Zelda Needs A Dark, Gritty Reboot

Zelda is what it is and it should stay that way :S How well dark Zelda games work was shown with Darkssiders :S Not of fan of both of them

ArchoNils2

[QUOTE="ArchoNils2"]

Zelda is what it is and it should stay that way :S How well dark Zelda games work was shown with Darkssiders :S Not of fan of both of them

nintendoboy16

Nope I haven't, you think it's worth even though I hate the (3D) Zelda games (I liked the top down 2D Zelda games) and Darksiders?

Zelda needs ANY kind of reboot at this point. I don't even care if it is dark or not. It needs a new story, a new world, new setting or time period, new villains. And most importantly, the series needs to develop a new mythology. There has been like 20 Zelda games since the NES days and there is literally no more story than what each individual game provides. triforce needs to be found to beat Ganon. Wow. I simply don't care about ANY of it anymore and pretty much only play the game, still, because the gameplay is solid.

But why can't we start the Zelda saga at the begining and develop a continuous story over a series of games? Explain the whole backstory or the world and the magic and Ganon. Have characters with actual character instead of just being 2d archetypes.

[QUOTE="nintendoboy16"][QUOTE="ArchoNils2"]

Zelda is what it is and it should stay that way :S How well dark Zelda games work was shown with Darkssiders :S Not of fan of both of them

ArchoNils2

Nope I haven't, you think it's worth even though I hate the (3D) Zelda games (I liked the top down 2D Zelda games) and Darksiders?

Speaking as a long, long time Zelda fan I honestly think Majora's Mask is easily one of the most overhyped games of all time. It is the Golden Eye or FF7 of Zeda games...not as great as the myth people want to keep spreading. In fact, I actually think it is one of the worst Zelda games made...better only than part 2 I think. Not that it is bad but the whole gameplay of reliving the same 3 days over and over is clever but extremely annoying and frustrating to me. plus it has one of the worst camera's in any Zelda game.

So if you hate the 3D Zelda games, I promise you, MM won't change your mind. The hype is more about nostalgia, and hype-feedback, than the actual quality of the game itself.

[QUOTE="ArchoNils2"]

[QUOTE="nintendoboy16"] You never played Majora's Mask, have you?ZIMdoom

Nope I haven't, you think it's worth even though I hate the (3D) Zelda games (I liked the top down 2D Zelda games) and Darksiders?

Speaking as a long, long time Zelda fan I honestly think Majora's Mask is easily one of the most overhyped games of all time. It is the Golden Eye or FF7 of Zeda games...not as great as the myth people want to keep spreading. In fact, I actually think it is one of the worst Zelda games made...better only than part 2 I think. Not that it is bad but the whole gameplay of reliving the same 3 days over and over is clever but extremely annoying and frustrating to me. plus it has one of the worst camera's in any Zelda game.

Zelda needs ANY kind of reboot at this point. I don't even care if it is dark or not. It needs a new story, a new world, new setting or time period, new villains. And most importantly, the series needs to develop a new mythology. There has been like 20 Zelda games since the NES days and there is literally no more story than what each individual game provides. triforce needs to be found to beat Ganon. Wow. I simply don't care about ANY of it anymore and pretty much only play the game, still, because the gameplay is solid.

But why can't we start the Zelda saga at the begining and develop a continuous story over a series of games? Explain the whole backstory or the world and the magic and Ganon. Have characters with actual character instead of just being 2d archetypes.

ZIMdoom

Call me grazy, but i want in this new Zelda a hero, a pricess and Ganondorf, i love Zelda's mythology and i wouldnt want a change, i'm all for a new formula in the sense that you should do something different instead of finding 3 stones then 5 other stones and then final dungeon, however i won't complain if i have to play with Link, Zelda and Ganondorf again and again.

The only "not dark" Zelda was Wind Waker. :?

OoT was dark, MM was very dark and TP was dark. Why does everyone think absolutely everything needs to become just like everything else? Why not just desire Nintendo to make a new IP with an entirely new set of characters, themes and settings?

Hell, A Link to the Past was very dark too. It had the f***ing DARK WORLD.

