Halo is not a proven AAA franchise yet

I wasn't expecting this kind of post from a Mod. The part that instantly stood out is that Casey mentions Halo Wars as part of the series. Part of the Franchise? yes. Part of the series? no, Wars is an RTS made by Ensemble Studios, NOT Bungie. As a result, it is part of the Halo Franchise, but definately not the series. Were HW to flop, Bungie wouldn't be tarnished.

Secondly, Not only because of the previous games, or the 40,000,000 multiplayer beta games which have been played the previous 2 weeks. But because of games websites and their previews which have raved about the gameplay. The game is near complete, the gameplay is fantastic and when it comes to graphics, if you're a lover or a hater of the new look, Bungie have 3 months to polish it up.

This game can be considered as strongly as any game as being an AAA contender.

Similar comparisons can be made for the new GTA which has only 3 AAA. MGS which has only 1 AAA but is hyped to a similar extent or new IPs such as Bioshock which looks amazing and is the spiritual successor to an AA game.

Now explain how Halo 3 is any different to these AAA hyped games? 

Even if H3 did not get AAA, The halo series has been AAA 2/3 times.... that 66% of the time which makes it a AAA series.... sorry you fail....

not to be a jerk but what happened to the Halo3 sticky?? Casey did you take it down so you could start this thread :?Medjai

the sticky was up there for a long time so i figured things had cooled down now. i didn't even consider making this thread until after i took it down.

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

CaseyWegner

Even if H3 did not get AAA, The halo series has been AAA 2/3 times.... that 66% of the time which makes it a AAA series.... sorry you fail....

killtactics

no. if there's a non-AAA game in the series, it's not a AAA series.

[QUOTE="killtactics"]

Even if H3 did not get AAA, The halo series has been AAA 2/3 times.... that 66% of the time which makes it a AAA series.... sorry you fail....

CaseyWegner

no. if there's a non-AAA game in the series, it's not a AAA series.

[QUOTE="Medjai"]

people hype the unknown because they feel the need to hype the big franchises of there own systems but no one even knows what is AAA to them personally...while we all use GS reviews here at SW as a barometer, that doesn't necessarily make it AAA in the larger scope of things...I always say my favorite game maybe ever Rogue Spear got an 8.0 here

I don't know where I am going with this but at lease Halo has a AAA pedigree to base an opinion off not like some other games that are hyped here from unproven dev's

mikasa

*cough* killzone *cough*
*cough* lair *coufgh*
*coufgh* warhawk *cough*

Actaully I take back killzone that's been proven a flop.

I didn't mention any games but I was definitely referring to Killzone ;) I don't understand how this game is hyped with a pedigree like Shell Shocked Nam '67 and KZ1

even while Heavenly Sword looks amazing and I am sure it will be the only other game this dev has done was Kung Fu Chaos and what did that score here?

I brought that up in a post after E305 and cows flamed me to death

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

JayPee89

i'm looking at the bigger picture.

Ok, so the point of the whole thread was to say this " No series has a 100% chance of getting AAA status" or that "no series is proven AAA" I'm guessing this thread was made to stop people who keep saying that Halo 3 is a "guarenteed" AAA.

That's all right with me.

But.....

During this topic you said Warcraft is a proven AAA series, which it is not, because as stupid and as unlikely as it sounds the next warcraft game has a chance of flopping,even though it's probably a very small chance.

[QUOTE="killtactics"]

Even if H3 did not get AAA, The halo series has been AAA 2/3 times.... that 66% of the time which makes it a AAA series.... sorry you fail....

CaseyWegner

no. if there's a non-AAA game in the series, it's not a AAA series.

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="killtactics"]

Even if H3 did not get AAA, The halo series has been AAA 2/3 times.... that 66% of the time which makes it a AAA series.... sorry you fail....

JayPee89

no. if there's a non-AAA game in the series, it's not a AAA series.

a series where all the games are AAA but i don't think two games is enough to base that on though.

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

CaseyWegner

what?! While I'm not saying that Halo is on the level of Mario during the NES/SNES days, other than the GTA series can you idetify a series that is as successful as Halo?  IMO, and is some ways, Halo is the only game that I can think of that honestly SAVED a console...w/o halo the Xbox would have gone the way of the dreamcast and there would be no 360.  (and yes I know that Mario saved gaming, but that isn't my point).  I'm sorry, but IMO, Halo has proven itself to be a AAA series.

