The FALLOUT 3 Reality Thread

[QUOTE="cakeorrdeath"]So is the problem now that bethesda didn't use a scientific dictionary before designing characters for thsi fantasy univers?Vandalvideo

Or simply explained via means not solely based on real world science.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]asking if someone knows what something means is a question - not an example of ad hominem. and the fact of the matter is that you don't know what it means based on your explanations. unless you want to try to tell me there are no documented cases of feral patients that had originated in civilized society. add to that your omission of the fact that even the creators of the fallout universe still have arguments about the origin of ghouls re: FEV and pure radiation I think it's safe to say not all ghouls had to come from bakersfield. even the Vault wiki says 'most' originated in 12/bakersfield. Vandalvideo

That is absolutely wrong. Feral does not just mean no contact with humans. A feral child is indeed one which has animalistic tendencies due to a lack of human interaction, and "feral" can indeed be defined in that manner, but that is not the soul meaning of the word feral. Heck, my dog had to be put down because of a virus it contracted which would inevitably make him "feral"; are you going to say that that's because he had no contact with people?

Feral is just a term used for something creature-like, animalistic, aggressive. Dont be so pedantic.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="cakeorrdeath"]So is the problem now that bethesda didn't use a scientific dictionary before designing characters for thsi fantasy univers?cakeorrdeath

Or simply explained via means not solely based on real world science.

That is absolutely wrong. Feral does not just mean no contact with humans. A feral child is indeed one which has animalistic tendencies due to a lack of human interaction, and "feral" can indeed be defined in that manner, but that is not the soul meaning of the word feral. Heck, my dog had to be put down because of a virus it contracted which would inevitably make him "feral"; are you going to say that that's because he had no contact with people Feral is just a term used for something creature-like, animalistic, aggressive. Dont be so pedantic. Ninja-Hippo

First of all, a fantastic post Subrosian.

Great post, but the actual thought behind it makes me chuckle. You have a well thought out opinion, which I completely disagree with. I'm all about games going mainstream and letting the cash roll in. It's time to kill off hardcore gaming all together.BioShockOwnz

That means that you enjoy playing anything mainstream as long as its a cash cow? So I presume that you really enjoy playing Mario Tennis or whatever?

Wait, you must enjoy playing Wii then? Or... is it too childish and casual?

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]asking if someone knows what something means is a question - not an example of ad hominem. and the fact of the matter is that you don't know what it means based on your explanations. unless you want to try to tell me there are no documented cases of feral patients that had originated in civilized society. add to that your omission of the fact that even the creators of the fallout universe still have arguments about the origin of ghouls re: FEV and pure radiation I think it's safe to say not all ghouls had to come from bakersfield. even the Vault wiki says 'most' originated in 12/bakersfield. Vandalvideo

no i didn't. I was confused that you couldn't see that a Ghoul in the wild = a feral ghoul. especially if he isn't communicating with me and speaks in grunts and says things like 'brainssssssssssssss!!'... nothing more nothing less. it was not an attack, just trying to make sure we were on the same page - we obviously weren't.

and again, please read all i type. MOST came from bakersfield, not ALL. not exclusively. i'm not touting pnp as the bible, there is in fact a 'fallout bible' that takes everything in to account. so you can't based everything on pnp, i just used it as an example to show that ghouls can move as fast as humans...

and omfg did you just use your 'numerous psychology electives' as a means to explain why you know what a feral ghoul is? There are NUMEROUS cases of feral people who lived many many years in civilized society.. wow.

Feral (i posted the definition earlier) means 'animal in the wild' in it's most basic sense. anyone who is in the wild long enough to lose the traits of civilized society is considered feral. Genie is an example of a 'type' of feral person.

the world ain't as black and white as you paint it... and i have trouble believing your profs taught you that that was the only type of feral being.... wow. just wow.

RobbieH1234 - glitchspot if giving me HTML errors when i quote...