Every iteration of Nintendo games change... just look at the four major 3D Zeldas that have already come out.

[...] I honestly think Majora's Mask is easily one of the most overhyped games of all time. It is the Golden Eye or FF7 of Zeda games...not as great as the myth people want to keep spreading. [...] ZIMdoom

[QUOTE="ZIMdoom"]

Speaking as a long, long time Zelda fan I honestly think Majora's Mask is easily one of the most overhyped games of all time. It is the Golden Eye or FF7 of Zeda games...not as great as the myth people want to keep spreading. In fact, I actually think it is one of the worst Zelda games made...better only than part 2 I think. Not that it is bad but the whole gameplay of reliving the same 3 days over and over is clever but extremely annoying and frustrating to me. plus it has one of the worst camera's in any Zelda game.

nintendoboy16

No its not. It may be controlled the same way but whether it is the different world design, or the sometimes cramped interior locations, the camera in Majora's Mask needs way more baby sitting and is way more of a pain.

Call me grazy, but i want in this new Zelda a hero, a pricess and Ganondorf, i love Zelda's mythology and i wouldnt want a change, i'm all for a new formula in the sense that you should do something different instead of finding 3 stones then 5 other stones and then final dungeon, however i won't complain if i have to play with Link, Zelda and Ganondorf again and again.

madsnakehhh

I have no problems with any of that. But why not start a series of games with a story that runs through them, instead of every single Zelda game being an isolated tale? I mean every zelda game is some young adventurer gets caught up in a plot, for no real reason much of the time, and must help the princess (doesn't she have guards or something?) from Ganon (why? what are his motives? Where is he from?)

Why not start with the young adventurer, fill in his story and give him a reason to be the hero. Why not give some real background on Ganon other than "he is bad and wants the tri force". That isn't a story it is just an excuse to move the plot from a to b. Granted, too much story could possibly take away from the action, but that is only really true because Nintendo insists on making each Zelda game a completely seperate game. If they kept continuing the story then think of how much more developed these characters would be. There really is no excuse for this anymore. This isn't the 8 bit days any more.

That is what I mean. Zelda doesn't have a mythology...it just had things that are there for no reason other than the game design hasn't really changed since the 8 bit day, when there were limitations. The latest reboots are still good because the gameplay is still solid and fun, but I no longer care AT ALL about the "story" of the games. That is just tacked on, in my opinion, to give the gameplay an excuse to proceed to next levels.

[QUOTE="madsnakehhh"]

Call me grazy, but i want in this new Zelda a hero, a pricess and Ganondorf, i love Zelda's mythology and i wouldnt want a change, i'm all for a new formula in the sense that you should do something different instead of finding 3 stones then 5 other stones and then final dungeon, however i won't complain if i have to play with Link, Zelda and Ganondorf again and again.

ZIMdoom

I have no problems with any of that. But why not start a series of games with a story that runs through them, instead of every single Zelda game being an isolated tale? I mean every zelda game is some young adventurer gets caught up in a plot, for no real reason much of the time, and must help the princess (doesn't she have guards or something?) from Ganon (why? what are his motives? Where is he from?)

Why not start with the young adventurer, fill in his story and give him a reason to be the hero. Why not give some real background on Ganon other than "he is bad and wants the tri force". That isn't a story it is just an excuse to move the plot from a to b. Granted, too much story could possibly take away from the action, but that is only really true because Nintendo insists on making each Zelda game a completely seperate game. If they kept continuing the story then think of how much more developed these characters would be. There really is no excuse for this anymore. This isn't the 8 bit days any more.

That is what I mean. Zelda doesn't have a mythology...it just had things that are there for no reason other than the game design hasn't really changed since the 8 bit day, when there were limitations. The latest reboots are still good because the gameplay is still solid and fun, but I no longer care AT ALL about the "story" of the games. That is just tacked on, in my opinion, to give the gameplay an excuse to proceed to next levels.

Why is a mythology required? While I can see where a mythology gives a games series gravitas and a reason to immerse yourself, it's not required. Many good games are pick up and play, with a simple sotry, that doesn't spend time going into the infinite depths of the world's history.

