1. Your argument is a red herring for existing 3D game engine performance.
2. My Polaris source with double subword FP16 is a first party source i.e. AMD.
Polaris's double data rate FP16 feature.
According to Goossen, some performance optimisations from the upcoming AMD Vega architecture factor into the Scorpio Engine's design, but other features that made it into PS4 Pro - for example, double-rate FP16 processing - do not.
I am correct on Scrpio's GPU solution is faster than RX-480 OC and R9-390X while slower than Vega 10.
Thanks you Goossen it self from MS stated Scorpio doesn't have FP16 double pumped.
And my argument is not misleading lying lemming.
@ronvalencia said:
Vega NCU enabled Scorpio could gimp current PC GPUs without double rate FP16 feature.
1. 4X rate integer 8 bit = 24 TIOPS. Scorpio exceeds GTX 1080, GTX 1070, Fury X, 980 Ti
2. 2X rate integer 16 bit = 12 TIOPS. Scorpio exceeds GTX 1080, GTX 1070, Fury X, 980 Ti
You posted this based on nothing but a feature that Scorpio lack,i am not misleading you do,and you claim scorpio exceed a 1080GTX using such feature..
So yeah in your wet lemming dreams scorpio is even close to a 1080gtx and forza mean total shit is a shitty optimized game which bottleneck GPU on PC because of the low core CPU usage on an age where most CPU have 4 cores they rely on just 2 heavily which will create a bottleneck on powerful GPU.
5. DF placed Scorpio being GTX 1070/Fury X class while the real Scorpio result has beaten GTX 1070 in sustained 4k/ 60 fps. Both Scorpio and GP104 has render to L2 cache usage, hence removing NVIDIA's advantage.
Is this confirmed or inferred?
---
I ran a 5min test in The Witcher 3 at 4K/Ultra textures+console settings. Stuff like riding in the woods, looting a house, 2 monster nest encounters, firing off random signs. Smoke effects and dense foliage tend to induce drops. Had 30.6fps avg lowest was 23fps which was blowing up a nest or casting igni on a group of nekkers. The difference between flat 'Ultra' and 'Low/Med' mix with 'Ultra' textures was very minor at 4K. This is on RX 480(1305MHz)/FX-8350(2.3GHz).
If results match Forza wet track, Scorpio will hand in 10-15% better results than a 6TF RX 480 pretty commonly. That even puts BF1 at PS4 Pro settings but 'Ultra' textures added at 4K/60fps within reach(with dynamic scaling to 1800p occasionally).
The best part is how he compares the RX480 bandwidth with scorpio in such a biased way is not even funny.
The RX480 is Polaris based which mean it has DCC which improve by ""AMD claims"" bandwidth 35% so effectively is 256GB/s + 35% that means the RX480 has a 345GB/s effective bandwidth for it SELF not a shared one like scorpio which i think minimum can be 30GB/s reserve for system and CPU going by the xbox one reservation,i don't think they will increase speed 31% but not bandwidth for the CPU as well.
I love how he increase bandwidth on scorpio using DCC but some how the same doesn't apply to the RX480 which also has DCC.
Even if it had the full 326gb/s with DCC does not matter at all if the gpu itself cant push out the pixel rate to handle 4k without compromises. a RX 580 with 210mhz overclock with 1ghz overclock on memory allows 288gb/s with DCC to get an effective bandwidth of 388gb/s and yet only performed 7% faster than stock RX 580 at 1440p. And note that oc'ed RX 580 was operating nearly at 6.8 TFLOP.
Flawed argument.
1. You haven't correlated R9-390X's 3DMarks Vantage color rate score vs RX-480's 3DMarks Vantage color rate score to real games result.
Similar texture effective memory bandwidth = similar game frame result.
2. Decompression and compression rate from DCC co-processors with 256 GB/s design limit..
Furthermore, you have used 1440p resolution NOT 4K resolution when memory bandwidth takes over as the higher bottleneck factor.
No real 3D game has 100 percent color pixel rate workload i.e, you are forgetting texture rate memory bandwidth.
RGBA16F at 32 ROPS and 1172 MHz yielding 300 GB/s is only one direction while the real game workload has read and write direction.
You haven't factored in depth ROPS read and write.
1. Your argument is a red herring for existing 3D game engine performance.
2. My Polaris source with double subword FP16 is a first party source i.e. AMD.
Polaris's double data rate FP16 feature.
According to Goossen, some performance optimisations from the upcoming AMD Vega architecture factor into the Scorpio Engine's design, but other features that made it into PS4 Pro - for example, double-rate FP16 processing - do not.
I am correct on Scrpio's GPU solution is faster than RX-480 OC and R9-390X while slower than Vega 10.