Yes, yes i'm well aware of how ghouls came about. Again though; Bethesda said "aren't you curious as to how the ghouls ended up on the east coast? Surely somebody has figured it out?"

So again, dont be so hostile to these things. Clearly it'll all be explained and will fit with the original story, otherwise why are they surprised that the fallout hardcore haven't figured out how it happened already? When the game comes out, and no explanation is offered, and everything is different without reason, complain. Simply discarding any new developments however, makes no sense. At least give it a chance. Why must everything be met with disdain?

Ninja-Hippo

Anywho, didn't they say "how did mutants end up on the east coast" and not ghouls? Or am I just tired? Didn't the ending of Fallout 1 explain why mutants are there (fear of rebellion from the normal people)? I could guess why ghouls are there (another Vault wasn't closed blah blah), I just can't wrap my head around how they can suddenly leap at tremendous speed and zap with a radiation attack. Ugh, I'm tired of talking about Fallout 3.:x

[QUOTE="cakeorrdeath"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="cakeorrdeath"]So is the problem now that bethesda didn't use a scientific dictionary before designing characters for thsi fantasy univers?Vandalvideo

Or simply explained via means not solely based on real world science.

Why must they use feral to its technichal meaning?

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]That is absolutely wrong. Feral does not just mean no contact with humans. A feral child is indeed one which has animalistic tendencies due to a lack of human interaction, and "feral" can indeed be defined in that manner, but that is not the soul meaning of the word feral. Heck, my dog had to be put down because of a virus it contracted which would inevitably make him "feral"; are you going to say that that's because he had no contact with people Feral is just a term used for something creature-like, animalistic, aggressive. Dont be so pedantic. Vandalvideo

hey - GUESS WHAT Vandal?

they probably are referring to the non-psych definition of Feral in Fallout 3. unless they have someone with a PhD in Ghoul ********* psych behaviour working at bethsoft.

it means ---- in the wild ----, aka ---- animal in the wild ----.

no i didn't. I was confused that you couldn't see that a Ghoul in the wild = a feral ghoul. especially if he isn't communicating with me and speaks in grunts and says things like 'brainssssssssssssss!!'... nothing more nothing less. it was not an attack, just trying to make sure we were on the same page - we obviously weren't. and again, please read all i type. MOST came from bakersfield, not ALL. not exclusively. i'm not touting pnp as the bible, there is in fact a 'fallout bible' that takes everything in to account. so you can't based everything on pnp, i just used it as an example to show that ghouls can move as fast as humans... and omfg did you just use your 'numerous psychology electives' as a means to explain why you know what a feral ghoul is? There are NUMEROUS cases of feral people who lived many many years in civilized society.. wow. Feral (i posted the definition earlier) means 'animal in the wild' in it's most basic sense. anyone who is in the wild long enough to lose the traits of civilized society is considered feral. Genie is an example of a 'type' of feral person. the world ain't as black and white as you paint it... and i have trouble believing your profs taught you that that was the only type of feral being.... wow. just wow3picuri3

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] Because its a RETCON. I'm merely pointing out the fact that bethesda isn't following cannon. Thats it.Vandalvideo

No, you're assuming it's a retcon. You're taking a negative approach and refusing to see this as anything other than a bad thing. Any host of new story developments could result in feral ghouls. And Bethesda have reassured fans that all we be explained. Why you're assuming that they're rewriting the very history of which the game is set is beyond me.

Again; there was nothing in Halo 2 which facilitated grunts becoming bad guys once again. Halo 3 comes out, wham, Prophets fill their heads with threatening propaganda and scare them into rejoining the covenant.

