MW2 terrorist massacre isn't as bad as some other games

The terrorist massacre is worstbecause of couple reasons...

1. It hits way too close to home.

People still remember 9/11 like it was yesterday. While you can argue that MW2's airport massacre is not based on a real world event, it brings up all the negative emotions that people have with 9/11 and other terrorist attacks.

2. You are playing as the terrorist.

I'm sure the response wouldn't be as strong if you are playing as the victim or security trying to stop the massacre.

It is worst because you are playing as the terrorist (the perpetrator, the criminal, or the culprit). This is like playing as a Nazi killing the Jews, or playing as a derange gunmen going around the school gunning down students and teachers. It is worst.

canadianloonie

You are not playing as a terrorist. :)

You're merely pretending to be one.

The terrorist massacre is worstbecause of couple reasons...

1. It hits way too close to home.

People still remember 9/11 like it was yesterday. While you can argue that MW2's airport massacre is not based on a real world event, it brings up all the negative emotions that people have with 9/11 and other terrorist attacks.

2. You are playing as the terrorist.

I'm sure the response wouldn't be as strong if you are playing as the victim or security trying to stop the massacre.

It is worst because you are playing as the terrorist (the perpetrator, the criminal, or the culprit). This is like playing as a Nazi killing the Jews, or playing as a derange gunmen going around the school gunning down students and teachers. It is worst.

canadianloonie

And this has nothing to do with 9/11. September 11 involved hijacked airplanes used as a weapon to cannon into significant constructions. This is about a handful of terrorists shooting at an airport. They don't even hijack something.

Big difference.

The connection is still there though. Terrorists, airports/planes, and lots of innocent American dying. I dont think I'm the only one who immediately thought 9/11 upon seeing that.

The game you showed though, I'm not 100% but I think that game was cancelled. I remember reading about it though

BPoole96

Forget 9/11, this scene is much more reminiscient of Rome & Vienna 1985

[QUOTE="canadianloonie"]

The terrorist massacre isworstbecause of couple reasons...

1. It hits way too close to home.

People still remember 9/11 like it was yesterday. While you can argue that MW2's airport massacre is not based on a real world event, it brings up all the negative emotions that people have with 9/11 and other terrorist attacks.

2. You are playing as the terrorist.

I'm sure the response wouldn't be as strong if you are playing as the victim or security trying to stop the massacre.

It is worst because you are playing as the terrorist (the perpetrator, the criminal, or the culprit). This is like playing as a Nazi killing the Jews, or playing as a derange gunmen going around the school gunning down students and teachers. It is worst.

STurn21

You are not playing as the "terrorist". You are playing as a CIA agent infiltrating a terrorist organization.

okayyyyy...that is just an excuse. It doesn't make it any better. The fact is that you can still pretend to be a terrorist and start gunning down civilians.

Terrorist massacre...is this like nazi zombies?

Terrorist massacre...is this like nazi zombies?

johnnystarr

Yes. Just a little bit more interesting.

My beef with the level isn't exactly the content of the level itself. It is the necessity of the level to the overall game as a whole. Alot of this screen, especialy having seen it and heard from people who played the full game, has pointed to the scene being entirely pointless overall. The footage we saw even showed your character being killed at the end of it, so it isn't like there is any follow through on that story angle.

What bothers me is that the scene is mainly unnecessary, just shocking for the sake of being shocking. I feel it is irresponsible to the entire development community as a whole because the media backlash for this scene (which is on its way, make no mistake) will cause tighter collars and creative restrictions on developers to be placed by publishers to avoid any similar baclash in the future.

And for what? For a largly untasteful and skippable scene? We don't even need to complete the scene to get the full story of the game, making the level even more unnecessary. And don't get me wrong, I feel there is absolutely a story to be told from the angle of a terrorist, one that a video game would do better than any movie ever could. There is ripe ground for narrative exploration there, but as it stands now, it is just 1 small 20 minute level where you kill a bunch of unarmed civilians with no built up reason as to why and what it accomplishes for your agenda.