Now explain how Halo 3 is any different to these AAA hyped games? 

braydee1234

it isn't any different. when did i say it was?

It appears amongst all the chaos, my post with posts and a thought provoking argument hath been overlooked.

Woe is me. 

[QUOTE="JayPee89"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

CaseyWegner

i'm looking at the bigger picture.

[QUOTE="JayPee89"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

CaseyWegner

i'm looking at the bigger picture.

[QUOTE="JayPee89"]I'm not much of a Halo fan, but how can you say that it's not a AAA series when every game in the series has been AAA?  What more do you want?CaseyWegner

i'm looking at the bigger picture.

I think if they drew out Halo over 20 years like Zelda there would be a bigger chance for it to eventually get a game that would fall under AAA...I like that 360 games seem to be doing the trilogy thing with Halo, Mass Effect, and Too Human doesn't open them off to the series burning out

[QUOTE="braydee1234"]

Now explain how Halo 3 is any different to these AAA hyped games?

CaseyWegner

it isn't any different. when did i say it was?

It appears you've named Halo 3 in the topic, singling out the game makes it different in your oppinion. 

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

Eddie5vs1

what?! While I'm not saying that Halo is on the level of Mario during the NES/SNES days, other than the GTA series can you idetify a series that is as successful as Halo?  IMO, and is some ways, Halo is the only game that I can think of that honestly SAVED a console...w/o halo the Xbox would have gone the way of the dreamcast and there would be no 360.  (and yes I know that Mario saved gaming, but that isn't my point).  I'm sorry, but IMO, Halo has proven itself to be a AAA series.

i'm not talking about sales or popularity. there's no denying how strong halo is for that. i'm talking about critical success.

[QUOTE="JayPee89"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="killtactics"]

Even if H3 did not get AAA, The halo series has been AAA 2/3 times.... that 66% of the time which makes it a AAA series.... sorry you fail....

CaseyWegner

no. if there's a non-AAA game in the series, it's not a AAA series.

a series where all the games are AAA but i don't think two games is enough to base that on though.

It appears you've named Halo 3 in the topic, singling out the game makes it different in your oppinion. braydee1234

It appears amongst all the chaos, my post with posts and a thought provoking argument hath been overlooked.

Woe is me. 

braydee1234

logic and reason in SW ha!  but thats how it goes post something flame worthy and ignorant next time ;)

[QUOTE="braydee1234"]It appears you've named Halo 3 in the topic, singling out the game makes it different in your oppinion. Jandurin

           If Bungie themselves owed up to the point that they puplicly admited they rushed Halo 2 and appologized for it and it was AAA - seems more likely that Bungie/MS will not let the flagship game of thiers suffer the same fate.

           Seems to me a better bet that Halo 3 indeed will be a AAA title especialy since the S.P. has been under tight security and hence further the ligitimacy of Halo as a true AAA series... Just Saying ;)

[QUOTE="JayPee89"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="killtactics"]

Even if H3 did not get AAA, The halo series has been AAA 2/3 times.... that 66% of the time which makes it a AAA series.... sorry you fail....

CaseyWegner

no. if there's a non-AAA game in the series, it's not a AAA series.

a series where all the games are AAA but i don't think two games is enough to base that on though.

Casey, as your sample size increases that can change a series status.  Realistically back in the day, Mario was an AAA series game....now not so much.   I don't think that Halo is the greatest game ever, but no other game coming out today is as anticipated as Halo 3.  That doesn't mean that it will be AAA, but you have to admit that Halo is on another level in regard to hype and anticipation, even compared with the phenomenal Zelda and MGS series.

a series where all the games are AAA but i don't think two games is enough to base that on though.CaseyWegner

So if a game has 30 AAA titles in a row and then one AA title, it's not a AAA series?
Also How many games is enough to base that on?

Forza 3 will deserve AAA hype, as will GoW 3, GeoW 2, etc ....... When you hit a homerun or two the hype will always be there.

If Bungie themselves owed up to the point that they puplicly admited they rushed Halo 2 and appologized for it and it was AAA - seems more likely that Bungie/MS will not let the flagship game of thiers suffer the same fate.