If that was Bethesda making Halo 3, we'd be screaming now at how they're so stupid for changing grunts from Halo 2 to 3. There's plenty to facilitate a feral ghoul. How you can possibly say that it's IMPOSSIBLE for there to be a feral ghoul in the fallout universe makes absolutely no sense. Heck on the very, very simplest of terms they could simply have been there all along but not encountered until now. They could work up a whole backstory for them. I doubt they will however, as AGAIN, bethesda have already said that their existance can be explained by Fallout 2 and have challenged people to figure it out.

hey - GUESS WHAT Vandal? they probably are referring to the non-psych definition of Feral in Fallout 3. unless they have someone with a PhD in Ghoul ********* psych behaviour working at bethsoft. it means ---- in the wild ----, aka ---- animal in the wild ----.3picuri3

If that was Bethesda making Halo 3, we'd be screaming now at how they're so stupid for changing grunts from Halo 2 to 3. There's plenty to facilitate a feral ghoul. How you can possibly say that it's IMPOSSIBLE for there to be a feral ghoul in the fallout universe makes absolutely no sense. Heck on the very, very simplest of terms they could simply have been there all along but not encountered until now. They could work up a whole backstory for them. I doubt they will however, as AGAIN, bethesda have already said that their existance can be explained by Fallout 2 and have challenged people to figure it out. Ninja-Hippo

Listen, its quite clear what the terminology means when you're discussing FERAL PEOPLE. While feral is a word used to describe wild things, this nomenclature is used by psychologists to refer to people who grew up with a lack of human interaction. The canon for this game explicitly states that ghouls came from bakersfield. In an area with tons of humans, you can't technically have a FERAL HUMAN. (Ghoul) Vandalvideo

Sorry but you're just wrong there. Flat-out. Feral does not mean deprived of human interaction. In the context of a feral child it does, but that is simply one definition. If you were to ask anybody what feral means, you'd be told wild, creature-like, aggressive. And Fallout 1 and 2 clearly allows for the existance of such ghouls; those affected by radiation to a greater extent than the civilised ghouls being one really obvious explanation. I imagine they've got something a little smarter than that though.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]hey - GUESS WHAT Vandal? they probably are referring to the non-psych definition of Feral in Fallout 3. unless they have someone with a PhD in Ghoul ********* psych behaviour working at bethsoft. it means ---- in the wild ----, aka ---- animal in the wild ----.Vandalvideo

and....

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] Listen, its quite clear what the terminology means when you're discussing FERAL PEOPLE. While feral is a word used to describe wild things, this nomenclature is used by psychologists to refer to people who grew up with a lack of human interaction. The canon for this game explicitly states that ghouls came from bakersfield. In an area with tons of humans, you can't technically have a FERAL HUMAN. (Ghoul) Ninja-Hippo

Sorry but you're just wrong there. Flat-out. Feral does not mean deprived of human interaction. In the context of a feral child it does, but that is simply one definition. If you were to ask anybody what feral means, you'd be told wild, creature-like, aggressive. And Fallout 1 and 2 clearly allows for the existance of such ghouls; those affected by radiation to a greater extent than the civilised ghouls being one really obvious explanation. I imagine they've got something a little smarter than that though.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]hey - GUESS WHAT Vandal? they probably are referring to the non-psych definition of Feral in Fallout 3. unless they have someone with a PhD in Ghoul ********* psych behaviour working at bethsoft. it means ---- in the wild ----, aka ---- animal in the wild ----.Vandalvideo

no you are - you're applying psych terms to a video game world.

Feral has many defintions used in and out of psychology. to apply the psych definition to something in a video game (that isn't a game about psychology) would be an abuse of meaning and definition.

don't take the argument to semantics - that's my yard. graduate with a minor in semantics taught by one of the fathers of semantics - marcel danesi :)

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="3picuri3"]hey - GUESS WHAT Vandal? they probably are referring to the non-psych definition of Feral in Fallout 3. unless they have someone with a PhD in Ghoul ********* psych behaviour working at bethsoft. it means ---- in the wild ----, aka ---- animal in the wild ----.cakeorrdeath

and....