Thanks you Goossen it self from MS stated Scorpio doesn't have FP16 double pumped.
And my argument is not misleading lying lemming.
@ronvalencia said:
Vega NCU enabled Scorpio could gimp current PC GPUs without double rate FP16 feature.
1. 4X rate integer 8 bit = 24 TIOPS. Scorpio exceeds GTX 1080, GTX 1070, Fury X, 980 Ti
2. 2X rate integer 16 bit = 12 TIOPS. Scorpio exceeds GTX 1080, GTX 1070, Fury X, 980 Ti
You posted this based on nothing but a feature that Scorpio lack,i am not misleading you do,and you claim scorpio exceed a 1080GTX using such feature..
So yeah in your wet lemming dreams scorpio is even close to a 1080gtx and forza mean total shit is a shitty optimized game which bottleneck GPU on PC because of the low core CPU usage on an age where most CPU have 4 cores they rely on just 2 heavily which will create a bottleneck on powerful GPU.
Wrong, Goossen has stated Scorpio doesn't have Vega's double (math operation) rate FP16 features. Polaris baseline IP has subword FP16 with both FP16 data elements sharing the same math operation. GM200 and GP104 are NOT fully hardware compliant for SM6's native FP16 mode i.e. theses GPUs has to emulate these functions.
I posted my Vega 11 example in the speculation thread and AMD's FP16 is not in play until Shader Model 6 arrives which by then, mainstream Volta arrives sometime early next year.
I am correct on Scorpio's GPU solution is faster than RX-480 OC and R9-390X while slower than Vega 10 for current 3D game engines.
Unlike PS4 Pro, Vega 10 has increased memory bandwidth to atleast 480 GB/s physical (bottleneck reduction), additional HBC (high bandwidth cache under L2 cache, bottleneck reduction) and Pixel Engine being connected L2 cache (bottleneck reduction). You have omitted my arguments for higher memory bandwidth and bottleneck reduction.
Wrong, Goossen has stated Scorpio doesn't have Vega's double (math operation) rate FP16 features. Polaris baseline IP has subword FP16 with both FP16 data elements sharing the same math operation. GM200 and GP104 are NOT fully hardware compliant for SM6's native FP16 mode i.e. theses GPUs has to emulate these functions.
I posted my Vega 11 example in speculation thread and AMD's FP16 is not in play until Shader Model 6 arrives which by then, mainstream Volta arrives sometime early next year.
I am correct on Scorpio's GPU solution is faster than RX-480 OC and R9-390X while slower than Vega 10 for current 3D game engines.
Scorpio doesn't have it the Pro does deal with it.
8.4 > 6 remember is your argument not mine..hahahaha
Wrong, Goossen has stated Scorpio doesn't have Vega's double (math operation) rate FP16 features. Polaris baseline IP has subword FP16 with both FP16 data elements sharing the same math operation. GM200 and GP104 are NOT fully hardware compliant for SM6's native FP16 mode i.e. theses GPUs has to emulate these functions.
I posted my Vega 11 example in speculation thread and AMD's FP16 is not in play until Shader Model 6 arrives which by then, mainstream Volta arrives sometime early next year.
I am correct on Scorpio's GPU solution is faster than RX-480 OC and R9-390X while slower than Vega 10 for current 3D game engines.
Scorpio doesn't have it the Pro does deal with it.
8.4 > 6 remember is your argument not mine..hahahaha
That's not my argument i.e. you omitted my memory bandwidth argument. That speculative thread already has "more than 320 GB/s memory bandwidth" context. I'm against high TFLOPS without appropriate memory bandwidth increase and it's a current problem with Polaris 10/20 GPUs.
PS4 Pro Mantis Burn Racing 4K vs MSI Gaming GeForce GTX 980 Ti OC
When Maxwell DCC and graphics data format read/write are active, it's a defeated for PS4 Pro with double rate FP16.
PS4 Pro has shit memory bandwidth.
You omitted my argument for increase memory bandwidth. PS4 Pro is a half-ass'ed upgrade with just two Vega improvement areas e.g. double rate FP16 and dispatcher, NOTHING on memory bandwidth increase** and NOTHING on Pixel Engine bottleneck reduction**.
**No different to RX-470D.
For Vega 11, I wanted the Pixel Engine connection to L2 cache improvements since this affects pixel shading, depth and color ROPS path i.e. the classic GPU operations NOT being f.uking DSP.
Vega 11's double rate FP16 features are secondary issues.
Scorpio's Forza wet track results are targeting the areas that I have issues with current AMD GPUs.
When both machines are already using FP16 data formats with their graphics operations and their TFLOPS are bottle-necked by memory bandwidth, the machine with the higher effective memory bandwidth and less data transfer bottlenecks is superior.
