The Fad is over- Japan Sales: PS3 35k, X360 13k, Wii 22k

FamiKing, why must the wii sell on par with the PS2 to not be a fad?

[QUOTE="GundamGuy0"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] DS didn't kill anything, if it did, the PS3 and 360 would've got hit hard as well, but they went up, or went down very little. The truth is, the Wii sales are crap.

Famiking

The PS3 and Xbox360 are going up because they had no where to go but up... they were abysmal prior to this. They haven't reached a saturation point were the sell though of the DS has a big effect yet. Because they are lower the effect is smaller, and is easyer to over come. It's an issue of magnatude.

[QUOTE="jim1029"][QUOTE="Famiking"] Depends what the winning movie is in terms of sales in the next movie generation :| The PS2 was compared to the PS1 was compared to the SNES was compared to the NES. Don't see why we should stop.Famiking

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="GundamGuy0"] If your argument was near flawless then none of us would be disagreeing with you either. But instead of reporting facts. Your taking those facts and interpreting them... people don't agree with your interpretation. GundamGuy0

Your throwing words around like collapse. The sales fell, but I don't know that I would call it a collapse. It's your interpertation, that this represents the peak which you've not really justified, and can't just justify with numbers. You have to include an economic theory, or some theory as to why this is happening. Your theory is that people have lost intrest, but it seems that you draw that conclusion from the same information data. In other words your theory is tautologous, or impossible to prove, or argue.

In order to win this you need another soruce of eveidence, perhaps something showing it's not a media darling anymore, or that that favor has shifted to another product.

FamiKing, why must the wii sell on par with the PS2 to not be a fad?

ActicEdge

[QUOTE="jim1029"][QUOTE="Famiking"] Depends what the winning movie is in terms of sales in the next movie generation :| The PS2 was compared to the PS1 was compared to the SNES was compared to the NES. Don't see why we should stop.Famiking

Actually, the SNES sold less then the NES. So no, it wouldn't be a first. Anyway, it's still too early to make predictions like this. Also, you have to remember that the Wii has had competition this whole time, but the PS2 had none.

OMG I can't believe this is still going. Anyway sales of PS3 and 360 good this week

PS3 Yakuza 3 (SEGA) 372,000 / NEW
360 Star Ocean 4: The Last Hope (Square Enix) 17,000 / 179,000... gee I wunder if these games have anything to do with that???

April 23, 2009 Monster Hunter G [JA] Capcom Action

Talk to me after April...

[QUOTE="GundamGuy0"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] Then please do tell what the collapse in Wii sales mean, because everything everyone is pointing towards would mean that something should've also happened, which it didn't (citing the DS example here).Famiking

Your throwing words around like collapse. The sales fell, but I don't know that I would call it a collapse. It's your interpertation, that this represents the peak which you've not really justified, and can't just justify with numbers. You have to include an economic theory, or some theory as to why this is happening. Your theory is that people have lost intrest, but it seems that you draw that conclusion from the same information data. In other words your theory is tautologous, or impossible to prove, or argue.

In order to win this you need another soruce of eveidence, perhaps something showing it's not a media darling anymore, or that that favor has shifted to another product.

But you said it was because of games!

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="GundamGuy0"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] DS didn't kill anything, if it did, the PS3 and 360 would've got hit hard as well, but they went up, or went down very little. The truth is, the Wii sales are crap.

GundamGuy0

The PS3 and Xbox360 are going up because they had no where to go but up... they were abysmal prior to this. They haven't reached a saturation point were the sell though of the DS has a big effect yet. Because they are lower the effect is smaller, and is easyer to over come. It's an issue of magnatude.

I doubt Wii's sales would cut by 60%, while the affect on the PS3 and 360 would be minimal, if not increasing their sales.

Maybe if it were 20% then I'd agree.

I don't know where your getting your %'s from? Did you forecast what the sales should have been, and charted it against what the sales are? I can do an auto regressive forecast for you if you want.

My last post, the Wii YOY figures.