This is completely off-topic, but I seem to be learning new words from this thread :P cheers.

Do the retcons mean that much really? I remember you vandal mentioning the ones in WoW , while I didnt pay that much attention at the time, I'm sure the story fits well enough to be acceptable.

no you are - you're applying psych terms to a video game world. Feral has many defintions used in and out of psychology. to apply the psych definition to something in a video game (that isn't a game about psychology) would be an abuse of semantics.don't take the argument to semantics - that's my yard. graduate with a minor in semantics taught by one of the fathers of semantics - marcel danesi :)3picuri3

This is completely off-topic, but I seem to be learning new words from this thread :P cheers.

Do the retcons mean that much really? I remember you vandal mentioning the ones in WoW , while I didnt pay that much attention at the time, I'm sure the story fits well enough to be acceptable.

Meu2k7

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="3picuri3"]hey - GUESS WHAT Vandal? they probably are referring to the non-psych definition of Feral in Fallout 3. unless they have someone with a PhD in Ghoul ********* psych behaviour working at bethsoft. it means ---- in the wild ----, aka ---- animal in the wild ----.3picuri3

no you are - you're applying psych terms to a video game world.

Feral has many defintions used in and out of psychology. to apply the psych definition to something in a video game (that isn't a game about psychology) would be an abuse of semantics.

Exactly, I mean if you wanna judge Falllout by real world science there gonna be a few discrepancies :P

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]If that was Bethesda making Halo 3, we'd be screaming now at how they're so stupid for changing grunts from Halo 2 to 3. There's plenty to facilitate a feral ghoul. How you can possibly say that it's IMPOSSIBLE for there to be a feral ghoul in the fallout universe makes absolutely no sense. Heck on the very, very simplest of terms they could simply have been there all along but not encountered until now. They could work up a whole backstory for them. I doubt they will however, as AGAIN, bethesda have already said that their existance can be explained by Fallout 2 and have challenged people to figure it out. Vandalvideo

I know what retcon is, but you obviously dont. Retcon is changing the original history. For example, comics go back and change the locales and timelines of their super heroes all the time so that they can fight together in a special one-off. Spiderman meets Wolverine is one example; they had to fundamentally change the world in which they both lived to pull that off. That was a retcon.

Simply adding something to a storyline which wasn't previously revealed isn't a retcon at all. For all you know, it was there all along. You also really need to stop claiming that feral ghouls are impossible in fallout 1 and 2; that's just plain wrong. If you were playing Fallout 2 and came across a group of feral ghouls towards the end would you honestly have said "wait a minute... this isn't possible!" There are plenty of reasons that could happen, with bethesda have already said will be revealed.

Again; there was nothing in Halo 2 which facilitated grunts becoming bad guys once again. Halo 3 comes out, wham, Prophets fill their heads with threatening propaganda and scare them into rejoining the covenant.

If that was Bethesda making Halo 3, we'd be screaming now at how they're so stupid for changing grunts from Halo 2 to 3. There's plenty to facilitate a feral ghoul. How you can possibly say that it's IMPOSSIBLE for there to be a feral ghoul in the fallout universe makes absolutely no sense. Heck on the very, very simplest of terms they could simply have been there all along but not encountered until now. They could work up a whole backstory for them. I doubt they will however, as AGAIN, bethesda have already said that their existance can be explained by Fallout 2 and have challenged people to figure it out.

Ninja-Hippo

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]If that was Bethesda making Halo 3, we'd be screaming now at how they're so stupid for changing grunts from Halo 2 to 3. There's plenty to facilitate a feral ghoul. How you can possibly say that it's IMPOSSIBLE for there to be a feral ghoul in the fallout universe makes absolutely no sense. Heck on the very, very simplest of terms they could simply have been there all along but not encountered until now. They could work up a whole backstory for them. I doubt they will however, as AGAIN, bethesda have already said that their existance can be explained by Fallout 2 and have challenged people to figure it out. Ninja-Hippo

I know what retcon is, but you obviously dont. Retcon is changing the original history. For example, comics go back and change the locales and timelines of their super heroes all the time so that they can fight together in a special one-off. Spiderman meets Wolverine is one example; they had to fundamentally change the world in which they both lived to pull that off. That was a retcon.