Seems to me a better bet that Halo 3 indeed will be a AAA title especialy since the S.P. has been under tight security and hence further the ligitimacy of Halo as a true AAA series... Just Saying ;)

 

SecretPolice

Bungie have said this several times.

eg.

"The brutes were brought in too late and not fleshed out enough"

and the best.. they actually said "we're sorry we made mistakes" 

[QUOTE="braydee1234"]It appears you've named Halo 3 in the topic, singling out the game makes it different in your oppinion. Jandurin

That's besides the point. His argument is Halo 3, and I'm asking how is Halo 3 not worthy of being hyped AAA? 

[QUOTE="JayPee89"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

Bread_or_Decide

Its a AAA series. TC is making up his own rules.

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="braydee1234"]

Now explain how Halo 3 is any different to these AAA hyped games?

braydee1234

it isn't any different. when did i say it was?

It appears you've named Halo 3 in the topic, singling out the game makes it different in your oppinion. 

no. wow. no. what?

It is just one persons opinion everyone. I personly still think Halo will probably get a AAA . Though AAAs are not a sure thing ever and they never will be. From all I have read about Halo 3 I think this will be one heck of a good game. I believe it will be better then the last 2. My hype stays the same.

[QUOTE="Eddie5vs1"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

CaseyWegner

what?! While I'm not saying that Halo is on the level of Mario during the NES/SNES days, other than the GTA series can you idetify a series that is as successful as Halo?  IMO, and is some ways, Halo is the only game that I can think of that honestly SAVED a console...w/o halo the Xbox would have gone the way of the dreamcast and there would be no 360.  (and yes I know that Mario saved gaming, but that isn't my point).  I'm sorry, but IMO, Halo has proven itself to be a AAA series.

i'm not talking about sales or popularity. there's no denying how strong halo is for that. i'm talking about critical success.

In an effort to further the conversation, operationally define what you consider "critical success". Please. :)

[QUOTE="braydee1234"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="braydee1234"]

Now explain how Halo 3 is any different to these AAA hyped games?

CaseyWegner

it isn't any different. when did i say it was?

It appears you've named Halo 3 in the topic, singling out the game makes it different in your oppinion.

no. wow. no. what?

Lol, well it seems that by naming Halo 3 in your topic as "not proven as an AAA franchise", you've specifically said Halo, meaning other games such as MP, GTA and MGS could be considered AAA franchises. 

He does that alot, like that whole "Damage Control" fiasco he was instrumental in.Danthegamingman

and how could you possibly know whether or not that was my idea?

[QUOTE="deangallop"]Just wondering, what are some AAA proven series to you Casey???CaseyWegner

warcraft comes immediately to mind.

Warcraft 2 BattleNet edition didn't get AAA.  In fact it barely got AA.  And before you say remake, read the review.  It points out that was a risk in releasing an old game with new colors.  So I guess this means Halo3 can be AAA even if it gets a AA review.

Also GS doesn't have a Warcraft (1st game) review.  I wonder how it would have scored? I never played it, so I'm not sure.

[QUOTE="thew13"]

Nothing could ever guarantee the 'next' game in the series will be as good as past games. You could have 5,6,7 straight AAA gfames and the next could always not live up to them. But as for expectations I think two AAA games point to a third AAA game.

CaseyWegner

i don't think that two games is enough to have an expectation of the third.

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="Eddie5vs1"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

Eddie5vs1

what?! While I'm not saying that Halo is on the level of Mario during the NES/SNES days, other than the GTA series can you idetify a series that is as successful as Halo?  IMO, and is some ways, Halo is the only game that I can think of that honestly SAVED a console...w/o halo the Xbox would have gone the way of the dreamcast and there would be no 360.  (and yes I know that Mario saved gaming, but that isn't my point).  I'm sorry, but IMO, Halo has proven itself to be a AAA series.

i'm not talking about sales or popularity. there's no denying how strong halo is for that. i'm talking about critical success.

In an effort to further the conversation, operationally define what you consider "critical success". Please. :)

i've been saying AAA this whole time. that's a 9.0 - 9.9 score.

No it is not. And by this logic NO SERIES will ever be AAA. I can alsways pull an obscure Zelda game that failed and call the entire series non AAA. Can be done with pretty much anything, that has been established for some time. So tell me this: Which series IS AAA?

Failed logic FTL.

