seems to me more that Square Enix as a brand has been damaged, and not just Final Fantasy specifically.

Seems to me more that Square Enix as a brand has been damaged, and not just Final Fantasy specifically.

Ly_the_Fairy

[QUOTE="Ly_the_Fairy"]

Seems to me more that Square Enix as a brand has been damaged, and not just Final Fantasy specifically.

texasgoldrush

translation "I dont like it so it should stay down and dead. Other peoples enjoyment be damed". Which has to be the most silly thing someone can say.

[QUOTE="Johnny_Rock"]

[QUOTE="jwsoul"] Lol it really has not to be honest...... All the way to 13 are quality titles. 8,9,10,12 being incredible as many people state including Fans of the franchise and reviewers. Only thing dead here is your opinion.Chutebox

Way to take this dicussion to the childish. Actually there are many people that share his opinion.

FF9 was by far the best in the series IMO. FFX was the start of their downward spiral. I thought they may have turned things around with FFXII, but then came FFXIII. That game left a very bad taste in my mouth.

Cant help but think that most of the 13 haters never actually played the game themselves, or didnt play it much.

crimsonman1245

It's been greatly damaged by a few games worth of unappealing, boring games with little in the way of role playing. Final Fantasy XIII is extraordinarly bad. Massively budgeted, and yet it has all the important things completely wrong.

JRPGs were a reaction to the limits of the console. Whilst the PC had sprawling adventures with huge inventory screens and dialogue choices and point and click customisation JRPGs had neat menu based games with limited battles and controlled environments. Some of them were genuinely brilliant for their time. Even now I wish they'd make a proper Shining Force as the battles were fun and finding out how your characters would be promoted was exciting. Now the console can handle the larger RPGs the JRPG genre is playing catch up. Only From Software seems to have the right answers although many are attempting to tinker with the formula a little. Final Fantasy has gone backwards instead. An astonishingly limited level of customisation and exploration. No towns or shops.

I'm not saying they had to westernise the franchise, but taking it so far backwards and relying solely on a story which was, at best, divisive, (at worst, an emo mess with unlikeable characters and unbelievable actions) was always going to be a mistake. Evolve the genre. Give people more freedom not less.

Square should take a look at what they've just published in Deus Ex. Real role playing in a game with it's roots in shooters and first person adventures but far more customisation and far more possibilities than FFXIII. You need to be able to imprint yourself on the game or for me it's not an RPG. Whether you are playing the avatar or shepard or a nameless hero you should be able to make that character your own, develop them, develop the story, go back and see what you've missed.Deus Ex gave you plenty of options as to how to proceed and a lot of customisation which tailored the game to your preferences. If you want to stealth, fine, if you don't, fine, if you want to use your wits, fine. And next game will be different.

FFXIII was nothing more than an interactive story and the majority of battle could be beaten by clicking x and I don't want that. I especially don't want that when the story was so terrible.

[QUOTE="mztazmz"]

[QUOTE="LegatoSkyheart"]

It's been dead since 10.

Not everyone liked every Final Fantasy after 10.

WilliamRLBaker

I agree, you just have to remember that the dude with 2 middle initials hates giving Playstation games any credit, no matter how awesome they are8)

Please do tell me how I've said the ps1 was this horrible mess, or the ps2 for that matter...Please come at me bro...show me where I haven't in every single thread that has ever come up why was the ps2 so popular? have replied...Because it had the games or it had amazing games the same for the ps1.

Maybe you need check Current fanboyism has absolutely nothing to do with the past where the ps1 was my system of choice...But oh no it couldn't be that I hate final fantasy 7,8.9,10, 12 and 13. Couldn't possiblybe that I loved final fantasy tactics, parasite eve, xenogears disc 1,bushido blade, bushido blade 2, brave fencer musashi, einhander, and vagrant story all square soft games all on the ps1...:roll:

P.S: I didn't go out a short bit back and get arc the lad collection to play it nope not at all...

So FF died with 7???, May I remind you that 7 got as good or better reviews than all FF games before or since AND is still the best selling FF game of all time by a large margin.

So explain to me how the FF game that turned the series from being a small hit outside Japan into a nearly 10 million selling mega-hit killed the franchise??????????????????????????????????????????????????

and when you say that the PS1 and PS2 had great games, are you implying that the PS3 doesn't? if so LOL, WOW, talk about blind hatred:twisted:

[QUOTE="abuabed"][QUOTE="Marka1700"]For me it died after 10.LeonSykes10

^^^This and only this is why FF has become rather unpleasent, its like trying to make a mario game without miyamoto, this is why resident evil 5 sucked because Shinji Mikami left and the reason the new Ninja gaiden will suck because Itagaki is not at the helm.Sakaguchi was the heart and Uematus was the soul RIP Final Fantasy twas fun while it lasted :cry:

Cant help but think that most of the 13 haters never actually played the game themselves, or didnt play it much.