TC, the atrocities that occur in your game are exaggerations and parodies of real life situations, making them acceptable. Alot of those games featured fantasy settings and art styles that detached them from a real world situation. To top it all off, they all had purpose. In GTA4, Niko Bellic is a man struggling to live a happy, normal American life but keeps getting dragged down to doing awful things to awful people. You see that conflict in his character, and his reaction to the violence that you the player are doing is what makes exploring him so rewarding. We don't get anything close to that in MW2, and the fact that we don't disappoints me.

Shensolidus

People are so stupid these days... defending a SCENE in the game that WANTS you shoot innocent people. I laugh.

People are so stupid these days... defending a SCENE game that WANTS you shoot innocent people. I laugh.

Aboogie5

Apparently, you know nothing.

[QUOTE="Aboogie5"]

People are so stupid these days... defending a SCENE game that WANTS you shoot innocent people. I laugh.

Propaganda_

Apparently, you know nothing.

People are so stupid these days... defending a SCENE in the game that WANTS you shoot innocent people. I laugh.

Aboogie5

I cant see what the problem is. its no different to killing people in any other game

[QUOTE="Propaganda_"]

[QUOTE="Aboogie5"]

People are so stupid these days... defending a SCENE game that WANTS you shoot innocent people. I laugh.

Aboogie5

Apparently, you know nothing.

I think it doesn't make any sense, but there's a clear point behind this. It's not as if IW dislikes civilians. :roll:

I cant see what the problem is. its no different to killing people in any other game

toast_burner

Like others said. People may view Americans as terrorists, As Americans view those people who kill our innocents.

Though there is always a reason. I know IW wanted to add as much excitement and WOW factor to the game. But to some, not all, will be offending, as GTA was offending to some, but not all.

I think it's a good thing to have it in a game. It is Modern Warfare after all, stop sanitizing it. It's ok to shoot anyone? All the blood and violence is cool, to a certain point? Nah, stop cleaning these games up. It's a war game based on realism. I think they should have civilians in the game, on the streets and in homes, in harms way. If the player accidently kills an innocent reload the chekpoint. Force the player to deal with these issues if they want to have fun killing people.

I won't be buying the game for other reasons.

You don't get it TC.

MW2 is based on REALITY.

GTA and Fable and Fallout 3 are NOT based on reality. This is the stuff that terrorists actually do.

I didn't feel bothered by it but I can understand how somebody else could.

so you play as a CIA terrorist and kill some civilians. whats so bad about this?

You don't get it TC.

MW2 is based on REALITY.

GTA and Fable and Fallout 3 are NOT based on reality. This is the stuff that terrorists actually do.

I didn't feel bothered by it but I can understand how somebody else could.

Crazyguy105

I personally think that this is a very good point.

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

I cant see what the problem is. its no different to killing people in any other game

Like others said. People may view Americans as terrorists, As Americans view those people who kill our innocents.

Though there is always a reason. I know IW wanted to add as much excitement and WOW factor to the game. But to some, not all, will be offending, as GTA was offending to some, but not all.

[QUOTE="Aboogie5"]

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

I cant see what the problem is. its no different to killing people in any other game

toast_burner

Like others said. People may view Americans as terrorists, As Americans view those people who kill our innocents.

Though there is always a reason. I know IW wanted to add as much excitement and WOW factor to the game. But to some, not all, will be offending, as GTA was offending to some, but not all.

I never said it was added to offend people.

Minus well put Digital Jesus and shoot him to right? Or maybe the pope! Or maybe Obama, it just a video game? How bout your MOM!? Its not there to offend, it just there for fun!

[QUOTE="toast_burner"][QUOTE="Aboogie5"]My last reply on this thread will be to you. Yeah a lot of games have shooting, killing people. In the content in how its killing people its what people meant.

