Halo 3 single player = BAD
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[QUOTE="jangojay"]
Really? I suggest you play starcraft and go through the story, it's basically everyone vs zerg but nice try though.FrozenLiquid
Know your Science Fiction:
Starship Troopers is the granddaddy of all military Sci Fi stories.
Read through taht story, and look at how much SC has ripped off.
For creating zerg yes I agree with that but protoss? nope.
[QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="jangojay"][QUOTE="Apathetic-Irony"][QUOTE="jangojay"][QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="glitchgeeman"]I totally agree. I cannot see how anyone but sci-fi nerds can think Halo 3 has an even remotely redeemable story. The campaign was so bad that I literally had zero motivation to finish it and I probably wouldn't have if not for the hidden skulls to unlock the Hyabusa armor. The campaign's gameplay is great and action-packed, don't get me wrong, but if there's one thing I can't stand, it's a story in which the main character is completely flat, devoid of emotion or depth, also lacking any sort of character development throughout the entire series.The entirestory is full of weak points. There are no compelling characters, the enemies have almost no depth to them, and the general setting is horribly unoriginal.
And NO, don't tell me to read the goddamn novels. I've read them and they do add depth to the story, but when it comes to judging a game's story, I base it on its own merits, not those of a novel, which requires a good story.
jangojay
Halo has one of the most interesting sci fi stories of modern times. It's a refreshing military sci fi romp. If you want me to explain it to you in comparison to science fiction over the years, then just ask.
Oh, and I won't tell you to read the novels. But really, it seems like you haven't at all. It doesn't add depth to the story at all. Epic fail there bud.
Starcraft has an interesting story. Remove flood and halo has another run of the mill super soldier story(Even though that's the current situation even WITH the flood)
That's like suggesting to remove the Zerg from Starcraft and then claiming it's just your run of the mill humans vs aliens RTS.
Really? I suggest you play starcraft and go through the story, it's basically everyone vs zerg but nice try though.
...Wow, I'm really REALLY hoping you're just pretending to be this ignorant. You completely missedhis point. :|
Not really because in the case of SC if you even if you remove zerg, there are still things that linger around that make the story interesting. I.E the internal conflicts with the terrans, the protoss dealings with the dark templars etc etc.
Master Chief, Humans being on the brink of destruction, Covenant, Covenant Holy War, Covenant Civil war, etc etc.
Not really because in the case of SC if you even if you remove zerg, there are still things that linger around that make the story interesting. I.E the internal conflicts with the terrans, the protoss dealings with the dark templars etc etc.
jangojay
And with Halo, you have the fragile alliance between the Sangheili and humans, the Covenant civil war, the backstory of the Forerunners, etc. et.c Ta da.
[QUOTE="jangojay"]Not really because in the case of SC if you even if you remove zerg, there are still things that linger around that make the story interesting. I.E the internal conflicts with the terrans, the protoss dealings with the dark templars etc etc.
Verge_6
And with Halo, you have the fragile alliance between the Sangheili and humans, the Covenant civil war, the backstory of the Forerunners, etc. et.c Ta da.
You could say that, if the story of the game didn't focus around one person. and I have to ask this but why didn't the humans make more master chiefs?
[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="jangojay"]
Really? I suggest you play starcraft and go through the story, it's basically everyone vs zerg but nice try though.jangojay
Know your Science Fiction:
Starship Troopers is the granddaddy of all military Sci Fi stories.
Read through taht story, and look at how much SC has ripped off.
For creating zerg yes I agree with that but protoss? nope.
Had fun watching the movie?
Now read the book that inspired it. The arachnids are nothing like the ones seen in the movies.
Oh, and a three sided war. With alliances made.
Hmmm......
dude whatever im tired of arguing with someone across the country... for some strange reason its not that gratifying.. u claimed i never played it and i own it (sorry i even bought it). im not gonna reply to this thread anymore. I gave my opinion on page 6 i beleive and take it in clearly because its true to a T. anyone who really "follows the game" can see that.mclovin401
Quit dodging my question. How can a person who has supposedly played ALL three Halos not even know the MC's gender and species?
[QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="jangojay"]Not really because in the case of SC if you even if you remove zerg, there are still things that linger around that make the story interesting. I.E the internal conflicts with the terrans, the protoss dealings with the dark templars etc etc.
jangojay
And with Halo, you have the fragile alliance between the Sangheili and humans, the Covenant civil war, the backstory of the Forerunners, etc. et.c Ta da.