I won't back pages to retreive the information, but i'm sure you remember

Wii
2007 - 730k
2008 - 760k
2009 - 310k

PS3
2007 - 225k
2008 - 290k
2009 - 195k

360
2007 - 65k
2008 - 33k
2009 - 92k

[QUOTE="GundamGuy0"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] Then please do tell what the collapse in Wii sales mean, because everything everyone is pointing towards would mean that something should've also happened, which it didn't (citing the DS example here).Famiking

Your throwing words around like collapse. The sales fell, but I don't know that I would call it a collapse. It's your interpertation, that this represents the peak which you've not really justified, and can't just justify with numbers. You have to include an economic theory, or some theory as to why this is happening. Your theory is that people have lost intrest, but it seems that you draw that conclusion from the same information data. In other words your theory is tautologous, or impossible to prove, or argue.

In order to win this you need another soruce of eveidence, perhaps something showing it's not a media darling anymore, or that that favor has shifted to another product.

[QUOTE="GundamGuy0"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] Then please do tell what the collapse in Wii sales mean, because everything everyone is pointing towards would mean that something should've also happened, which it didn't (citing the DS example here).Famiking

Your throwing words around like collapse. The sales fell, but I don't know that I would call it a collapse. It's your interpertation, that this represents the peak which you've not really justified, and can't just justify with numbers. You have to include an economic theory, or some theory as to why this is happening. Your theory is that people have lost intrest, but it seems that you draw that conclusion from the same information data. In other words your theory is tautologous, or impossible to prove, or argue.

In order to win this you need another soruce of eveidence, perhaps something showing it's not a media darling anymore, or that that favor has shifted to another product.

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="GundamGuy0"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"]

Your throwing words around like collapse. The sales fell, but I don't know that I would call it a collapse. It's your interpertation, that this represents the peak which you've not really justified, and can't just justify with numbers. You have to include an economic theory, or some theory as to why this is happening. Your theory is that people have lost intrest, but it seems that you draw that conclusion from the same information data. In other words your theory is tautologous, or impossible to prove, or argue.

In order to win this you need another soruce of eveidence, perhaps something showing it's not a media darling anymore, or that that favor has shifted to another product.

jim1029

But you said that it was because of games!

[QUOTE="jim1029"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] I'd call it a collapse, because it most definitely was direct. To cite: 62k -> 64k -> 72k -> 48k -> 43k -> 33k -> 28k -> 26k -> 24k That to me, is a collapse. It went directly from the 60-70k's to the 20k's. And the reason is - lack of interest, I'm sure most would agree.Famiking

But you said that it was because of games!

You are right and wrong. You are right, lackof game equals lack of interst. However, tell me, is games the only thing? Lets say nintendo releases new colors, interest renewed, not a fad anymore according to you? Or a price drop or a bundle. Heck, what will you say when it gets a game? The fad ended but now its renewed? You don't have muchh of an argument honestly.

But you said that it was because of games!

ActicEdge

You are right and wrong. You are right, lackof game equals lack of interst. However, tell me, is games the only thing? Lets say nintendo releases new colors, interest renewed, not a fad anymore according to you? Or a price drop or a bundle. Heck, what will you say when it gets a game? The fad ended but now its renewed? You don't have muchh of an argument honestly.

FamiKing, why must the wii sell on par with the PS2 to not be a fad?

ActicEdge

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] but the ps2 is now selling worse then then the wii and has all gen does that make it a fad? seeing ass any thing with decreasing sales over time seems to be a fad to youFamiking

2000 - 3,549,355

2001 - 3,570,750

2002 - 4,105,682

2003 - 3,282,623= fad according to your logic

2004 - 3,277,647= fad according to your logic

2005 - 2,175,547 = fad according to your logic

etc....

well, looks like the ps2 was a fad

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"] Yes, lack of games -> lack of interest.Famiking

You are right and wrong. You are right, lackof game equals lack of interst. However, tell me, is games the only thing? Lets say nintendo releases new colors, interest renewed, not a fad anymore according to you? Or a price drop or a bundle. Heck, what will you say when it gets a game? The fad ended but now its renewed? You don't have muchh of an argument honestly.