Like others said. People may view Americans as terrorists, As Americans view those people who kill our innocents.

Though there is always a reason. I know IW wanted to add as much excitement and WOW factor to the game. But to some, not all, will be offending, as GTA was offending to some, but not all.

Aboogie5

I never said it was added to offend people.

Minus well put Digital Jesus and shoot him to right? Or maybe the pope! Or maybe Obama, it just a video game? How bout your MOM!? Its not there to offend, it just there for fun!

[QUOTE="Aboogie5"]

[QUOTE="toast_burner"] your not killing innocent civilians your just killing digital people. and its not like the scene was added in to delibratly to offend people.toast_burner

I never said it was added to offend people.

Minus well put Digital Jesus and shoot him to right? Or maybe the pope! Or maybe Obama, it just a video game? How bout your MOM!? Its not there to offend, it just there for fun!

in my book its morally wrong....especially with situations we have right now are people forgetting those killed in terrorist attacks which are similar to the ones simulated within the game.

I mean we kicked up a stink about the Fallujah game and there was no problems so what the hell is diffrent that COD does it.If not this is worse especially the environment we live in today.

in my book its morally wrong....especially with situations we have right now are people forgetting those killed in terrorist attacks which are similar to the ones simulated within the game.

I mean we kicked up a stink about the Fallujah game and there was no problems so what the hell is diffrent that COD does it.If not this is worse especially the environment we live in today.

razgriz_101

But it's still just a game...

...right?

[QUOTE="campbell1874"]

I dont get why so many people are so bothered about MW2 terrorist massacre? Some people say its morally wrong to add it into the game but i think that peopleare just picking onMW2 because its apopular game. If MW2 was based on a real event then i could understand why people are upset about this but its not. Its a made up scenario like load of other games in the past. Some games are just as bad or worse but didn't get people upset to the point of not buying the game.

GTA games used to have kill frenzies.

Fallout you can nuke a whole town.

State of Emergency with a PS2 game where you run around the street killing loads of people rioting. The bonus game was based in a mall where you had to run around and slaughter unarmed people. The more kill in the time limit the better.

Fable 2 you can marry more than one person, take you wife or husband to be executed on the torture wheel and leave your kid as a orphan. Massacre the whole town just to get some loot.

This is just some examples. What other games can you remember that have morally wrong moments in them that are just as bad as MW2 but no one moaned about?

NielsNL

Don't both parents need to be dead for a kid to be an orphan?

Good point but she goes to a orphanage or just becomes a street bum. Something like that.

Well now...with all I've read through out this thread...How is this any different to a TV programm? Season 4 of 24 had terrorists hold an airport hostage and killed a few innocent civilians. Why is it such a 'crime' to implement this into a game and on the other hand it be totally fine to implement it into a tv show?

Well now...with all I've read through out this thread...How is this any different to a TV programm? Season 4 of 24 had terrorists hold an airport hostage and killed a few innocent civilians. Why is it such a 'crime' to implement this into a game and on the other hand it be totally fine to implement it into a tv show?

che5ter666

Due to the fact that video games aren't as 'accepted' as TV shows and movies in today's society... :roll:

A great deal still think that video gaming is 'a kid's toy', and are very disturbed by such news.

The fact that this is getting so much concernm and attention is laughable. Its a video game, and thats where this whole thing shouldve ended. Violence of this magnitude in games can be found in many games.

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]

in my book its morally wrong....especially with situations we have right now are people forgetting those killed in terrorist attacks which are similar to the ones simulated within the game.

I mean we kicked up a stink about the Fallujah game and there was no problems so what the hell is diffrent that COD does it.If not this is worse especially the environment we live in today.

Propaganda_

But it's still just a game...

...right?

I agree with razgriz. The "it's just a game" argument is irrelevant here. We're dealing with offensive content; if people are not offended by it, then that's because their moral views or their game experience differs from others. That's fine and all, but that doesn't change the content itself.