You could say that, if the story of the game didn't focus around one person. and I have to ask this but why didn't the humans make more master chiefs?
You didn't even need to read the books to.....omg....
In the damn manual: You are the last Spartan.
Jesus.
Stop talking.
[QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="jangojay"]Not really because in the case of SC if you even if you remove zerg, there are still things that linger around that make the story interesting. I.E the internal conflicts with the terrans, the protoss dealings with the dark templars etc etc.
jangojay
And with Halo, you have the fragile alliance between the Sangheili and humans, the Covenant civil war, the backstory of the Forerunners, etc. et.c Ta da.
You could say that, if the story of the game didn't focus around one person. and I have to ask this but why didn't the humans make more master chiefs?
They did. They all died. Master Chief (the one you play) apparently had luck. The first 2 seconds of Halo 3 said so, I guess. That's why he's still alive.
Luck.
Go see Match Point. That's a movie about luck. Girl dies because she doesn't have any. Guy wins because he does. Luck. Lucky Number Slevin is another. Though that's not much about luck. You just think it is. Good movie. Match Point was bad, but the ending was good. Luck.
[QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="jangojay"]Not really because in the case of SC if you even if you remove zerg, there are still things that linger around that make the story interesting. I.E the internal conflicts with the terrans, the protoss dealings with the dark templars etc etc.
jangojay
And with Halo, you have the fragile alliance between the Sangheili and humans, the Covenant civil war, the backstory of the Forerunners, etc. et.c Ta da.
You could say that, if the story of the game didn't focus around one person. and I have to ask this but why didn't the humans make more master chiefs?
First, let me apologize for the hostile tone of my first post towards you. I thought you were that mclovin poser.
They actually did make more Spartans. A few dozen, and maybe even a hundred, if memory serves me correctly. Quite a few were killed, or listed as MIA (Which is UNSC protocol, as a Spartan death would be a big blow to the already low Terran morale), but it is confirmed that at least a few others survived. It is rather odd that none of them are even mentioned in the games, I have to admit.
[QUOTE="jangojay"][QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="jangojay"]Not really because in the case of SC if you even if you remove zerg, there are still things that linger around that make the story interesting. I.E the internal conflicts with the terrans, the protoss dealings with the dark templars etc etc.
Verge_6
And with Halo, you have the fragile alliance between the Sangheili and humans, the Covenant civil war, the backstory of the Forerunners, etc. et.c Ta da.
You could say that, if the story of the game didn't focus around one person. and I have to ask this but why didn't the humans make more master chiefs?
First, let me apologize for the hostile tone of my first post towards you. I thought you were that mclovin poser.
They actually did make more Spartans. A few dozen, and maybe even a hundred, if memory serves me correctly. Quite a few were killed, or listed as MIA (Which is UNSC protocol, as a Spartan death would be a big blow to the already low Terran morale), but it is confirmed that at least a few others survived. It is rather odd that none of them are even mentioned in the games, I have to admit.
Book lore others are alive. In the game world, the Master Chief is the only surviving Spartan.
First, let me apologize for the hostile tone of my first post towards you. I thought you were that mclovin poser.
They actually did make more Spartans. A few dozen, and maybe even a hundred, if memory serves me correctly. Quite a few were killed, or listed as MIA (Which is UNSC protocol, as a Spartan death would be a big blow to the already low Terran morale), but it is confirmed that at least a few others survived. It is rather odd that none of them are even mentioned in the games, I have to admit.
Verge_6
Funnily enough you got Eric Nylund trying to weave his story into the main plot. Lord Hood knew about three other Spartans that left just before MC came to Earth in Halo 3.
I think Bungie just wanted to keep it simple and not bring in any new stuff that seemed overwhelming for the majority of the audience.
[QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="jangojay"][QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="jangojay"]Not really because in the case of SC if you even if you remove zerg, there are still things that linger around that make the story interesting. I.E the internal conflicts with the terrans, the protoss dealings with the dark templars etc etc.
Apathetic-Irony
And with Halo, you have the fragile alliance between the Sangheili and humans, the Covenant civil war, the backstory of the Forerunners, etc. et.c Ta da.
You could say that, if the story of the game didn't focus around one person. and I have to ask this but why didn't the humans make more master chiefs?