GTX 980 Ti's superior DCC, Pixel Engine linked to L2 cache and higher 337 GB/s overcomes PS4 Pro's double rate FP16 advantage. Pixel Engine path includes FP16 support you stupid cow!
That's not my argument i.e. you omitted my memory bandwidth argument. That speculative thread already has "more than 320 GB/s memory bandwidth" context. I'm against high TFLOPS without appropriate memory bandwidth increase and it's a current problem with Polalaris GPU.
@ronvalencia said:
Vega NCU enabled Scorpio could gimp current PC GPUs without double rate FP16 feature.
1. 4X rate integer 8 bit = 24 TIOPS. Scorpio exceeds GTX 1080, GTX 1070, Fury X, 980 Ti
2. 2X rate integer 16 bit = 12 TIOPS. Scorpio exceeds GTX 1080, GTX 1070, Fury X, 980 Ti
You claim Scorpio was 12TF with 2xFP16,you didn't bring any arguments about scorpio no having enough bandwidth for 12TF,is impossible that 320GB/s which is 25% more than 256GB's some how is enough for 6TF and 12TF...lol
But since the reveal that Scorpio lack FP16 double pumped and the Pro does you have use bandwidth as your weapon to attack the Pro,when with scorpio you did not use that excuse for you some how Scorpio would use 12TF with just 320GB/s which is not even for GPU all of it because is shared.
So Scorpio can use 12TF with 320GB/s but the Pro can't use 8.4TF with 228GB/s..
And that is the real problem with your biased arguments.
All that crap is based in FP16,nothing more nothing less and you never raise a single question about scorpio bandwidth,but for the Pro you are a total hypocrite and do so.
FP16 saves bandwidth i already quoted Nvidia on it,in fact it help performance in bandwidth starved scenarios by 2X.
The fact that you were hyping FP16 and now downplay it because Scorpio lack it is a joke and show how totally hypocrite you are ron you even wont admit the own arguments you make this is a new low for you..lol
PS.
I say probably bigger and is on your quote HYPOCRITE but nice to see that you understand the word probably which isn't a word use when something is 100% confirmed,yet some how you see words and meanings not there in other quotes as you do with Phil Spencer quotes..lol
By the way that is a dev kit not the retail unit moron.
That's not my argument i.e. you omitted my memory bandwidth argument. That speculative thread already has "more than 320 GB/s memory bandwidth" context. I'm against high TFLOPS without appropriate memory bandwidth increase and it's a current problem with Polalaris GPU.
@ronvalencia said:
Vega NCU enabled Scorpio could gimp current PC GPUs without double rate FP16 feature.
1. 4X rate integer 8 bit = 24 TIOPS. Scorpio exceeds GTX 1080, GTX 1070, Fury X, 980 Ti
2. 2X rate integer 16 bit = 12 TIOPS. Scorpio exceeds GTX 1080, GTX 1070, Fury X, 980 Ti
Phil Spencer correctly identifies AMD GPU issues with it's high TFLOPS i.e. memory bandwidth.
When you talk to me about Scorpio, the term I use about the architecture isn’t the six teraflops which is obviously what we’ve announced, it’s balance. Really what it is, is you want a platform that is balanced between memory bandwidth, GPU power, you know, your ability to move memory and [an] amount of memory around in many ways is more inhibiting to the performance of your game than absolute teraflops on any one of the individual pieces, and when we designed Scorpio we really thought about this balanced rig that could come together at a price-point. Like, I want Scorpio to be at a console price-point, I’m not trying to go and compete with a high-end rig. And because we’re building one spec, we’re able to look at the balance between all the components and make sure that it’s something we really hit that matters to consumers and gamers.
The lesson from Nvidia Maxwell/Pascal designs are increasing memory bandwidth while increasing TFLOPS.
I left that topic's audience with a multiple choice.
Qualifier you missed is "Vega NCU enabled Scorpio could gimp current PC GPUs without double rate FP16 feature.". Atm, this statement still stands true since Polaris already has dual subword FP16 feature in hardware.
@tormentos said:
But since the reveal that Scorpio lack FP16 double pumped and
1. Polaris baseline IP already dual subword FP16 feature.
Polaris's dual subword FP16 feature.
@tormentos said:
the Pro does you have use bandwidth as your weapon to attack the Pro,when with scorpio you did not use that excuse for you some how Scorpio would use 12TF with just 320GB/s which is not even for GPU all of it because is shared.
Scorpio's 326 GBps >>> PS4 Pro's 218 GBps.
When both machines already using FP16 data formats with their graphics operations and their TFLOPS are bottle-necked by memory bandwidth, the machine with the higher effective memory bandwidth and less data transfer bottlenecks is superior.