On top of that I feel this kind of material doesn't feel in place in the COD universe. COD is a heroic universe, it's more like "the Longest Day" than any 'more realistic' war movie. That's true IMO for ALL COD's 1-4. They deliberately try to honour the soldiers fighting a/the war, and this isn't helping....

The 'more realistic' argument is crap as well IMO. You know what's far more realistic? Soldiers raping every woman or teenager available, just because they belonged to the people of the enemy. Russians in WOII anyone??? They fought their ass off for the liberation of Europe, but weren't known for their high moral standards. So let's add a game mechanic that takes this into account.

Want some hot coffee?

I think it's a good thing to have it in a game. It is Modern Warfare after all, stop sanitizing it. It's ok to shoot anyone? All the blood and violence is cool, to a certain point? Nah, stop cleaning these games up. It's a war game based on realism. I think they should have civilians in the game, on the streets and in homes, in harms way. If the player accidently kills an innocent reload the chekpoint. Force the player to deal with these issues if they want to have fun killing people.

I won't be buying the game for other reasons.

Kiyobear

If there wasn't a good point, though, it would have been relatively foolish.

Suppose we'll find out on November 10th.

[QUOTE="Propaganda_"]

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]

in my book its morally wrong....especially with situations we have right now are people forgetting those killed in terrorist attacks which are similar to the ones simulated within the game.

I mean we kicked up a stink about the Fallujah game and there was no problems so what the hell is diffrent that COD does it.If not this is worse especially the environment we live in today.

dirktu

But it's still just a game...

...right?

I agree with razgriz. The "it's just a game" argument is irrelevant here. We're dealing with offensive content; if people are not offended by it, then that's because their moral views or their game experience differs from others. That's fine and all, but that doesn't change the content itself.

On top of that I feel this kind of material doesn't feel in place in the COD universe. COD is a heroic universe, it's more like "the Longest Day" than any 'more realistic' war movie. That's true IMO for ALL COD's 1-4. They deliberately try to honour the soldiers fighting a/the war, and this isn't helping....

The 'more realistic' argument is crap as well IMO. You know what's far more realistic? Soldiers raping every woman or teenager available, just because they belonged to the people of the enemy. Russians in WOII anyone??? They fought their ass off for the liberation of Europe, but weren't known for their high moral standards. So let's add a game mechanic that takes this into account.

Want some hot coffee?

Well, let me tell you something here. We've had offensive content in video games since the first Grand Theft Auto was released. For what reason should this spark controversy? It's not as if MW2 is the first game to contain gruesome scenes. You're talking about content. Well, go play Postal, Grand Theft Auto, Manhunt or MadWorld...

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]

in my book its morally wrong....especially with situations we have right now are people forgetting those killed in terrorist attacks which are similar to the ones simulated within the game.

I mean we kicked up a stink about the Fallujah game and there was no problems so what the hell is diffrent that COD does it.If not this is worse especially the environment we live in today.

Propaganda_

But it's still just a game...

...right?

in this social environment we now live in where is the line between fact and fiction going to stop.TBH as i have said its way too close to the bone and morally wrong and really is like a big FU to victims of attacks like the one depicted and to a degreesoldiers who are actually deployed risking their lives to stop these things and yet in a game made by an AMERICAN company we see them depicting an attack from the attackers point of view.TBH you would expect the developer to try and honour soldiers like the ones i have spoken about i havea mate who's on leave and said its horrendous on the frontline and he is actually a bit like wtf about how this is in a game like COD.

Its really close to the bone even tho in this day and age media does push a lot of boundaries right now this is one boundary which should not be pushed as we need to support our armed forces as much as possible and not depict or glorify the terrorist side of this.

Even tho im left wing and i have been that since i was 16 i support socialism sue me, i even think this is morally wrong for so many reasons even tho i dont support the war in iraq i felt there was no reason now it affects me as i have had a mate on the front line there.We need to show more appreciation to soldiers like him rather than these missions as they seem to be called which imo are a spit in the face to our armed service men and women oversees who face these kinds of nutters every day.