First, let me apologize for the hostile tone of my first post towards you. I thought you were that mclovin poser.
They actually did make more Spartans. A few dozen, and maybe even a hundred, if memory serves me correctly. Quite a few were killed, or listed as MIA (Which is UNSC protocol, as a Spartan death would be a big blow to the already low Terran morale), but it is confirmed that at least a few others survived. It is rather odd that none of them are even mentioned in the games, I have to admit.
Book lore others are alive. In the game world, the Master Chief is the only surviving Spartan.
I don't really take the manual as a determining factor, sorry. >_>
OMFG a forerunner..... who were the forerunners????????? the people who built the halos............. i ask again.... who were the forerunners????mclovin401
STORY SUCKS FAT ANAL CAVITY........
(door closes behind me)
mclovin401
You don't even know it. Seriously, I'm laughing at you.
Book lore others are alive. In the game world, the Master Chief is the only surviving Spartan.
Apathetic-Irony
Both in the same lore.
You're the last known one, or were the last known one at the start of the Halo plot.
They just didn't introduce the rest back into the plot.
Oh, and there are Spartan IIIs. But they're top secret.
[QUOTE="Apathetic-Irony"][QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="jangojay"][QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="jangojay"]Not really because in the case of SC if you even if you remove zerg, there are still things that linger around that make the story interesting. I.E the internal conflicts with the terrans, the protoss dealings with the dark templars etc etc.
Verge_6
And with Halo, you have the fragile alliance between the Sangheili and humans, the Covenant civil war, the backstory of the Forerunners, etc. et.c Ta da.
You could say that, if the story of the game didn't focus around one person. and I have to ask this but why didn't the humans make more master chiefs?
First, let me apologize for the hostile tone of my first post towards you. I thought you were that mclovin poser.
They actually did make more Spartans. A few dozen, and maybe even a hundred, if memory serves me correctly. Quite a few were killed, or listed as MIA (Which is UNSC protocol, as a Spartan death would be a big blow to the already low Terran morale), but it is confirmed that at least a few others survived. It is rather odd that none of them are even mentioned in the games, I have to admit.
Book lore others are alive. In the game world, the Master Chief is the only surviving Spartan.
I don't really take the manual as a determining factor, sorry. >_>
Um, no. It's stated several times, and by Bungie, that in the game universe there is only ONE surviving Spartan.
[QUOTE="Apathetic-Irony"]Book lore others are alive. In the game world, the Master Chief is the only surviving Spartan.
FrozenLiquid
Both in the same lore.
You're the last known one, or were the last known one at the start of the Halo plot.
They just didn't introduce the rest back into the plot.
Oh, and there are Spartan IIIs. But they're top secret.
There are contredictions between the normal Halo plot and the book plot. For example, what was already stated: Lord Hood knowing about 3 other Spartans. The books can be seen as an expansion of the Halo game universe, but really, the other Spartans were merely added for character. In the game universe, there is one, and only one, surviving Spartan.
[QUOTE="mclovin401"]OMFG a forerunner..... who were the forerunners????????? the people who built the halos............. i ask again.... who were the forerunners????Verge_6
STORY SUCKS FAT ANAL CAVITY........
(door closes behind me)
mclovin401
You don't even know it. Seriously, I'm laughing at you.
Should I spoil it? :D
[QUOTE="Apathetic-Irony"]Um, no. It's stated several times, and by Bungie, that in the game universe there is only ONE surviving Spartan.
Verge_6
One KNOWN surviving SPartan. Key word there.
Okay, fine. There are billions of them floating out in space having no effect on the story. No, TRILLIONS! There is a solar system where the planets and stars (there are two stars in this system!) are MADE of Spartans. Yet it has no effect on the Halo game universe.
[QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="Apathetic-Irony"]Um, no. It's stated several times, and by Bungie, that in the game universe there is only ONE surviving Spartan.
Apathetic-Irony
One KNOWN surviving SPartan. Key word there.
Okay, fine. There are billions of them floating out in space having no effect on the story. No, TRILLIONS! There is a solar system where the planets and stars (there are two stars in this system!) are MADE of Spartans. Yet it has no effect on the Halo game universe.
If that were in the novels, it could very well be.
[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="Apathetic-Irony"]Book lore others are alive. In the game world, the Master Chief is the only surviving Spartan.