Normal desktop PCs with dGPUs doesn't have Fusion links to reduce main memory hit rates.
Too bad for tormented, graphics processing already using FP16 formats.
RGBA16F <------ four FP16 data elements.
@tormentos said:
So Scorpio can use 12TF with 320GB/s but the Pro can't use 8.4TF with 228GB/s..
And that is the real problem with your biased arguments.
All that crap is based in FP16,nothing more nothing less and you never raise a single question about scorpio bandwidth,but for the Pro you are a total hypocrite and do so.
"On the GPU we added some compressed render target formats like our 6e4 [6 bit mantissa and 4 bits exponent per component] and 7e3 HDR float formats [where the 6e4 formats] that were very, very popular on Xbox 360, which instead of doing a 16-bit float per component 64bpp render target, you can do the equivalent with us using 32 bits - so we did a lot of focus on really maximising efficiency and utilisation of that ESRAM."
Compress ratio is 2:1
@tormentos said:
The fact that you were hyping FP16 and now downplay it because Scorpio lack it is a joke and show how totally hypocrite you are ron you even wont admit the own arguments you make this is a new low for you..lol
Scorpio's Polaris baseline IP already dual subword FP16 feature.
GCN version 1.1 already has ROPS and TMUs capable reading and writing FP16 data formats.
Again, when both machines already using FP16 data formats with their graphics operations and their TFLOPS are bottle-necked by memory bandwidth, the machine with the higher effective memory bandwidth and less data transfer bottlenecks is superior.
@tormentos said:
I say probably bigger and is on your quote HYPOCRITE but nice to see that you understand the word probably which isn't a word use when something is 100% confirmed,yet some how you see words and meanings not there in other quotes as you do with Phil Spencer quotes..lol
You omitted many things from my post.
@tormentos said:
By the way that is a dev kit not the retail unit moron.
Xbox One X will come with a 1TB hard disk drive and a UHD Blu-ray drive. Take note that it's more power hungry with its 245 watt internal power supply. The Xbox One S has a 120 watt internal power supply, while the original's power supply is 220 watts and external.
You are the moron.
@tormentos said:
From https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/the-ps4-pro-is-a-complete-failure-33393196/?page=4#js-message-177
4. Scorpio will probably be bigger than Pro case wise.
5. Scorpio probably will feature a power brick.
4. Xbox One X is smaller than PS4 Pro and Xbox One S.
The fact that Forza only utilizes two threads to any real degree means that hardware usage coding for the game in general is sub par making it as a example flawed. let alone the fact that GTX 1080ti downclocked to 6.5 TFLOP is not even a proper test to prove your flawed point..... Even if you downclocked a 1080ti to 6.5TF , its much better than what Scorpio could do for 4k not proving anything about bandwidth.
Your the fool in thinking that 50gb/s or less extra bandwidth on a gpu based on same architecture is going to yield sizable gains. Also tests on a RX 580 overclocked with an extra 210mhz core with memory overclock equaling to 288gb/s only yielded a whooping 7% gain over a stock RX 580. shows that your bandwidth effecting pixel fill rate or TFLOPS is not as near as important as you think.
Scorpio's gpu if its pixel rate sits below a RX 580 it is going to struggle at 4k, having to make compromises. It reaching GTX 1070 levels of performance is highly doubtful in that case.
The best part is how he compares the RX480 bandwidth with scorpio in such a biased way is not even funny.
1. The RX480 is Polaris based which mean it has DCC which improve by ""AMD claims"" bandwidth 35% so effectively is 256GB/s + 35% that means the RX480 has a 345GB/s effective bandwidth for it SELF not a shared one like scorpio which
2. i think minimum can be 30GB/s reserve for system and CPU going by the xbox one reservation,i don't think they will increase speed 31% but not bandwidth for the CPU as well.
I love how he increase bandwidth on scorpio using DCC but some how the same doesn't apply to the RX480 which also has DCC.
1. That's a flawed argument since AMD PR assumed zero latency GDDR5, but GDDR5 doesn't have zero latency, hence the machine is wasting time on latency.
In real world workloads, Polaris DCC is mostly used to recover lost memory bandwidth potential from memory sub-system inefficiencies.
2. 30 GB/s is not static reserve bandwidth for the CPU. 30 GB/s is for system coherency tracking i.e. the entire system is coherent up to 30 GB/s. Above 30 GB/s, it's not coherent.
30 GB/s is similar to PCI-E version 3.0 16 lane coherency and data transfer's 32 GB/s limit.
PS4's 1.6 Ghz CPU dictates physics and AI workload.
The best part is how he compares the RX480 bandwidth with scorpio in such a biased way is not even funny.