And what gaurentee is there that the sales will remain low?

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] but the ps2 is now selling worse then then the wii and has all gen does that make it a fad? seeing ass any thing with decreasing sales over time seems to be a fad to youogvampire

2000 - 3,549,355

2001 - 3,570,750

2002 - 4,105,682

2003 - 3,282,623= fad according to your logic

2004 - 3,277,647= fad according to your logic

2005 - 2,175,547 = fad according to your logic

etc....

well, looks like the ps2 was a fad

[QUOTE="ogvampire"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] No, PS2 actually had a good run, unlike the Wii:

2000 - 3,549,355

2001 - 3,570,750

2002 - 4,105,682

2003 - 3,282,623= fad according to your logic

2004 - 3,277,647= fad according to your logic

2005 - 2,175,547 = fad according to your logic

etc....

Famiking

well, looks like the ps2 was a fad

hm... i wonder why?

i mean im using your logic that decreasing sales = fad

sounds ridiculous, right? well, now you know what we have been dealing with when it came to your logic

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]

FamiKing, why must the wii sell on par with the PS2 to not be a fad?

Famiking

Besides the DS, the PS2 is the best selling console in Japan and it the best selling console ever. That is not a fair bench mark for the Wii, PS3 or 360. You don't use the best selling console ever for decency, that is a crazy standard.

And what gaurentee is there that the sales will remain low?

ActicEdge

As for the second - I guess what I'm trying to say is, take any fad that ever existed. Imagine companies give more incentive for people to buy it again and it becomes popular again. Technically it WAS a fad, but you can't say it still IS a fad, in that its current popularity will die down very soon.Famiking

hm... i wonder why?

i mean im using your logic that decreasing sales = fad

sounds ridiculous, right? well, now you know what we have been dealing with when it came to your logic

ogvampire

No, it seems the only reason you're actually posting is to annoy me.

But to answer you - The Wii only sold well for 8 months and then died off, the PS2 sold well for 3 years.

If you reply again with a question that has a really obvious answer, I'll just smh and not reply.

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]And what gaurentee is there that the sales will remain low?

Famiking

As for the second - I guess what I'm trying to say is, take any fad that ever existed. Imagine companies give more incentive for people to buy it again and it becomes popular again. Technically it WAS a fad, but you can't say it still IS a fad, in that its current popularity will die down very soon.Famiking

So then what's the big deal if the fad ended or not. What's the big deal if the thing even was a fad and leveled off to average sales? Are you saying that the console will only see mediocore sales from now on or what.

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="ActicEdge"]

FamiKing, why must the wii sell on par with the PS2 to not be a fad?

ActicEdge

Besides the DS, the PS2 is the best selling console in Japan and it the best selling console ever. That is not a fair bench mark for the Wii, PS3 or 360. You don't use the best selling console ever for decency, that is a crazy standard.

but its not about trends its about the current sales that you have been harping on, the ps2 is a dead fad that sells poor. admit it the ps2 is a fadsurrealnumber5

[QUOTE="ogvampire"]hm... i wonder why?

i mean im using your logic that decreasing sales = fad

sounds ridiculous, right? well, now you know what we have been dealing with when it came to your logic

Famiking

No, it seems the only reason you're actually posting is to annoy me.

But to answer you - The Wii only sold well for 8 months and then died off, the PS2 sold well for 3 years.

If you reply again with a question that has a really obvious answer, I'll just smh and not reply.

:roll:

selling 'well' is subjective... it has been the best selling console since launch, thats a fact

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] That's not what I said. It has to sell decently to be considered "popular". The measure used for decency is the PS2, since traditionally, the console market expands every generation.Famiking

Besides the DS, the PS2 is the best selling console in Japan and it the best selling console ever. That is not a fair bench mark for the Wii, PS3 or 360. You don't use the best selling console ever for decency, that is a crazy standard.