Apathetic-Irony
Both in the same lore.
You're the last known one, or were the last known one at the start of the Halo plot.
They just didn't introduce the rest back into the plot.
Oh, and there are Spartan IIIs. But they're top secret.
There are contredictions between the normal Halo plot and the book plot. For example, what was already stated: Lord Hood knowing about 3 other Spartans. The books can be seen as an expansion of the Halo game universe, but really, the other Spartans were merely added for character. In the game universe, there is one, and only one, surviving Spartan.
Yes, Lord Hood knew about three other Spartans.
How's that a contradiction though?
He just never mentioned them in Halo 3. Doesn't mean anything however.
Bungie actually created the stories that Eric Nylund wrote. He has to abide by their "Halo bible".
[QUOTE="Apathetic-Irony"][QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="Apathetic-Irony"]Book lore others are alive. In the game world, the Master Chief is the only surviving Spartan.
FrozenLiquid
Both in the same lore.
You're the last known one, or were the last known one at the start of the Halo plot.
They just didn't introduce the rest back into the plot.
Oh, and there are Spartan IIIs. But they're top secret.
There are contredictions between the normal Halo plot and the book plot. For example, what was already stated: Lord Hood knowing about 3 other Spartans. The books can be seen as an expansion of the Halo game universe, but really, the other Spartans were merely added for character. In the game universe, there is one, and only one, surviving Spartan.
Yes, Lord Hood knew about three other Spartans.
How's that a contradiction though?
He just never mentioned them in Halo 3. Doesn't mean anything however.
Bungie actually created the stories that Eric Nylund wrote. He has to abide by their "Halo bible".
Yes, but not all of it translates into the games. It's kinda why you don't see any other Spartans in the Halo games and why Master Chief is supposed to be the last Spartan. Oh, excuse me, known Spartan. But if Lord Hood knows about the three others, doesn't mean 3 others are known? Thus they're unknown, yet known, thus becoming a contrediction like I said?
Yes, but not all of it translates into the games. It's kinda why you don't see any other Spartans in the Halo games and why Master Chief is supposed to be the last Spartan. Oh, excuse me, known Spartan. But if Lord Hood knows about the three others, doesn't mean 3 others are known? Thus they're unknown, yet known, thus becoming a contrediction like I said?
Apathetic-Irony
Actually, the beginning of Halo 3 should've made it clear all the other Halo media is canon. Halo 3 begins after a comic book series by Marvel, which is just as secondary as the other novels.
Plus, just because Lord Hood knows the three Spartans exist doesn't mean they're officially recognized as well. The whole idea of Spartans is fishy.
Actually mc is the last known spartan because whats left of them are trapped in onyx. nobody knows if they are still alive or not. and i believe, if my memory is correct, that this has been the case even prior to halo:ceYD_11
I don't usually post in SW because I'll probably end up as flamebait, but here goes... Ghosts of Onyx spoiler warning!
Can someone clarify... is Onyx the same thing as "shield world"? If the Spartans went through that portal (which Kurt closed in the end), where did they end up? In the end of the novel, they are alive, minus a Spartan we love.
nobody knows if they are still alive or not. and i believe, if my memory is correct, that this has been the case even prior to halo:ce
Are you saying that they don't know if they were alive prior to Halo: CE? Or that the events (being on Onyx) happened before H:CE? They returned to Earth to fight the Covenant (this is during Halo 2, then), and Lord Hood sends them to aid Kelly and Dr. Halsey.
[QUOTE="skrat_01"][QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="Ninja-Vox"]I think it's awesome. The only level on the game which was any less than fantastic was Cortana.Verge_6
EVERY game has that one level that is just nightmare-inducing. Half Life 2 had Sandtrap, HL:E2 had the Strider defense level, the previous Halos had the libraries, Bioshock had the park level, GRAW had Chapultapec...the list goes on.
The Strider defense level is known for being freaking awesome - one of the best in the HL series :shock:How is it nightmare inducing??!?!?
For me, it was due to those Hunters hitting the explosive device each and EVERY time.
Ahh the trick is to kill the hunters first - run them down in the car, then blow up the strider.Their shots are supposed to be able to intercept those sticky bombs ;)
Actually its not just the incoherant, and poor story and plot that bothered me... It was the inconsistant level design.