[QUOTE="dirktu"]

[QUOTE="Propaganda_"]

But it's still just a game...

...right?

Propaganda_

I agree with razgriz. The "it's just a game" argument is irrelevant here. We're dealing with offensive content; if people are not offended by it, then that's because their moral views or their game experience differs from others. That's fine and all, but that doesn't change the content itself.

On top of that I feel this kind of material doesn't feel in place in the COD universe. COD is a heroic universe, it's more like "the Longest Day" than any 'more realistic' war movie. That's true IMO for ALL COD's 1-4. They deliberately try to honour the soldiers fighting a/the war, and this isn't helping....

The 'more realistic' argument is crap as well IMO. You know what's far more realistic? Soldiers raping every woman or teenager available, just because they belonged to the people of the enemy. Russians in WOII anyone??? They fought their ass off for the liberation of Europe, but weren't known for their high moral standards. So let's add a game mechanic that takes this into account.

Want some hot coffee?

Well, let me tell you something here. We've had offensive content in video games since the first Grand Theft Auto was released. For what reason should this spark controversy? It's not as if MW2 is the first game to contain gruesome scenes. You're talking about content. Well, go play Postal, Grand Theft Auto, Manhunt or MadWorld...

That doesn't change anything.. You're not bringing anything new to the table. There has also been controversy with respect to the games you mentioned. And although I haven't played the new COD I think it will have less offensive content than those games... But the COD series has been another series entirely....

So what's your point exactly?

Good greif will people just shut up about these scene, I fail to find how it is even remotely offensive. Nobody complained when in Double Agent you could blow up a Cruise Ship full of innocent people or were forced to execute and innocent pilot, no one cares that in Splinter Cell: Conviction you're killing government agents ect. Really the whole complaint about this scene is just annoying and stupid.

[QUOTE="Ontain"]i've said it before and i'll say it again. if a game had virtual rape or child porn which you actively engage in it, wouldn't most of the reason ppl are using to defend MW2 still apply? I mean it's both virtual right?toast_burner

PS. i'm not for virtual child porn. i'm just trying to say that the argument that it's just virtual ppl isn't a strong one.

[QUOTE="Propaganda_"]

[QUOTE="dirktu"]

I agree with razgriz. The "it's just a game" argument is irrelevant here. We're dealing with offensive content; if people are not offended by it, then that's because their moral views or their game experience differs from others. That's fine and all, but that doesn't change the content itself.

On top of that I feel this kind of material doesn't feel in place in the COD universe. COD is a heroic universe, it's more like "the Longest Day" than any 'more realistic' war movie. That's true IMO for ALL COD's 1-4. They deliberately try to honour the soldiers fighting a/the war, and this isn't helping....

The 'more realistic' argument is crap as well IMO. You know what's far more realistic? Soldiers raping every woman or teenager available, just because they belonged to the people of the enemy. Russians in WOII anyone??? They fought their ass off for the liberation of Europe, but weren't known for their high moral standards. So let's add a game mechanic that takes this into account.

Want some hot coffee?

dirktu

Well, let me tell you something here. We've had offensive content in video games since the first Grand Theft Auto was released. For what reason should this spark controversy? It's not as if MW2 is the first game to contain gruesome scenes. You're talking about content. Well, go play Postal, Grand Theft Auto, Manhunt or MadWorld...

That doesn't change anything.. You're not bringing anything new to the table. There has also been controversy with respect to the games you mentioned. And although I haven't played the new COD I think it will have less offensive content than those games... But the COD series has been another series entirely....

So what's your point exactly?

That this not the first time we're capable of killing civilians in video games, so quit the loath.

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

i've said it before and i'll say it again. if a game had virtual rape or child porn which you actively engage in it, wouldn't most of the reason ppl are using to defend MW2 still apply? I mean it's both virtual right?Ontain

PS. i'm not for virtual child porn. i'm just trying to say that the argument that it's just virtual ppl isn't a strong one.