PS2 was compared to PS1 was compared to SNES was compared to NES. Don't see why we should stop now. Famiking

Doesn't matter. Selling at the level of the best selling console ever is not a standard for decency. It's a standard for excellence, otherwise the PS3, 360 and Wii are failures and I think that is a ridiculous thing to say. None of them will outsell the PS2 but they are all on the way to sell 40 + million before the gen ends. That is not a failure, its just not exceptional. Its good, not fantastic.

So then what's the big deal if the fad ended or not. What's the big deal if the thing even was a fad and leveled off to average sales? Are you saying that the console will only see mediocore sales from now on or what.ActicEdge

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] but its not about trends its about the current sales that you have been harping on, the ps2 is a dead fad that sells poor. admit it the ps2 is a fadFamiking

The first post of any thread needs to bring a solid argument to the table so hundreds of arguments aren't made. Your first post leaves a lot to be discussed. You cannot expect people to read a 20+ page thread just because you weren't clear from the get go.

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] but its not about trends its about the current sales that you have been harping on, the ps2 is a dead fad that sells poor. admit it the ps2 is a fadActicEdge

The first post of any thread needs to bring a solid argument to the table so hundreds of arguments aren't made. Your first post leaves a lot to be discussed. You cannot expect people to read a 20+ page thread just because you weren't clear from the get go.

he thinks the ps2 is not a fad because it sold what he considers an amount decent enough for it to not be considered a fad....

real logical, right?

Doesn't matter. Selling at the level of the best selling console ever is not a standard for decency. It's a standard for excellence, otherwise the PS3, 360 and Wii are failures and I think that is a ridiculous thing to say. None of them will outsell the PS2 but they are all on the way to sell 40 + million before the gen ends. That is not a failure, its just not exceptional. Its good, not fantastic.

ActicEdge

So what would you think if such a case as this happened:

Wii - 18 million
PS3 - 5 million
360 - 2 million

compared to

PS3 - 24 million
GCN - 4 million
XBX - 500k

It certainly doesn't help, the Wii has failed to carry on the legacy of a winning console.

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]So then what's the big deal if the fad ended or not. What's the big deal if the thing even was a fad and leveled off to average sales? Are you saying that the console will only see mediocore sales from now on or what.Famiking

This does't prove a fad though. All this proves is sales have slowed down and big games are neede to lift them up. You don't get to set the standard of what is terrible and what is not. 22K isn't great, its average. Further more, you keep ignoring factors like price cuts, bundles and multiple colors. Games are not the only way to boast sales.

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] but its not about trends its about the current sales that you have been harping on, the ps2 is a dead fad that sells poor. admit it the ps2 is a fadActicEdge

The first post of any thread needs to bring a solid argument to the table so hundreds of arguments aren't made. Your first post leaves a lot to be discussed. You cannot expect people to read a 20+ page thread just because you weren't clear from the get go.

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]Doesn't matter. Selling at the level of the best selling console ever is not a standard for decency. It's a standard for excellence, otherwise the PS3, 360 and Wii are failures and I think that is a ridiculous thing to say. None of them will outsell the PS2 but they are all on the way to sell 40 + million before the gen ends. That is not a failure, its just not exceptional. Its good, not fantastic.

Famiking

So what would you think if such a case as this happened:

Wii - 18 million
PS3 - 5 million
360 - 2 million

compared to

PS3 - 24 million
GCN - 4 million
XBX - 500k

It certainly doesn't help, the Wii has failed to carry on the legacy of a winning console.

what are you talking about?

the winning console just has to outsell the competition....

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]Doesn't matter. Selling at the level of the best selling console ever is not a standard for decency. It's a standard for excellence, otherwise the PS3, 360 and Wii are failures and I think that is a ridiculous thing to say. None of them will outsell the PS2 but they are all on the way to sell 40 + million before the gen ends. That is not a failure, its just not exceptional. Its good, not fantastic.

Famiking

So what would you think if such a case as this happened:

Wii - 18 million
PS3 - 5 million
360 - 2 million

compared to

PS3 - 24 million
GCN - 4 million
XBX - 500k

It certainly doesn't help, the Wii has failed to carry on the legacy of a winning console.