My favourite chapters:
Tsavo Highway
The Storm
The Ark
The Covenant
Now these levels have their ups and downs, but damn the others are TRASH is comparison.
The problem is the pacing is a bit off, as is the deisgn - repedative - A to B.
However on Co-op it makes a WORLD of difference.
On SP they are a chore, on co-op they are enjoyable.
Take the Scarab battle in the Covenant stage.
Flying a hornet, with two mates riding shot gun, and having them jump off onto scarabs as you pass over, is awesome. However the repedative corridor trudging is increadably dull.
Actually its not just the incoherant, and poor story and plot that bothered me... It was the inconsistant level design.
My favourite chapters:
Tsavo Highway
The Storm
The Ark
The CovenantNow these levels have their ups and downs, but damn the others are TRASH is comparison.
The problem is the pacing is a bit off, as is the deisgn - repedative - A to B.However on Co-op it makes a WORLD of difference.
On SP they are a chore, on co-op they are enjoyable.Take the Scarab battle in the Covenant stage.
Flying a hornet, with two mates riding shot gun, and having them jump off onto scarabs as you pass over, is awesome. However the repedative corridor trudging is increadably dull.skrat_01
You're being a little incoherent as to whether you like Halo story or not yourself. Makes me skeptical sometimes.
Boy if you think pacing is off in Halo then I don't know what the hell you're gonna be thinking of Half Life 2. If anything, Bungie are makers of the best paced games in the world. Save for that one level where they tried to use just the Cortana/Gravemind relays to break up the pace in "Cortana", everything else was not too long, and not too short. Just when you think the pace should change, they do so. That's one of the greatest things Bungie can do that no one ever seems to notice.
By the way it's repetative. Sorry but it doesn't sound right for an Australian to be saying that lol.
[QUOTE="skrat_01"]Actually its not just the incoherant, and poor story and plot that bothered me... It was the inconsistant level design.
My favourite chapters:
Tsavo Highway
The Storm
The Ark
The CovenantNow these levels have their ups and downs, but damn the others are TRASH is comparison.
The problem is the pacing is a bit off, as is the deisgn - repedative - A to B.However on Co-op it makes a WORLD of difference.
On SP they are a chore, on co-op they are enjoyable.Take the Scarab battle in the Covenant stage.
Flying a hornet, with two mates riding shot gun, and having them jump off onto scarabs as you pass over, is awesome. However the repedative corridor trudging is increadably dull.FrozenLiquid
You're being a little incoherent as to whether you like Halo story or not yourself. Makes me skeptical sometimes.
Boy if you think pacing is off in Halo then I don't know what the hell you're gonna be thinking of Half Life 2. If anything, Bungie are makers of the best paced games in the world. Save for that one level where they tried to use just the Cortana/Gravemind relays to break up the pace in "Cortana", everything else was not too long, and not too short. Just when you think the pace should change, they do so. That's one of the greatest things Bungie can do that no one ever seems to notice.
By the way it's repetative. Sorry but it doesn't sound right for an Australian to be saying that lol.
Huh?
Pacing was actually one of the major flaws that I noticed in Halo 3 because of playing Half-Life 2: Episode 2. There's an element of subjectivity to it, I guess, but it felt to me like the pacing wasn't quite as well orchestrated. Half-Life 2 does a great job of breaking up the action constantly, while parts of Halo 3 did not do anywhere near as good a job. Halo 3 is better paced than Halo 2, I guess, but a lot of levels are very straightforward and don't feel as varied as what you face in Half-Life. The beginning portion of the game is like this, and the Flood levels are pretty straightforward as well.
There are some sections in the middle of the game where Halo 3 really hits its stride in pacing (basically all the stuff set on The Ark), but otherwise, it's nowhere near as refined as what Valve puts out regularly.
honest to God, it's downright mediocre...the only reason to get Halo 3 is the great multiplayer..who else agrees the single player is bad and the multiplayer is much more entertaining?
DRAGONPIECEZ
I actually thought the single player was good, definitely better than halo 2. A lot of the set battles were awesome especially the party where the Dawn drops in 3 tanks and 2 warthogs and you fight 2 scarabs + wraiths + phantoms. And you can do everything on COOP as well.
But multiplayer is fun too.
Huh?