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]

in my book its morally wrong....especially with situations we have right now are people forgetting those killed in terrorist attacks which are similar to the ones simulated within the game.

I mean we kicked up a stink about the Fallujah game and there was no problems so what the hell is diffrent that COD does it.If not this is worse especially the environment we live in today.

Propaganda_

But it's still just a game...

...right?

[QUOTE="Crazyguy105"]

You don't get it TC.

MW2 is based on REALITY.

GTA and Fable and Fallout 3 are NOT based on reality. This is the stuff that terrorists actually do.

I didn't feel bothered by it but I can understand how somebody else could.

Propaganda_

I personally think that this is a very good point.

It is a good point and i will answer it with my point of view.

MW2 game world is based on reality but not onreal life events. I accept that the subject matter might be hard for some people but if you dont want to kill anyone then you dont have to press the trigger. TV and movies expose you to far worse influences.

What age rating is MW2? It must be adult so like any other media i thing people should be allowed to show what they want as long as its not against the law. Well maybe not Australian censor laws.

[QUOTE="Propaganda_"]

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]

in my book its morally wrong....especially with situations we have right now are people forgetting those killed in terrorist attacks which are similar to the ones simulated within the game.

I mean we kicked up a stink about the Fallujah game and there was no problems so what the hell is diffrent that COD does it.If not this is worse especially the environment we live in today.

Ontain

But it's still just a game...

...right?

No, it can't. Virtual rape and rape in real life are sickening, but murdering in video games is pleasing. So it's most certainly not the same thing.

[QUOTE="Propaganda_"]

[QUOTE="Crazyguy105"]

You don't get it TC.

MW2 is based on REALITY.

GTA and Fable and Fallout 3 are NOT based on reality. This is the stuff that terrorists actually do.

I didn't feel bothered by it but I can understand how somebody else could.

campbell1874

I personally think that this is a very good point.

It is a good point and i will answer it with my point of view.

MW2 game world is based on reality but not onreal life events. I accept that the subject matter might be hard for some people but if you dont want to kill anyone then you dont have to press the trigger. TV and movies expose you to far worse influences.

What age rating is MW2? It must be adult so like any other media i thing people should be allowed to show what they want as long as its not against the law. Well maybe not Australian censor laws.

I believe it's 18+.
And I don't think this is particularly based on a real occurrence. But these things to happen, yeah.

[QUOTE="razgriz_101"]

[QUOTE="Propaganda_"]

But it's still just a game...

...right?

STurn21

in this social environment we now live in where is the line between fact and fiction going to stop.TBH as i have said its way too close to the bone and morally wrong and really is like a big FU to victims of attacks like the one depicted and to a degreesoldiers who are actually deployed risking their lives to stop these things and yet in a game made by an AMERICAN company we see them depicting an attack from the attackers point of view.TBH you would expect the developer to try and honour soldiers like the ones i have spoken about i havea mate who's on leave and said its horrendous on the frontline and he is actually a bit like wtf about how this is in a game like COD.

Its really close to the bone even tho in this day and age media does push a lot of boundaries right now this is one boundary which should not be pushed as we need to support our armed forces as much as possible and not depict or glorify the terrorist side of this.

Even tho im left wing and i have been that since i was 16 i support socialism sue me, i even think this is morally wrong for so many reasons even tho i dont support the war in iraq i felt there was no reason now it affects me as i have had a mate on the front line there.We need to show more appreciation to soldiers like him rather than these missions as they seem to be called which imo are a spit in the face to our armed service men and women oversees who face these kinds of nutters every day.

Wait wait wait. You have a mate fighting "on the front lines" in Iraq? May I ask what country said mate is fighting for? Also, I have numerous family members and friends who are vets or currently serving in the US military and I guarantee that none of them would take offense to fake, imaginary, digital, video game violence.