Simply adding something to a storyline which wasn't previously revealed isn't a retcon at all. For all you know, it was there all along. You also really need to stop claiming that feral ghouls are impossible in fallout 1 and 2; that's just plain wrong. If you were playing Fallout 2 and came across a group of feral ghouls towards the end would you honestly have said "wait a minute... this isn't possible!" There are plenty of reasons that could happen, with bethesda have already said will be revealed.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]no you are - you're applying psych terms to a video game world. Feral has many defintions used in and out of psychology. to apply the psych definition to something in a video game (that isn't a game about psychology) would be an abuse of semantics.don't take the argument to semantics - that's my yard. graduate with a minor in semantics taught by one of the fathers of semantics - marcel danesi :)Vandalvideo

No it isn't. That isn't a matter of opinion, that is wrong. A feral person isn't someone who grew up without human interaction. That is indeed one definition of a feral person, but there are other reasons a person can become feral, be it mental breakdown or even disease.

Feral, by definition:

"Living in the wild, not domesticated, previously domesticated plant or animal which has returned to a wild state."

You're saying it's IMPOSSIBLE that a group of ghouls, twisted by radiation, could end up living in the wild?

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]no you are - you're applying psych terms to a video game world. Feral has many defintions used in and out of psychology. to apply the psych definition to something in a video game (that isn't a game about psychology) would be an abuse of semantics.don't take the argument to semantics - that's my yard. graduate with a minor in semantics taught by one of the fathers of semantics - marcel danesi :)Vandalvideo

if you believe there is only one meaning and definition for Feral then - yes - you're absolutey right.

but that's not true.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="3picuri3"]no you are - you're applying psych terms to a video game world. Feral has many defintions used in and out of psychology. to apply the psych definition to something in a video game (that isn't a game about psychology) would be an abuse of semantics.don't take the argument to semantics - that's my yard. graduate with a minor in semantics taught by one of the fathers of semantics - marcel danesi :)Ninja-Hippo

No it isn't. That isn't a matter of opinion, that is wrong. A feral person isn't someone who grew up without human interaction. That is indeed one definition of a feral person, but there are other reasons a person can become feral, be it mental breakdown or even disease.

Feral, by definition:

"Living in the wild, not domesticated, previously domesticated plant or animal which has returned to a wild state."

You're saying it's IMPOSSIBLE that a group of ghouls, twisted by radiation, could end up living in the wild?

heh, the second defintion says it all - but according to Vandal there is only one definition.

No it isn't. That isn't a matter of opinion, that is wrong. A feral person isn't someone who grew up without human interaction. That is indeed one definition of a feral person, but there are other reasons a person can become feral, be it mental breakdown or even disease.Feral, by definition:"Living in the wild, not domesticated, previously domesticated plant or animal which has returned to a wild state."You're saying it's IMPOSSIBLE that a group of ghouls, twisted by radiation, could end up living in the wild? Ninja-Hippo

They're altering the history to fit their own agendas. That is a retcon.Vandalvideo

No they're not. They may very well do, but we dont know that. You're simply forcing yourself to believe that that is the case because you dont want to look positively at this game. Any number of simple, reasonable explanations could result in feral ghouls. They could have been introduced in the original fallout games at any time, with any explanation as to their existance. You're acting like everything in existance was revealed and explained in the original games.

There was no pulse in half life 1. But there is in 2. Is that a retcon? Hell no. They just invented it. Or maybe it was there all along but you simply never encountered it on your original adventure?