Pacing was actually one of the major flaws that I noticed in Halo 3 because of playing Half-Life 2: Episode 2. There's an element of subjectivity to it, I guess, but it felt to me like the pacing wasn't quite as well orchestrated. Half-Life 2 does a great job of breaking up the action constantly, while parts of Halo 3 did not do anywhere near as good a job. Halo 3 is better paced than Halo 2, I guess, but a lot of levels are very straightforward and don't feel as varied as what you face in Half-Life. The beginning portion of the game is like this, and the Flood levels are pretty straightforward as well.
There are some sections in the middle of the game where Halo 3 really hits its stride in pacing (basically all the stuff set on The Ark), but otherwise, it's nowhere near as refined as what Valve puts out regularly.
sonicmj1
I've yet to finish Episode 2, purely because of the predecessors I played through again. Thought it was a good idea. But eh.... sometimes it isn't lol.
The overly long vehicle sequences in HL2 -- in fact, there are quite a few sequences in HL2 that just seemed way too long for its own good. It's one of the more frequent criticisms of the game that HL2 has some very odd pacing indeed.
In fact one of the reviews of the Orange Box on one of the sites talked about "odd pacing" in Half Life 2.
[QUOTE="sonicmj1"]Huh?
Pacing was actually one of the major flaws that I noticed in Halo 3 because of playing Half-Life 2: Episode 2. There's an element of subjectivity to it, I guess, but it felt to me like the pacing wasn't quite as well orchestrated. Half-Life 2 does a great job of breaking up the action constantly, while parts of Halo 3 did not do anywhere near as good a job. Halo 3 is better paced than Halo 2, I guess, but a lot of levels are very straightforward and don't feel as varied as what you face in Half-Life. The beginning portion of the game is like this, and the Flood levels are pretty straightforward as well.
There are some sections in the middle of the game where Halo 3 really hits its stride in pacing (basically all the stuff set on The Ark), but otherwise, it's nowhere near as refined as what Valve puts out regularly.
FrozenLiquid
I've yet to finish Episode 2, purely because of the predecessors I played through again. Thought it was a good idea. But eh.... sometimes it isn't lol.
The overly long vehicle sequences in HL2 -- in fact, there are quite a few sequences in HL2 that just seemed way too long for its own good. It's one of the more frequent criticisms of the game that HL2 has some very odd pacing indeed.
In fact one of the reviews of the Orange Box on one of the sites talked about "odd pacing" in Half Life 2.
Half-Life 2 has some pacing flaws, I'll give you that. Both vehicle sequences are too long for their own good, for example. They're the only real blemish on the game, in my opinion.
They tightened the pacing a lot in the episodes, and it's noticeable. There's basically no filler.
Half-Life 2 has some pacing flaws, I'll give you that. Both vehicle sequences are too long for their own good, for example. They're the only real blemish on the game, in my opinion.
They tightened the pacing a lot in the episodes, and it's noticeable. There's basically no filler.
sonicmj1
Can't say for Ep 2 coz I'm not too far into it, but yeah, Episode One is a little better. But that's too short to be any real significance.
However, it does have that "escort" thing which I think could've done without a backtrack or two. Sure, the Combine mixed it up but damn I remember I was so waiting for that to end.
Episode One funnily enough also has my most favourite FPS moment ever: When Alyx scares you in the dark. Goddamn girl, quit it! lol.
[QUOTE="sonicmj1"]Half-Life 2 has some pacing flaws, I'll give you that. Both vehicle sequences are too long for their own good, for example. They're the only real blemish on the game, in my opinion.
They tightened the pacing a lot in the episodes, and it's noticeable. There's basically no filler.
FrozenLiquid
Can't say for Ep 2 coz I'm not too far into it, but yeah, Episode One is a little better. But that's too short to be any real significance.
However, it does have that "escort" thing which I think could've done without a backtrack or two. Sure, the Combine mixed it up but damn I remember I was so waiting for that to end.
Episode One funnily enough also has my most favourite FPS moment ever: When Alyx scares you in the dark. Goddamn girl, quit it! lol.
That last escort part was a tad long, though they do work to mix things up each time. Not as bad as the vehicle bits were, but it's still imperfect. However, I can't think of any bit in Episode 2 that I'd say goes on for too long. Maybe the antlion tunnels early on, but it's really nitpicking at that point.
I love the Lowlife chapter in Episode 1. Lots of great encounters in that part.
[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="sonicmj1"]Half-Life 2 has some pacing flaws, I'll give you that. Both vehicle sequences are too long for their own good, for example. They're the only real blemish on the game, in my opinion.