The RX480 is Polaris based which mean it has DCC which improve by ""AMD claims"" bandwidth 35% so effectively is 256GB/s + 35% that means the RX480 has a 345GB/s effective bandwidth for it SELF not a shared one like scorpio which i think minimum can be 30GB/s reserve for system and CPU going by the xbox one reservation,i don't think they will increase speed 31% but not bandwidth for the CPU as well.
I love how he increase bandwidth on scorpio using DCC but some how the same doesn't apply to the RX480 which also has DCC.
Even if it had the full 326gb/s with DCC does not matter at all if the gpu itself cant push out the pixel rate to handle 4k without compromises. a RX 580 with 210mhz overclock with 1ghz overclock on memory allows 288gb/s with DCC to get an effective bandwidth of 388gb/s and yet only performed 7% faster than stock RX 580 at 1440p. And note that oc'ed RX 580 was operating nearly at 6.8 TFLOP.
At 1440, the gap between RX-580 and R9-390X is 0 percent.
At 4K, the gap between RX-580 and R9-390X is 7 percent. The interesting part is R9-290 with 4.8 TFLOPS is reaching close to RX-580's 6.17 TFLOPS result.
Increasing the memory clock speed doesn't enable RX-580 to match Scorpio's Forza 4K/60 result i.e. it doesn't negate 60 pipeline bottlenecks.
Games either had the following placed on the banner:
1. Xbox X enhanced, play in 4k UHD and HDR (Indicating native 4k rendering)
or
2. Xbox X enhanced (No mention of native 4k support)
So stick that trailer and maybe try and grow some commen sense?
That means jack shit. So stick that shit post of yours and try grow some common sense.
So based on your reply then you now realize you were wrong and I was right.
You haven't posted any counter source information.
I don't need too..... All the evidence is in the conference video to which if you have watched the conference then you've already seen the evidence proving you are wrong ;)
That means jack shit. So stick that shit post of yours and try grow some common sense.
So based on your reply then you now realize you were wrong and I was right.
You haven't posted any counter source information.
I don't need too..... All the evidence is in the conference video to which if you have watched the conference then you've already seen the evidence proving you are wrong ;)
The trailer contains the 4K game list.
Forza Motorsport 7
Crackdown 3
State of Decay 2
Assassin's Creed Origins (already smoother on XBO-X)
Shadow of War
Metro Exodus
Anthem
Killing Floor 2 (PS4 Pro has 1800p)
Need for Speed Payback
Sea of Thieves
Madden NFL 18
Minecraft
Super Lucky's Tale
Ori
Gears of War 4
Forza Horizon 3
Killer Instinct
Resident Evil 7 BioHzard (PS4 Pro has 2240 x 1260)
For Honor (PS4 Pro has 2560 X 1440)
Ghost Recon Wildlands (PS4 Pro has 2560 X 1440)
Titanfall 2 (PS4 Pro has 2560 X 1440)
Farming Simulator 17
The Surge, (PS4 Pro has dynamic 4K, used double rate FP16)
World of Tanks, (PS4 Pro has 1800p)
Hitman (PS4 Pro has 2560 X 1440)
We Happy Few
Ark Survival Evolved (PS4 Pro has 1920x1080 30 fps detail mode, Unreal Engine 4) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wIP4KrnJPCE
That means jack shit. So stick that shit post of yours and try grow some common sense.
So based on your reply then you now realize you were wrong and I was right.
You haven't posted any counter source information.
I don't need too..... All the evidence is in the conference video to which if you have watched the conference then you've already seen the evidence proving you are wrong ;)
The trailer contains the 4K game list.
Forza Motorsport 7
Crackdown 3
State of Decay 2
Assassin's Creed Origins
Shadow of War
Metro Exodus
Anthem
Killing Floor 2
Need for Speed Payback
Sea of Thieves
Madden NFL 18
Minecraft
Super Lucky's Tale
Ori
Gears of War 4
Forza Horizon 3
Killer Instinct
Resident Evil 7 BioHzard (PS4 Pro has 2240 x 1260)
For Honor
Ghost Recon Wildlands
Titanfall 2
Farming Simulator 17
The Surge, (PS4 Pro has dynamic 4K, used double rate FP16)
World of Tanks, (PS4 Pro has 1800p)
Hitman
We Happy Few
Ark Survival Evolved
Outlast
Paladins Champions of the Realm
Astroneer
Rocket League
Slime Rancher
Rime
---------------------------------
Other know 4K games
Battlefront 2
Red Dead Redemption 2
Project Cars 2 (provisional)
So you actually fail at reading and logic then.
I say the proof is in the conference so you post names from the trailer?
Xbox One X will be a console that can do the equivalent of medium settings @4K running at 60 FPS, that's pretty awesome for a console gamer, I think.