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] They're altering the history to fit their own agendas. That is a retcon.Ninja-Hippo

No they're not. They may very well do, but we dont know that. You're simply forcing yourself to believe that that is the case because you dont want to look positively at this game. Any number of simple, reasonable explanations could result in feral ghouls. They could have been introduced in the original fallout games at any time, with any explanation as to their existance. You're acting like everything in existance was revealed and explained in the original games.

There was no pulse in half life 1. But there is in 2. Is that a retcon? Hell no. They just invented it. Or maybe it was there all along but you simply never encountered it on your original adventure?

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]No it isn't. That isn't a matter of opinion, that is wrong. A feral person isn't someone who grew up without human interaction. That is indeed one definition of a feral person, but there are other reasons a person can become feral, be it mental breakdown or even disease.Feral, by definition:"Living in the wild, not domesticated, previously domesticated plant or animal which has returned to a wild state."You're saying it's IMPOSSIBLE that a group of ghouls, twisted by radiation, could end up living in the wild? Vandalvideo

It says quite clearly, plant or animal. :|

Again; this isn't an opinion. This is a fact. Feral does not mean no human contact. It doesn't. Why you're insisting it does it beyond me. It doesn't. Fact.

A feral child is one which was deprived of human contact. I studied it with child language acquisition when i was 17. Why you're using such a topic in discussion of video games is again, beyond me. Maybe because you dont want to admit that you definition of feral is way off?

Feral = wild. Simple. That's what it means. It can be brought on through lack of human contact, a mental breakdown, diseases like rabies, or heck, just up and leaving your house one day to go and live in the woods. There was a dude on the news who became feral after deciding he wanted to live in a forest using only nature to get by; ten years later he was found and filmed as more or less completely mindless.

So please, of all the arguements going on here, stop this one. Stop this notion that feral = child raised with no human contact. It doesnt.

It says quite clearly, plant or animal. :|Again; this isn't an opinion. This is a fact. Feral does not mean no human contact. It doesn't. Why you're insisting it does it beyond me. It doesn't. Fact.A feral child is one which was deprived of human contact. I studied it with child language acquisition when i was 17. Why you're using such a topic in discussion of video games is again, beyond me. Maybe because you dont want to admit that you definition of feral is way off?Feral = wild. Simple. That's what it means. It can be brought on through lack of human contact, a mental breakdown, diseases like rabies, or heck, just up and leaving your house one day to go and live in the woods. There was a dude on the news who became feral after deciding he wanted to live in a forest using only nature to get by; ten years later he was found and filmed as more or less completely mindless.So please, of all the arguements going on here, stop this one. Stop this notion that feral = child raised with no human contact. It doesnt. Ninja-Hippo

I don't want to look positively at this game? Ok I'm tired of all you people throwing that into my mouth. For the tenth time, and I will caps it this time so you don't get this wrong again. "FALLOUT 3 WILL BE A GREAT GAME, IT WILL JUST A CRAP FALLOUT GAME". I've backed that statement up with the fact that they've removed practically everything that defined the original titles. So please, don't say that I'm not looking positively at this game. As far as retcon goes, if its not in the cannon and someone other than the original authors add it to fit their own agends, that totally constitutes.Vandalvideo

I was talking about it as a fallout game. Your caps were wasted. :|

Also; you're using a lot of words which i dont think you understand the meaning of, and no that's not an insult so please dont be offended. You threw the word feral around and clearly have a very specific understanding of what that word means, which is incorrect. And you seem to think a retcon is anything which differs from the original story.

Ie issue 1 of superman; superman takes a nap.

Issue 2; superman has some coffee.

"But wait! Superman didn't drink coffee in the original; he took a nap! Retcon!"

No. It's simply additional story. A retcon is going BACK and CHANGING facts which have already been established. And feral ghouls NOT existing is by no means an established fact. The possibility of new ghouls has been open since day one. Heck they could have thrown godzilla at you at the end of fallout 2 so long as they explained how it came to be.

I was talking about it as a fallout game. Your caps were wasted. :| Also; you're using a lot of words which i dont think you understand the meaning of, and no that's not an insult so please dont be offended. You threw the word feral around and clearly have a very specific understanding of what that word means, which is incorrect. And you seem to think a retcon is anything which differs from the original story. Ie issue 1 of superman; superman takes a nap.Issue 2; superman has some coffee."But wait! Superman didn't drink coffee in the original; he took a nap! Retcon!"No. It's simply additional story. A retcon is going BACK and CHANGING facts which have already been established. And feral ghouls NOT existing is by no means an established fact. The possibility of new ghouls has been open since day one. Heck they could have thrown godzilla at you at the end of fallout 2 so long as they explained how it came to beNinja-Hippo

Oh great, so humans are just animals now? Once again, that definition is not applicable. Look I quoted a scholarly journal that clearly defined feral as a term used to describe PEOPLE that had little to no conact with people.Vandalvideo

And that is ONE, very specific definition relating to the field of psychology. Feral, by definition, simply means wild. Fact. Stop arguing with fact. A feral person or creature is not one which has been deprived of human contact, though that may be the case. It could be mental breakdown, disease, infection of the brain, or even choice to live as an animal. I've said that dozens of times now.

So again; stop with the feral = child with no human contact. It does not. Fact.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] Oh great, so humans are just animals now? Once again, that definition is not applicable. Look I quoted a scholarly journal that clearly defined feral as a term used to describe PEOPLE that had little to no conact with people.Ninja-Hippo

And that is ONE, very specific definition relating to the field of psychology. Feral, by definition, simply means wild. Fact. Stop arguing with fact. A feral person or creature is not one which has been deprived of human contact, though that may be the case. It could be mental breakdown, disease, infection of the brain, or even choice to live as an animal. I've said that dozens of times now.

So again; stop with the feral = child with no human contact. It does not. Fact.

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]I was talking about it as a fallout game. Your caps were wasted. :| Also; you're using a lot of words which i dont think you understand the meaning of, and no that's not an insult so please dont be offended. You threw the word feral around and clearly have a very specific understanding of what that word means, which is incorrect. And you seem to think a retcon is anything which differs from the original story. Ie issue 1 of superman; superman takes a nap.Issue 2; superman has some coffee."But wait! Superman didn't drink coffee in the original; he took a nap! Retcon!"No. It's simply additional story. A retcon is going BACK and CHANGING facts which have already been established. And feral ghouls NOT existing is by no means an established fact. The possibility of new ghouls has been open since day one. Heck they could have thrown godzilla at you at the end of fallout 2 so long as they explained how it came to beVandalvideo

Are you even reading my posts? Lapointe isn't wrong. Lapointe is referencing a feral child; party of a study of child language acquisition. That is one specific use of the word. A child, if deprived of human contact, becomes feral. YOU are wrong however, to take that and say "oh, well feral must mean a child deprived of human contact."

It's like saying "he has a bad headache... he's sick". And then saying "sick" by definition is somebody with a headache, and nothing else. That is what you're doing here.

Feral means wild. That is the definition of the word. No debate.

And if you want some more definitions:

bestial, menacing

Refers to an individual or population that lives in a wild state despite a history of domestication

Are you even reading my posts? Lapointe isn't wrong. Lapointe is referencing a feral child; party of a study of child language acquisition. That is one specific use of the word. A child, if deprived of human contact, becomes feral. YOU are wrong however, to take that and say "oh, well feral must mean a child deprived of human contact. It's like saying "he has a bad headache... he's sick". And then saying "sick" by definition is somebody with a headache, and nothing else. That is what you're doing here.Feral means wild. That is the definition of the word. No debate. And if you want some more definitions:bestial, menacingefers to an individual or population that lives in a wild state despite a history of domesticationfontNinja-Hippo

Its a definition that is explicitly applicable to HUMANS. Your definition merely covers animals and plants. If you want to argue semantics, the find a journal of equal value which contradicts mine. Vandalvideo

It does not cover humans. It is terminology specific to the field of linguistics, used to describe a child raised without human interaction. Simply turn to your nearest dictionary to see what feral means. It means wild. That is a fact.

The child being deprived of human interaction is what MADE it feral. And any other number of things can cause feral behaviour; AGAIN, like disease, or mental breakdown.

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] Oh great, so humans are just animals now? Once again, that definition is not applicable. Look I quoted a scholarly journal that clearly defined feral as a term used to describe PEOPLE that had little to no conact with people.Vandalvideo

And that is ONE, very specific definition relating to the field of psychology. Feral, by definition, simply means wild. Fact. Stop arguing with fact. A feral person or creature is not one which has been deprived of human contact, though that may be the case. It could be mental breakdown, disease, infection of the brain, or even choice to live as an animal. I've said that dozens of times now.

So again; stop with the feral = child with no human contact. It does not. Fact.

hahah. so now humans aren't animals eh?

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] Its a definition that is explicitly applicable to HUMANS. Your definition merely covers animals and plants. If you want to argue semantics, the find a journal of equal value which contradicts mine. Ninja-Hippo

It does not cover humans. It is terminology specific to the field of linguistics, used to describe a child raised without human interaction. Simply turn to your nearest dictionary to see what feral means. It means wild. That is a fact.

The child being deprived of human interaction is what MADE it feral. And any other number of things can cause feral behaviour; AGAIN, like disease, or mental breakdown.

Remember that Halo thread when you said the story was derivative, and tried to explain why, and you argued on relentlessly despite being CLEARLY wrong, and eventually admitted that you were simply trolling?

Is this the same? Because i honestly dont think that any reasonable person would argue that feral is a word which exclusively refers to a child brought up without human contact.

Lapointe EXPLICITLTY states that "Feral is a term used to describe children and adults that have grown up with little to no contact with other people". It is directly applicable to humans. Now unless you have a scholarly journal that rebukes it..Vandalvideo

That is in reference to the field of linguistics. *face palm*

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]Are you even reading my posts? Lapointe isn't wrong. Lapointe is referencing a feral child; party of a study of child language acquisition. That is one specific use of the word. A child, if deprived of human contact, becomes feral. YOU are wrong however, to take that and say "oh, well feral must mean a child deprived of human contact. It's like saying "he has a bad headache... he's sick". And then saying "sick" by definition is somebody with a headache, and nothing else. That is what you're doing here.Feral means wild. That is the definition of the word. No debate. And if you want some more definitions:bestial, menacingefers to an individual or population that lives in a wild state despite a history of domesticationfontVandalvideo

all uses of the word feral apply to humans. You do know humans are animals too right?

Lapointe uses feral in a certain context he is not describing the definition of the word.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] Lapointe EXPLICITLTY states that "Feral is a term used to describe children and adults that have grown up with little to no contact with other people". It is directly applicable to humans. Now unless you have a scholarly journal that rebukes it..Ninja-Hippo

That is in reference to the field of linguistics. *face palm*

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]Are you even reading my posts? Lapointe isn't wrong. Lapointe is referencing a feral child; party of a study of child language acquisition. That is one specific use of the word. A child, if deprived of human contact, becomes feral. YOU are wrong however, to take that and say "oh, well feral must mean a child deprived of human contact. It's like saying "he has a bad headache... he's sick". And then saying "sick" by definition is somebody with a headache, and nothing else. That is what you're doing here.Feral means wild. That is the definition of the word. No debate. And if you want some more definitions:bestial, menacingefers to an individual or population that lives in a wild state despite a history of domesticationfont6matt6

all uses of the word feral apply to humans. You do know humans are animals too right?

Lapointe uses feral in a certain context he is not describing the definition of the word.