They tightened the pacing a lot in the episodes, and it's noticeable. There's basically no filler.
sonicmj1
Can't say for Ep 2 coz I'm not too far into it, but yeah, Episode One is a little better. But that's too short to be any real significance.
However, it does have that "escort" thing which I think could've done without a backtrack or two. Sure, the Combine mixed it up but damn I remember I was so waiting for that to end.
Episode One funnily enough also has my most favourite FPS moment ever: When Alyx scares you in the dark. Goddamn girl, quit it! lol.
That last escort part was a tad long, though they do work to mix things up each time. Not as bad as the vehicle bits were, but it's still imperfect. However, I can't think of any bit in Episode 2 that I'd say goes on for too long. Maybe the antlion tunnels early on, but it's really nitpicking at that point.
I love the Lowlife chapter in Episode 1. Lots of great encounters in that part.
Yeah the Zombie instances in Ep One were more interesting than in HL2.
Oh, that was another imperfect section in HL2 I think. I was so damn relieved when I saw the light at the end of the tunnel after that heavy Zombie section.
[QUOTE="skrat_01"]Actually its not just the incoherant, and poor story and plot that bothered me... It was the inconsistant level design.
My favourite chapters:
Tsavo Highway
The Storm
The Ark
The CovenantNow these levels have their ups and downs, but damn the others are TRASH is comparison.
The problem is the pacing is a bit off, as is the deisgn - repedative - A to B.However on Co-op it makes a WORLD of difference.
On SP they are a chore, on co-op they are enjoyable.Take the Scarab battle in the Covenant stage.
Flying a hornet, with two mates riding shot gun, and having them jump off onto scarabs as you pass over, is awesome. However the repedative corridor trudging is increadably dull.FrozenLiquid
You're being a little incoherent as to whether you like Halo story or not yourself. Makes me skeptical sometimes.
Boy if you think pacing is off in Halo then I don't know what the hell you're gonna be thinking of Half Life 2. If anything, Bungie are makers of the best paced games in the world. Save for that one level where they tried to use just the Cortana/Gravemind relays to break up the pace in "Cortana", everything else was not too long, and not too short. Just when you think the pace should change, they do so. That's one of the greatest things Bungie can do that no one ever seems to notice.
By the way it's repetative. Sorry but it doesn't sound right for an Australian to be saying that lol.
Heheh, I couldn't help but chuckle at a few points.First off, I think Halo's story as a concept down on paper is good. It is abysmally presented and explained in the games, thus making it feel non existent.
As for the pacing LOL. Bungie is FAR from the 'best paced game' makers. Seriously FAR. The pacing of Halo Ce was good, Halo 2s was WAY off, and Halo 3s was well paced, and woefully paced. Valve in comparison are FAR better at pacing their games.
A playthrough of Episode 2 confirmed that for me. Bungie simply stick encounter, encounter, driving section - while moving between point A and B. Valve throw in a variety of situations, tasks, scripted sequences, puzzles and enemies to keep it well paced, and interesting.
As for repetative - well i let the spell checker do my work.
I will give you that Bungie make very nice lengthy levels, that are enjoyable to play, but seriously their pacing is a big ho-hum.
Sometimes they nail it - other times its downright dodgy.
edit*
I do agree that HL2s pace is off at few points. The episodes certainly nailed it though.
[QUOTE="sonicmj1"][QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="sonicmj1"]Half-Life 2 has some pacing flaws, I'll give you that. Both vehicle sequences are too long for their own good, for example. They're the only real blemish on the game, in my opinion.
They tightened the pacing a lot in the episodes, and it's noticeable. There's basically no filler.
FrozenLiquid
Can't say for Ep 2 coz I'm not too far into it, but yeah, Episode One is a little better. But that's too short to be any real significance.
However, it does have that "escort" thing which I think could've done without a backtrack or two. Sure, the Combine mixed it up but damn I remember I was so waiting for that to end.
Episode One funnily enough also has my most favourite FPS moment ever: When Alyx scares you in the dark. Goddamn girl, quit it! lol.
That last escort part was a tad long, though they do work to mix things up each time. Not as bad as the vehicle bits were, but it's still imperfect. However, I can't think of any bit in Episode 2 that I'd say goes on for too long. Maybe the antlion tunnels early on, but it's really nitpicking at that point.