Sure a lot of detail has to be sacrificed to achieve 60 FPS, but it's still looks awesome.
I run a 4k Ultrawide with a slight overclocked 1080 Ti and I get 70 plus FPS on Ultra which is amazing, but I'm still getting the X simply for couch gaming.
My biggest drawback is the lack of games, Crackdown 3 and State of Decay will last me though :).
Enjoy it for it is, an awesome console, if you don't like it, then don't waste your life posting about it.
You haven't posted any counter source information.
I don't need too..... All the evidence is in the conference video to which if you have watched the conference then you've already seen the evidence proving you are wrong ;)
The trailer contains the 4K game list.
Forza Motorsport 7
Crackdown 3
State of Decay 2
Assassin's Creed Origins
Shadow of War
Metro Exodus
Anthem
Killing Floor 2
Need for Speed Payback
Sea of Thieves
Madden NFL 18
Minecraft
Super Lucky's Tale
Ori
Gears of War 4
Forza Horizon 3
Killer Instinct
Resident Evil 7 BioHzard (PS4 Pro has 2240 x 1260)
For Honor
Ghost Recon Wildlands
Titanfall 2
Farming Simulator 17
The Surge, (PS4 Pro has dynamic 4K, used double rate FP16)
World of Tanks, (PS4 Pro has 1800p)
Hitman
We Happy Few
Ark Survival Evolved
Outlast
Paladins Champions of the Realm
Astroneer
Rocket League
Slime Rancher
Rime
---------------------------------
Other know 4K games
Battlefront 2
Red Dead Redemption 2
Project Cars 2 (provisional)
So you actually fail at reading and logic then.
I say the proof is in the conference so you post names from the trailer?
You haven't posted any counter source information.
I don't need too..... All the evidence is in the conference video to which if you have watched the conference then you've already seen the evidence proving you are wrong ;)
The trailer contains the 4K game list.
Forza Motorsport 7
Crackdown 3
State of Decay 2
Assassin's Creed Origins
Shadow of War
Metro Exodus
Anthem
Killing Floor 2
Need for Speed Payback
Sea of Thieves
Madden NFL 18
Minecraft
Super Lucky's Tale
Ori
Gears of War 4
Forza Horizon 3
Killer Instinct
Resident Evil 7 BioHzard (PS4 Pro has 2240 x 1260)
For Honor
Ghost Recon Wildlands
Titanfall 2
Farming Simulator 17
The Surge, (PS4 Pro has dynamic 4K, used double rate FP16)
World of Tanks, (PS4 Pro has 1800p)
Hitman
We Happy Few
Ark Survival Evolved
Outlast
Paladins Champions of the Realm
Astroneer
Rocket League
Slime Rancher
Rime
---------------------------------
Other know 4K games
Battlefront 2
Red Dead Redemption 2
Project Cars 2 (provisional)
So you actually fail at reading and logic then.
I say the proof is in the conference so you post names from the trailer?
You have done this because you know I'm right.
Prove it.
The new Metro cearly listed as 4k and HDR
The new Dragon Ball Z and 4k is clearly missing
There was a number of games that had 4k missing from the banner indicating that even the mighty Scorpio can't run all games at native 4k which is what I've been saying since it was annoucned and completely goes agasint all of your posts and stupid fucking charts comparing it to a 1070 and other PC GPU's.
Is it more powerful then PS4 Pro? Yes it is, is it powerful enough to run all games at native 4k while atleast keeping same settings as Xbone S and base PS4? NO!
It's pointless really, dude is full of lists and comparison tables while ignoring the reality of things.
Picking up comparison screens of bf1 means nothing, the thing is it's a heavily sponsored AMD game. There is a reason why that craphole engine mantle was supported by it. It plays to the weakness of AMD big time.
It's no suprise they advertise the gains with bf2 which they probably also heavily paid for to nuke settings down on all versions in order to make it run on there box.w
Dude you are talking against a wall. You are right. The memory isn't going to change anything.
The only craphole is your lack of understanding for AMD's push for async/sync compute.
Compute Engine (Async and Sync Compute ) is connected to L2 cache.
For NVIDIA Maxwell/Pascal GPUs, both Compute (Compute Shader/TMU) and Pixel Engines (Pixel Shader/ROPS) has the same access to L2 cache hence similar latency rates.
For current AMD GPU designs, only Compute (Compute Shader/TMU) Engine is connected to L2 cache hence Pixel Engines (Pixel Shader/ROPS) different latency rates to Compute Engine. AMD's push for async/sync compute is to minimize memory controller bottleneck.