So what? It's not the wii's job to carry on the PS2's legacy. Are you trying to tell me that 18 million consoles sold in Japan is a failure?

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="ActicEdge"]So then what's the big deal if the fad ended or not. What's the big deal if the thing even was a fad and leveled off to average sales? Are you saying that the console will only see mediocore sales from now on or what.ActicEdge

This does't prove a fad though. All this proves is sales have slowed down and big games are neede to lift them up. You don't get to set the standard of what is terrible and what is not. 22K isn't great, its average. Further more, you keep ignoring factors like price cuts, bundles and multiple colors. Games are not the only way to boast sales.

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] See above posts. +Read whole thread, so I don't have to reinstate myself, which I think accounts for half of my total post count at this point.Famiking

The first post of any thread needs to bring a solid argument to the table so hundreds of arguments aren't made. Your first post leaves a lot to be discussed. You cannot expect people to read a 20+ page thread just because you weren't clear from the get go.

lol! you dont cease to amaze

our facts apparently are 'dead arguments' :lol:

yet you speculations are somehow fact based on you just looking at numbers and interpreting.... awesome

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]Doesn't matter. Selling at the level of the best selling console ever is not a standard for decency. It's a standard for excellence, otherwise the PS3, 360 and Wii are failures and I think that is a ridiculous thing to say. None of them will outsell the PS2 but they are all on the way to sell 40 + million before the gen ends. That is not a failure, its just not exceptional. Its good, not fantastic.

Famiking

So what would you think if such a case as this happened:

Wii - 18 million
PS3 - 5 million
360 - 2 million

compared to

PS3 - 24 million
GCN - 4 million
XBX - 500k

It certainly doesn't help, the Wii has failed to carry on the legacy of a winning console.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] but its not about trends its about the current sales that you have been harping on, the ps2 is a dead fad that sells poor. admit it the ps2 is a fadFamiking

[QUOTE="ActicEdge"]

[QUOTE="Famiking"] The basis of it - Wii sales were great, now they are terrible. They will stay terrible until Nintendo has a steady release of games, and by steady I mean at least one big game at least every month, if not every two months. Then the once fad will be reintroduced, whether its still a fad can be questioned, you can really only tell after the fact.Famiking

This does't prove a fad though. All this proves is sales have slowed down and big games are neede to lift them up. You don't get to set the standard of what is terrible and what is not. 22K isn't great, its average. Further more, you keep ignoring factors like price cuts, bundles and multiple colors. Games are not the only way to boast sales.

Until we agree the PS2 is the standard (which will never happen) you are restating an argument I won't agree with and you aren't proving it. Unless you can bring factual evidence that the PS2 is the industry standard in what is consdered good sales, you aren't making any worth while point. Again, not my problem you didn't stomp any so called misconceptions with your opening post. I shuldn't have to read 20+ pages of iseless ranting to find out the point you want to make. You are3 making the statement, the burden of proof is on you.

Let's make something clear.

There are two wars every generation. Best selling console, and best console.

Often times these are shared. Snes, PS2 ...

But it isn't the case with the wii. If the PS3 and 360 are not the winners in the latter role, then it is certainly not clear.

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="Zhengi"] I'm pretty sure that back in the day, people who thought the earth was flat instead of round were pretty stubborn in their belief. It took the Church almost 430 years to acknowledge Galileo's work as fact. So I doubt convincing you has anything to do with them being right.ogvampire

actually, it is YOUR arguments that have been wrong or/and irrelevant.

you wont listen to reason, you just post numbers and put your own spin on them.... you are the church, we are galileo

Everyone puts their own spin on the facts.

It's called analysis.

Let's make something clear.

There are two wars every generation. Best selling console, and best console.

Often times these are shared. Snes, PS2 ...

But it isn't the case with the wii. If the PS3 and 360 are not the winners in the latter role, then it is certainly not clear.

hakanakumono

what does that have to do with anything in this thread?