Lair devs made Rogue Squadron 2, that got a 9.4

Warhawk devs made Twisted Metal Black, that got a 9.5

Killzone... well only fools hype that game. 

ultima-flare

yes but Factor 5 also did RSIII which got a 7.8

and

Incognito also did War of the Monsters (7.4) and Downhill Domination (7.5)

Bungie did Oni(7.1) so its kinda hard to use past games that are not part of a franchise as a barometer

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="thew13"]

Nothing could ever guarantee the 'next' game in the series will be as good as past games. You could have 5,6,7 straight AAA gfames and the next could always not live up to them. But as for expectations I think two AAA games point to a third AAA game.

jg4xchamp

i don't think that two games is enough to have an expectation of the third.

I would get Halo 3 even if it got a 6...not because of fanboyism, not because of hype, but I really enjoyed the Halo story.  I want to finish the story for the same reason I love LotR, the Paolini series, the Harry Potter series, etc. 

Lol, well it seems that by naming Halo 3 in your topic as "not proven as an AAA franchise", you've specifically said Halo, meaning other games such as MP, GTA and MGS could be considered AAA franchises. 

braydee1234

if i were to, for some reason, say that the sky is blue? would you be getting on my case for not also saying that the ocean is blue or that blue pen ink is blue? it's just an example.

I officially hype God of War 3 to be AAA since it falls in the parameters of this topic. first 2 were AAA as well just like Halo.mmirza23

Oh you better watch it.  You may be wrong and 4 years from now someone may find this thread and embarass you with it!
J/K

Most likely it will be AAA.  And until I see something that says otherwise, I'll go with that prediction.  If someone wants to bookmark this and come back 4 years later and claim ownage, then good for you.  But of course who will really be owned?  He how claimed AAA, or he who tracked it for 4 years?

[QUOTE="Eddie5vs1"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="Eddie5vs1"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

yes halo and halo 2 were both AAA but that's only two points of reference and is not yet enough to establish a trend. halo 3 was blindly hyped since before it was even announced and now even halo wars is mentioned among future hyped games. i'm not saying that halo 3 or halo wars will definitely not be AAA but to assume that they will be due to the success of the first two games just seems a bit silly.

CaseyWegner

what?! While I'm not saying that Halo is on the level of Mario during the NES/SNES days, other than the GTA series can you idetify a series that is as successful as Halo?  IMO, and is some ways, Halo is the only game that I can think of that honestly SAVED a console...w/o halo the Xbox would have gone the way of the dreamcast and there would be no 360.  (and yes I know that Mario saved gaming, but that isn't my point).  I'm sorry, but IMO, Halo has proven itself to be a AAA series.

i'm not talking about sales or popularity. there's no denying how strong halo is for that. i'm talking about critical success.

In an effort to further the conversation, operationally define what you consider "critical success". Please. :)

i've been saying AAA this whole time. that's a 9.0 - 9.9 score.

then by your own definition, Halo is a AAA series as 1) both games have scored in the 9.0 to 9.9 range, and 2) there is Halo 1, then Halo 2 which is a continuation of the story line and thus the series.  True?  Or do you mean "critical success" as 3+ games in a series that have achieved AAA status?

[QUOTE="mmirza23"]I officially hype God of War 3 to be AAA since it falls in the parameters of this topic. first 2 were AAA as well just like Halo.mikasa

Oh you better watch it.  You may be wrong and 4 years from now someone may find this thread and embarass you with it!
J/K

Most likely it will be AAA.  And until I see something that says otherwise, I'll go with that prediction.  If someone wants to bookmark this and come back 4 years later and claim ownage, then good for you.  But of course who will really be owned?  He how claimed AAA, or he who tracked it for 4 years?

[QUOTE="braydee1234"]

Lol, well it seems that by naming Halo 3 in your topic as "not proven as an AAA franchise", you've specifically said Halo, meaning other games such as MP, GTA and MGS could be considered AAA franchises.

CaseyWegner

if i were to, for some reason, say that the sky is blue? would you be getting on my case for not also saying that the ocean is blue or that blue pen ink is blue? it's just an example.

How is that what I said? you said Halo 3 isn't definately AAA, why is it not and other games are different? you're avoiding the answer. You clearly state Halo 3, you should change your topic to "Previous AAA games should not be guaranteed AAA for their next games."

besides your metaphore is completely off.