Back in August, our pal David Kanter discovered one of the important ingredients of the secret sauce that is NVIDIA’s efficiency optimizations. As it turns out, NVIDIA has been doing tile based rasterization and binning since Maxwell, and that this was likely one of the big reasons Maxwell’s efficiency increased by so much. Though NVIDIA still refuses to comment on the matter, from what we can ascertain, breaking up a scene into tiles has allowed NVIDIA to keep a lot more traffic on-chip, which saves memory bandwidth, but also cuts down on very expensive accesses to VRAM.
...
Meanwhile, on the ROP side of matters, besides baking in the necessary support for the aforementioned binning technology, AMD is also making one other change to cut down on the amount of data that has to go off-chip to VRAM. AMD has significantly reworked how the ROPs (or as they like to call them, the Render Back-Ends) interact with their L2 cache. Starting with Vega, the ROPs are now clients of the L2 cache rather than the memory controller, allowing them to better and more directly use the relatively spacious L2 cache.
I also use NVIDIA Gameworks game.
@Gatygun said:
It's almost like reading ps4 launch again.
I bet his logic would be that 1500gb/s memory and 64gb is going to make the base ps4 5x faster.
At least PS4 is aging better than NVIDIA GK106.
The reason why the ps4 ages better is because sony is far more interested in keeping there box alive and heavily pays developers to do so. What interest does a old video card have for nvidia, nothing. They cost money because people do not upgrade.
Nvidia is noctorious about limited gpu's of a gen in features just to make people want to upgrade for the next line of gpu's. And people all over forums and internet fall for it. It's the same why they nuked the 970 memory, why they limited memory in general big time ( while amd didn't ) to force people to upgrade. Because the next gen they would just bribe high profile games to push higher memory requirements forwards to sell new cards.
What this has to do with anything i dunno.
About mantle, nobody used the technology and the games that did use it has massive issue's with it. That's how great that crapshoot engine was. I wonder why nobody used it if it was the greatest thing around that would enhance stuff so well.
That's the same thing that happens with the xbox scorpio. Nobody is going to optimize for it or go the extra mile other then microsoft themselves, which makes the box exactly what the ps4 pro does completely void most of the time other then a bit better performance.
If you think devs want to spend extra time for development you are mistaken not even nintendo does it for there handhelds. If you crack there 3DS and run costum stoftware on it, you can get more performance yourself in 2 seconds out of it on all games pretty much. Devs honestly don't care.
Resident Evil 7 BioHzard (PS4 Pro has 2240 x 1260)
For Honor
Ghost Recon Wildlands
Titanfall 2
Farming Simulator 17
The Surge, (PS4 Pro has dynamic 4K, used double rate FP16)
World of Tanks, (PS4 Pro has 1800p)
Hitman
We Happy Few
Ark Survival Evolved
Outlast
Paladins Champions of the Realm
Astroneer
Rocket League
Slime Rancher
Rime
---------------------------------
Other know 4K games
Battlefront 2
Red Dead Redemption 2
Project Cars 2 (provisional)
So you actually fail at reading and logic then.
I say the proof is in the conference so you post names from the trailer?
You have done this because you know I'm right.
Prove it.
The new Metro cearly listed as 4k and HDR
The new Dragon Ball Z and 4k is clearly missing
There was a number of games that had 4k missing from the banner indicating that even the mighty Scorpio can't run all games at native 4k which is what I've been saying since it was annoucned and completely goes agasint all of your posts and stupid fucking charts comparing it to a 1070 and other PC GPU's.
Is it more powerful then PS4 Pro? Yes it is, is it powerful enough to run all games at native 4k while atleast keeping same settings as Xbone S and base PS4? NO!
Dragon Ball Fighter Z is a mix of fucking 2D and 3D graphics game.
Resident Evil 7 BioHzard (PS4 Pro has 2240 x 1260)
For Honor
Ghost Recon Wildlands
Titanfall 2
Farming Simulator 17
The Surge, (PS4 Pro has dynamic 4K, used double rate FP16)
World of Tanks, (PS4 Pro has 1800p)
Hitman
We Happy Few
Ark Survival Evolved
Outlast
Paladins Champions of the Realm
Astroneer
Rocket League
Slime Rancher
Rime
---------------------------------
Other know 4K games
Battlefront 2
Red Dead Redemption 2
Project Cars 2 (provisional)
So you actually fail at reading and logic then.
I say the proof is in the conference so you post names from the trailer?
You have done this because you know I'm right.
Prove it.
The new Metro cearly listed as 4k and HDR
The new Dragon Ball Z and 4k is clearly missing
There was a number of games that had 4k missing from the banner indicating that even the mighty Scorpio can't run all games at native 4k which is what I've been saying since it was annoucned and completely goes agasint all of your posts and stupid fucking charts comparing it to a 1070 and other PC GPU's.
Is it more powerful then PS4 Pro? Yes it is, is it powerful enough to run all games at native 4k while atleast keeping same settings as Xbone S and base PS4? NO!
Dragon Ball Fighter Z is a mix of fucking 2D and 3D graphics game.
And? You asked for proof, you received proof..... So cry me some salty tears as the box you've spent months protecting and even made charts for has been proven by Microsoft themsleves to not render every game at 4k.
Not really wanting to enter the debate here between you and Colonel Ron but I'm fairly certain MS never said Every game would be 4K but rather they said every First Party game would be 4K. In fact I think they said precisely this; We'll leave it up to third party devs to use the Scorpio power however they see fit. Just sayin. :P
Not really wanting to enter the debate here between you and Colonel Ron but I'm fairly certain MS never said Every game would be 4K but rather they said every First Party game would be 4K. In fact I think they said precisely this; We'll leave it up to third party devs to use the Scorpio power however they see fit. Just sayin. :P
I know they said that, Ron on the other hand can't seem to compute the idea that his precious little benchmark charts are now all irrelvant and that depsite what he's been arguing over the last few months it won't be rendering everything at native 4k.
I have previously pointed it out to him that it wouldn't and he still wouldn't accept it, his dreams have been crushed.
The reason why the ps4 ages better is because sony is far more interested in keeping there box alive and heavily pays developers to do so. What interest does a old video card have for nvidia, nothing. They cost money because people do not upgrade.
That's not the full story.
1. NVIDIA Kelper wasn't compliant to DirectX12 Feature Level 12_0. All GCNs starting from GCN version 1.1 has support for DirectX12 Feature Level 12_0.
GCN version 1.1 has support for Shader Model 6.
GCN vesrion 1.1 has ACE units with each has 16 queues. PS4 has 8 ACE units while XBO has 2 ACE units.
DirectX12 Feature Level 12_0 is the minimum hardware for incoming Shader Model 6.
2. AMD GCN's CU has superior register count to stream processor count ratio over Kelper SM.
NVIDIA Keplier SM has 65536 x 32 bit registers for 192 stream processors
AMD GCM CU has 65536 x 32 bit registers for 64 stream processors.
Any vendor driver based shader optimizations involves correct register allocation budgets.
@Gatygun said:
Nvidia is noctorious about limited gpu's of a gen in features just to make people want to upgrade for the next line of gpu's. And people all over forums and internet fall for it
NVIDIA wasn't in the loop with MS.
With AMD, MS help designed XBO's GCN into version 1.1 and made it compliant for DirectX12 Feature Level 12_0.
@Gatygun said:
. It's the same why they nuked the 970 memory, why they limited memory in general big time ( while amd didn't ) to force people to upgrade. Because the next gen they would just bribe high profile games to push higher memory requirements forwards to sell new cards.
The reason for 970's 3.5 GB + 0.5 GB setup is due to each SM has connection to L2 cache partition which in-turn connected to memory controller. When SM is disabled on 970, it also cuts the connection to related memory controller, hence NVIDIA connected a slow crossbar between memory controller with disabled SM to a memory controller with working SM.
@Gatygun said:
What this has to do with anything i dunno.
About mantle, nobody used the technology and the games that did use it has massive issue's with it. That's how great that crapshoot engine was. I wonder why nobody used it if it was the greatest thing around that would enhance stuff so well.
Mantle was recycled for Vulkan. Mantle's shader language is still MS HLSL and it was ditched for Vulkan.
@Gatygun said:
That's the same thing that happens with the xbox scorpio. Nobody is going to optimize for it or go the extra mile other then microsoft themselves, which makes the box exactly what the ps4 pro does completely void most of the time other then a bit better performance.
On XBO-X, all XBO/X360/OG XB BC games has max Anisotropic Texture Filtering override.
XBO-X has enhanced Witcher 3 while PS4 Pro has zero. XBO-X's extra memory storage helps with shovelware from the PC side.
@Gatygun said:
If you think devs want to spend extra time for development you are mistaken not even nintendo does it for there handhelds. If you crack there 3DS and run costum stoftware on it, you can get more performance yourself in 2 seconds out of it on all games pretty much. Devs honestly don't care.
It depends on the ease of extra development.
For Assassin Creed Origin dev build, XBO-X is already smoother when compared PC version. http://www.dualshockers.com/assassins-creed-origins-project-scorpio-consistent-frame-rate-4k-resolution/
Interestingly, Ubisoft told the magazine that developers managed to get the game running on Scorpio within weeks of receiving the development kits, which seems to indicate that porting to the new console is fairly easy.
Scorpio's hardware design was profiled for existing 3D game engines.
XBO-X's extra memory storage helps with shovelware from the PC side.
The argument for Scorpio is optimize the hardware for existing software instead of optimize software for hardware.
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