Why do people hate FFXIII so much? It's a good game.

[QUOTE="LeonSykes10"][QUOTE="abuabed"] For me too :(musalala

^^^This and only this is why FF has become rather unpleasent, its like trying to make a mario game without miyamoto, this is why resident evil 5 sucked because Shinji Mikami left and the reason the new Ninja gaiden will suck because Itagaki is not at the helm.Sakaguchi was the heart and Uematus was the soul RIP Final Fantasy twas fun while it lasted :cry:

[QUOTE="crimsonman1245"] I can't help to think that most of the lovers only loved the game, because it has nice graphics. see i can do that too [QUOTE="savebattery"][QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

Why do people hate FFXIII so much? It's a good game.

da_illest101

The best is when people say "It gets better 60 hours in". As in, in 60 hours, there is a modicum of openness. You have to play the damn game for 60 hours for it to become what most games manage throughout. Yeah there's a plus point.

[QUOTE="Chutebox"][QUOTE="Johnny_Rock"]

Way to take this dicussion to the childish. Actually there are many people that share his opinion.

WilliamRLBaker

i think all the drama is that everyone has a past ff favorite (mine was ff 9 or 6) and then they cry not every ff is like that. Yeah maybe todays final fantasies are not as good as previous ones, but in no way they are bad, they are still great titles. People just take it to the extreme always, and for those who don't like final fantasy well boo hoo, franchise is nowhere near death

[QUOTE="WilliamRLBaker"]

[QUOTE="Chutebox"] And there are that many more...and more that don't.Krelian-co

i think all the drama is that everyone has a past ff favorite (mine was ff 9 or 6) and then they cry not every ff is like that. Yeah maybe todays final fantasies are not as good as previous ones, but in no way they are bad, they are still great titles. People just take it to the extreme always, and for those who don't like final fantasy well boo hoo, franchise is nowhere near death

[QUOTE="WilliamRLBaker"][QUOTE="mztazmz"]I agree, you just have to remember that the dude with 2 middle initials hates giving Playstation games any credit, no matter how awesome they are8)mztazmz

People woundn't have a problem with any FF game, if they weren't all given the name Final Fantasy. I know a lot of original ip jrpgs that people worship that aren't all that great. Final fantasy always has the big shoe filling job due to its name. Change the name of ffx to Zanarkand, people would be like "that was a nice liddle game." they wouldn't compare it to previous releases of a series making it feel underwhelming.

Of course the sales would be as low as original jrpg ips

[QUOTE="Krelian-co"]

[QUOTE="WilliamRLBaker"] I think if the ones that loved ff7 didn't spend more time doing polls we'd actually have a chance to see a decent fair poll otherwise its filled with people that justknee jerk reaction pick ff7.

fadersdream

i think all the drama is that everyone has a past ff favorite (mine was ff 9 or 6) and then they cry not every ff is like that. Yeah maybe todays final fantasies are not as good as previous ones, but in no way they are bad, they are still great titles. People just take it to the extreme always, and for those who don't like final fantasy well boo hoo, franchise is nowhere near death

really? i played most rpgs since its my favorite genre, specially jrpgs since i was a kid, and i enjoyed every final fantasy (not xi or xiv never played them) and ff xiii was not as good but still enjoyable. So don't come with that crap, they had their golden age in ps1/ps2 era i agree, but "nothing worth" is an obvious fanboy exageration.

Meh, they should just do another FF like VII was and all will be fine.

nameless12345

I feel like Square were trying too hard to make the storyline in FFXIII "emotional" the only part that made me a little bit sad was the end.

The bad part of the game that i felt no connection to the characters like the other Final Fantasy's & the conversations were soo boring.other than that it wasn't so bad.

[QUOTE="LeonSykes10"][QUOTE="abuabed"] For me too :(musalala

^^^This and only this is why FF has become rather unpleasent, its like trying to make a mario game without miyamoto, this is why resident evil 5 sucked because Shinji Mikami left and the reason the new Ninja gaiden will suck because Itagaki is not at the helm.Sakaguchi was the heart and Uematus was the soul RIP Final Fantasy twas fun while it lasted :cry: