XB1 gpu able to do parallel gpu compute and rendering....

Just saw this pop up on my Google Now list. In my last post you guys said I was full of it and should be ashamed of myself, even though I said the information was to be taken with a grain of salt, but I guess the xbox still has a few secrets left to it's architecture. The SDK leak revealed that the xbox gpu can pass both rendering and compute commands simultaneously.

" Discovered by a user on Beyond3d forum who pasted text from what seems to be from the SDK documentation, it has been revealed that the Xbox One GPU has eight graphics contexts. For those who are unaware, a graphics context consists of all drawing parameters and information to carry out commands related to drawing. It essentially consists of basic information such as color, width of the line, styling data and other relevant data. The Xbox One allocates seven of such graphics contexts to games.

It was also revealed that the console supports multiple GPU command streams which consists of instructions for rendering and compute. Both commands pass through the GPU simultaneously which allows to have two parallel processes of compute and rendering work, which share the same bandwidth resources. This results into a low latency exchange between GPU and CPU. However we are not sure whether developers can explicitly push one task type ahead of the other or whether the GPU automatically prioritizes the queue elements."

Source

I'm guessing this probably won't be fully utilized until DX12, but it's pretty much the same thing the leaked IEEE pdf I posted in the last post talked about in the gpu section.

hmm, no wonder multi plats look a lot better on X1.

man microsoft sure knows how to handle idiots, throw these kids words they don't understand or have a clue about and they will start claiming secret sauce.

They use 2 tech words and all of the sudden is secret hidden sauce like calling DMA Data move Engines so that morons actually believe is something unique or Tile Resources which is partially Resident textures..hahahaha

You know what i am starting to think that the whole leak SDK came from MS so that morons on forums could start saying the xbox one has more power is not the first time they leak something on purpose to spark arguments..

Dont over look the fact that the X1 has a limited amount of gpu processing power, doing both compute and rendering workloads will and does force developers in compromising aspects to reach a specific goal. This is why with compute heavy gpu based physics will not work too well on the X1. The PS4 just has more headroom on the gpu not compromising as much as the X1 would. Also DX 12 is not the saving grace for the X1, it help some but will not the the table turner it needs to be.

port 220, irq 5, dma channel 1

Gotta keep grasping at them straws!,any straws!

You just described 99% of SW...

Don't forget the cloud, os ram reserve upgrade, 10% GPU boost, and 300,000 servers.

lol "secrets left to it's architecture." Dat Sause lol.

To be fair, cows were doing the same thing last gen with the cell.

Lemmings are really desperate as far as the tech debate is concerned this gen tho. It's getting pretty sad.

@Krelian-co: @tormentos: Please explain yourselves then. No one said anything about secret sauce but obviously this info has struck a nerve.

@tormentos: No one ever said Dma engines where unique, the purpose for DMA engines on XB1 is quite clear. Yet you have still yet to give a logical reason why they would be needed on PS4 since the CPU and GPU have access to the same information at all times, that's the perk of having a unified system you don't have to move things from VRAM to System ram. XB1 uses them so the GPU and CPU don't waste anytime moving data from esram to system ram.

@04dcarraher: Thanks for actually making a point instead of spewing random fanboy BS. I still see some obstacles with this also like bandwidth since both processes will share the same bandwidth, how much will the reduced latency actually help. Does it mean that devs will have to use more tiling tricks to push data because of less bandwidth? As far as DX12 I really don't know what to expect, but I suspect some of the features built into the XB1 architecture will be easier to use once it's here.

but it still can't do 1080p @ 60 fps

Doing compute and rendering at the same does not really affect bandwidth since they have divide the gpu processing to do the workloads. Its no different from using 100% of the gpu for rendering.What the X1 has now for an API isnt much different then what DX12 is, its just more refined, and will help save some cpu cycles.

Now the problem is the esram and DDR3 combo, developers can not cram all the needed workloads that require the high read&write speed that DDR3 cant provide, they will still have to rely on DDR3 on doing most of the buffer work for the X1. Tiling methods and even DX12 can not overcome the limits of the memory design.

it can, it just depends how far devs want to push the graphics.

@slimdogmilionar: Dang, I guess my Xbone was a super computer all along, but the inferior multiplat games out now were just tricks and the real power is coming in 2016. Too bad Phil Spencer said DX12 won't do anything for graphics.

It's all a secret. M$ allowed the vast majority sub par multiplats to release as inferior on Xbone as part of a GRANDER, greater strategy to impress us by the year 2018, right before Xbtwo releases!