I love the Lowlife chapter in Episode 1. Lots of great encounters in that part.
Yeah the Zombie instances in Ep One were more interesting than in HL2.
Oh, that was another imperfect section in HL2 I think. I was so damn relieved when I saw the light at the end of the tunnel after that heavy Zombie section.
Ravenholm? The parts in the town were good, but adding the mine on top of that was a bit much.
I think you'll enjoy Episode 2 a lot. There are a ton of really unique situations that are a lot of fun, much better vehicle sections, and plenty of juicy story to chew on.
I've gotta get some sleep.
Heheh, I couldn't help but chuckle at a few points.
First off, I think Halo's story as a concept down on paper is good. It is abysmally presented and explained in the games, thus making it feel non existent.
As for the pacing LOL. Bungie is FAR from the 'best paced game' makers. Seriously FAR. The pacing of Halo Ce was good, Halo 2s was WAY off, and Halo 3s was well paced, and woefully paced. Valve in comparison are FAR better at pacing their games.
A playthrough of Episode 2 confirmed that for me. Bungie simply stick encounter, encounter, driving section - while moving between point A and B. Valve throw in a variety of situations, tasks, scripted sequences, puzzles and enemies to keep it well paced, and interesting.As for repetative - well i let the spell checker do my work.
I will give you that Bungie make very nice lengthy levels, that are enjoyable to play, but seriously their pacing is a big ho-hum.
Sometimes they nail it - other times its downright dodgy.skrat_01
Pacing is not dictated by variety. It simply the skill of breaking up sections into sizeable chunks that don't seem too short or tedious. You can have a perfectly paced game simply with mindless shooting. It's how you change it up a bit that's the key. Yes, Valve throw in quite a bit of variety. Yet their vehicle sequence in HL2 threw the pacing off considerably. Also that sequence after Ravenholm in the mines.
Why are you confusing length with pace? A level can be long or it can be short. Doesn't necessarily make it well paced at all.
Ravenholm? The parts in the town were good, but adding the mine on top of that was a bit much.
I think you'll enjoy Episode 2 a lot. There are a ton of really unique situations that are a lot of fun, much better vehicle sections, and plenty of juicy story to chew on.
I've gotta get some sleep.
sonicmj1
I don't consider the mines part of Ravenholm lol.
Ravenholm good. Mines bad lol.
Yeah okay. See ya later!
[QUOTE="skrat_01"]Heheh, I couldn't help but chuckle at a few points.
First off, I think Halo's story as a concept down on paper is good. It is abysmally presented and explained in the games, thus making it feel non existent.
As for the pacing LOL. Bungie is FAR from the 'best paced game' makers. Seriously FAR. The pacing of Halo Ce was good, Halo 2s was WAY off, and Halo 3s was well paced, and woefully paced. Valve in comparison are FAR better at pacing their games.
A playthrough of Episode 2 confirmed that for me. Bungie simply stick encounter, encounter, driving section - while moving between point A and B. Valve throw in a variety of situations, tasks, scripted sequences, puzzles and enemies to keep it well paced, and interesting.As for repetative - well i let the spell checker do my work.
I will give you that Bungie make very nice lengthy levels, that are enjoyable to play, but seriously their pacing is a big ho-hum.
Sometimes they nail it - other times its downright dodgy.FrozenLiquid
Pacing is not dictated by variety. It simply the skill of breaking up sections into sizeable chunks that don't seem too short or tedious. You can have a perfectly paced game simply with mindless shooting. It's how you change it up a bit that's the key. Yes, Valve throw in quite a bit of variety. Yet their vehicle sequence in HL2 threw the pacing off considerably. Also that sequence after Ravenholm in the mines.
Why are you confusing length with pace? A level can be long or it can be short. Doesn't necessarily make it well paced at all.
Indeed that is what Pace is. However you must remember that variety helps the pace.E.g. the Puzzle sections in HL are a breather between fights, that gets 'prepared' for the next encounter.
Indeed the vehicle sections in HL2 were a bit too long, though had some exellent moments (e.g. the zombie, car pileup tunnel in while your in the Jeep - crazy stuff).
Im not confusing length with Pace. Im simply saying that Bungies lengthy levels are enjoyable.
And yes a well paced level can be long and just fine. Heck look at HL2s chapters / levels, they are huge.
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