It needs to compute itself into the trash

To be honest Phil did say that... After he put a gag order on the guy that was saying it would.

Who to believe a product manager at a gaming studio or Phil Spencer.. the leader of the Xbox division. Both do have motives.. Who has the bigger motive? That's the question.

Would Phil extinguish positive news about the X1 when it needed it the most to save face or to bury it? To be later unveil it to the world as TH3 Sauc3. Aliens / Loch ness monster / bigfoot????

You console gamer internet engineers are hilarious. If you know so much about low-level hardware programming, what are you doing arguing on System Wars? You guys should really stop regurgitating shit you read on the internet as if you actually know something about coding and hardware.

I'm sure the hardware supports it just fine, it's more of an API thing. Managing what is processing at what time and giving devs proper control over that and making sure you do not slow down or bottleneck operations is more of an API thing.

I think you're guess that we won't see that kind of API level stuff until DX12 is probably correct. Seems like something the DX team would have to work on.

It's good news because there are cases where offloading physics calculations to the GPU would probably still reduce frame rendering time without hurting graphics rendering. Scenes with a lot of physics are probably getting CPU bottlenecked on the slower CPUs which would result in lower framerates anyways.

I know the PS4 and Xbox One have APUs but I question how much stuff they could offload before hitting a bottleneck.

I laugh because everybody here assumes you're just talking about how the Xbox One could have better graphics than the PS4 because of this even though you didn't say a word of it. Some of you guys here need to seriously lighten up.

More waiting for secret sauce?

It's just thousand island

For god sake you lemmings claimed that Data Move Engines were not on PS4 many times.

In your case in particular you argue against me that Tile Resources wasn't Partially Resident Textures,you are as morons as it can get and any time MS come with a new phrase to describe something is secret sauce all over again,why can't you people admit it once and for all.?

The PS4 is stronger and that is how it is going to be all gen long,no secret sauce,DX12 or cloud will change that..

No is not dude and the PS4 also has DMA as well when it uses GDDR5 and its CPU and see data on the GPU all the time,i give you a him from were those DMA come from.. Is call GCN and they were there before the xbox one was release and since 2011 when AMD release the 7970.

My god you really know shit...

@b4x: I enjoyed your post.

Forza 5.

i did too, is actually funny to read delusional lems using the "bu bu Phil said!" card, yeah guys "Phil" is going to transform the time and space and make inferior hardware magically stop being terrible.

*most games

Phil shut down the rumors. Developers have shut down the rumors. Yet, people faith in dx12 being a game changer on a graphical level hasn't. Its absurd.

@tormentos: LOl I never said PS4 didn't have Move engines I only said I don't see the point in them being there, honestly I didn't even know they were there until you said so trying to prove a point. I still don't see the point of move engines on PS4, on xb1 and PC it makes sense because you have more than one memory pool. There is no need to move data from or to PS4 system ram so what's the point? So no what's not???

"No is not dude and the PS4 also has DMA as well when it uses GDDR5 and its CPU and see data on the GPU all the time,i give you a him from were those DMA come from.. Is call GCN and they were there before the xbox one was release and since 2011 when AMD release the 7970"

The only reason I assumed tiled resources was different on xb1 is because PRT is geared more towards textures. Tiled resources lets you tile more than textures, like how Crytek used tiled shading because they couldn't use deferred shading because of the xbox one bandwidth limitations.

Lastly this is not a thread claiming the XB1 is more power or claiming secret sauce it's new info that has surfaced about the XB1 gpu simple as that. If you are this insecure hearing this I'd hate to see how you will react once the news comes out that M$ has reduced the XB1 memory usage by 45% by updating the graphics driver.

@SolidTy I wonder what have you been telling yourself about PS3 for all those long years.

The bottom line is it can give some more options to devs in the future. That's literally it. Nobody is claiming this makes the Xbox One more powerful than it is. Obviously it's a tradeoff as pushing general purpose processing through the GPU is going to waste GPU time and thus reduce it's potential maximum graphic processing, but the potential advantages gameplay wise through better and more robust physics could be a decent trade-off for certain games.

Still waiting for that killer exclusive.

here we go again dat secret sauce story.

boring...

My post was deleted...it was really good. Really good. Shame.

Did you own a PS3? I wouldn't have subjected myself to owning just one piece of hardware so I wouldn't have had to wonder what I was missing. I know you are going on a decade of avoiding PS consoles (no PS3 or PS4 for you) but are familiar with Xbox consoles (360 & Xbone). I owned the 360 at launch, Xbox at launch, Xbone at launch, Wii at launch, Wii U at launch, PS3 at launch and PS4 at launch. That means I didn't have to play the fanboy justification game, I just bought the games as they released. It's why I have a huge 360 library, because many of the multiplats were superior on 360. I didn't need to tell myself anything about the PS3, I bought the best versions of games across three consoles that I could. I owned them all, which is hard to explain to users who opt to own just one machine per generation like yourself. Regarding multiplat superiority: the Xbone is the new PS3 and the PS4 is the new 360.

I wonder what have you been telling yourself about PS3 and 360 for all those long years and I wonder now what you tell yourself about the PS4 and Xbone this generation.

More hopes and dreams from the lemmings. No actual details as to if this will make any difference.

So when's the games coming?

Since when do games matter for cows? No decent game to play since launch, untill Bloodborne. PS4 should've launched this holiday season.

Looking at your precious SDKs, Xbone should have launched November this year with Halo 5.

Cows are really going mad, any bit of good news for the Xbox sends them crazy. I feel sorry, it must hurt to watch the Xbox get better and better while the PS4 sits idle turning out flops after flops.

@Scipio8 said:

Cows are really going mad, any bit of good news for the Xbox sends them crazy. I feel sorry, it must hurt to watch the Xbox get better and better while the PS4 sits idle turning out flops after flops.

Sony don't have to keep hopes afloat by leaking SDKs to make it look like the Xbone is worth a damn.

Wasn't ntkrnl around this time last year as well? Maybe you'll have the honour of making the topic about it if he returns, Insipid8.

Gameplay > Graphics, but keep wishing it was the other way around with your beautiful empty worlds.

I tried telling Tormentoes this a year ago. He responded with "hahaha, and a pie chart".

This Xbox architecture is exactly why you cannot take the specs and performance of a PC graphics card and substitute them for Xbox output.

gameplay + graphics > gameplay

You smell of desperation my dear lem.

@GrenadeLauncher said:

@Scipio8 said:

Cows are really going mad, any bit of good news for the Xbox sends them crazy. I feel sorry, it must hurt to watch the Xbox get better and better while the PS4 sits idle turning out flops after flops.

Sony don't have to keep hopes afloat by leaking SDKs to make it look like the Xbone is worth a damn.

Wasn't ntkrnl around this time last year as well? Maybe you'll have the honour of making the topic about it if he returns, Insipid8.

At least Xbox got something worth a damn to leak. The only thing leaking out of Sony is your personal data LOL

Move engines are part of the GPU not the CPU or memory which mean they are inside every GCN the xbox one doesn't have DME because it has ESRAM or to make the xbox one see the data while it is on ESRAM which the xbox one can't do,DMA are part of GCN architecture.

No they are exactly the same the only difference is that MS named it Tile Resources so it could use it on Nvidia GPU while talking about DX,since PRT is a name AMD gave to the same feature but is exactly the same thing and in both is hardware supported contrary to what you believe that PRT was software.

The same happen with encoder decoders,upscaler and basically everything else.

Oh please dude i am not the one all months and weeks trying to prove how the xbox one will magically be on par with the PS4 so yeah the insecurities come from you people,oh brother anything the xbox one can do by driver or software the PS4 can do it as well and better period,there is nothing MS can do that sony can't is the same GPU and same CPU,memory is not a problems for either console they have memory to spare,the PS4 could have come with 4GB of GDDR5 and still would have beat the xbox one..

Yeah because the PS3 = the xbox one right.? lol

There are more games and higher rated on PS4 since launch than on xbox one..hahaha

Both Gamerankings and Metacritics prove it.

Yeah the PS4 will remain idle and the xbox one will magically transform into a R290X PC..lol

Just Waiiiiiiiiiit and see...

Dude this article says nothing the xbox one still is inferior to the PS4,running compute at the same time as graphics consume resources from graphics side which mean less graphicall games if you want to run compute on xbox one.

The PS4 can use 4 CU and still have more power than the xbox one 12 CU over all that is the problems for MS and something that will not change.

Let me ask you this to all of you did you actually saw MS last gen making a parade about a damn driver update,or about a new SDK that would bring secret performance.?

No you didn't why you may ask because the xbox 360 was powerful,MS didn't have to resort to lie and manipulate opinions with that shit,it is now that MS actually sink that low,because lets face it they are investing millions in trying to revert the image of weak console the xbox one has,and i am 100% sure that this so call leak wasn't really a leak and is more of on purpose thing to try to downplay the fact that they have a weaker unit.

Yeah empty worlds isn't good gameplay, but keep trying cow

yes, all that untapped potential should be known soon.

oh yeah but yours are xD