[QUOTE="ZIMdoom"][...] I honestly think Majora's Mask is easily one of the most overhyped games of all time. It is the Golden Eye or FF7 of Zeda games...not as great as the myth people want to keep spreading. [...] foxhound_fox

I am inclined to agree somewhat. I don't agree 100% because Ocarina is easily MUCH better a game than Majora's Mask. But I don't agree with people who say it is the best Zelda game of all time. My personal favorite is Link to the Past, which you already mentioned. THAT was the last truly excellent Zelda game in my mind. the rest were still real good, but just not the same. They changed the graphics to 3D but kept the characters without any more personality or story than the old 2d days. I think for me that keeps the 3D Zelda games at a point where they aren't as evolved as they should be to compete with most modern 3D action/adventure games.

I can still boot up the old 2D Zelda games (althoughpart 2 is my least favorite) and play them and have just as much fun as when they first came out. Maybe Nintendo, now that they are in 2d reboot mode with Mario and Donkey Kong COuntry we will get to see what they can do with a modern 2D Zelda. I'd buy that in a second.

Why is a mythology required? While I can see where a mythology gives a games series gravitas and a reason to immerse yourself, it's not required. Many good games are pick up and play, with a simple sotry, that doesn't spend time going into the infinite depths of the world's history.

jimkabrhel

10 years ago I would have said Zelda doesn't need a mythology. But now that it is clear Nintendo is going to keep pushing this franchise out every gen with pretty much ZERO changes to gameplay and ZERO new ideas...I think it is time they joined the rest of the modern gaming world and give us a new reason to care about the Land of Hyrule. Because I think a lot of people are losing interest if Nintendo thinks they can repeat the same formula for ever without offering anything new, even if that means adding voice acting or an actual story or character develoment to their games.

they had a more adult darker one...it was called Twilight princess my fav zelda game after link to the past it had the dark atomosphere and concept.
And then you have the fact a definite love relationship developed between midna and link definitely towards the end...yet they haven't expanded upon it.

I'm still waiting for Miyamoto to get off the constant remake kick hes been on since SMB 1 and Legend of zelda 1 and realize he needs to develop that concept I for one want to see link go to the dark side cause of his dispair that he'll never see midna again and collect the triforces courage *his own, wisdom *from zelda* and power *rip gannon from the dead and steal it* and try to break the dimensional barriers with it so he can be with her.

To hell with Zelda she was never good enough, Midna=better.

To hell with Zelda she was never good enough, Midna=better.

WilliamRLBaker

What? i don't know, i never really liked Midna and TP, she was very annoying.

For me Tetra>Sheik >>>>>> Midna, i'm still waiting for Sheik to return.

To hell with Zelda she was never good enough, Midna=better.WilliamRLBaker

I wish Microsoft would buy the rights and give Zelda the credit it deserves!xDanimal

Yeah, they should trade Zelda for Halo and GEOW so Nintendo could actually make good games with this franchises :D

My answer to your idea: NO!

[QUOTE="xDanimal"]I wish Microsoft would buy the rights and give Zelda the credit it deserves!madsnakehhh

Yeah, they should trade Zelda for Halo and GEOW so Nintendo could actually make good games with this franchises :D

hell yeah! Then Nintendo can give halo and GeOW the credit they deserve.

Err...not every franchise needs a gritty reboot.

The art-style you posted looks fitting for The Witcher, but never for Zelda.

People like to forget that Zelda is a fairy-tale, not something that should compete with, idk, God of War.

That said, I would have nothing against a spin-off of sorts resolving around Ganondorf.

It would be cool to see a dark fairy tale approach to Zelda. Perhaps something like American McGee's twist on Alice in Wonderland. Eh, maybe not THAT dark, but something similar.Master_ShakeXXX

Majora's Mask says hello ;)

Damn you two are making me want a Padukone sig :(

wanna share the british brown (i'm guessing) pride and make me one aswell? i'm terrible with PS

Oh and on topic, yeh TC i agree with you 100%. Also does anyone else think the Next Halo should be in third person, where you can level up and be based in telltubby land? Also master chief should be reimagined as a female culinary chef

YoYo278

I agree 100% the series should stick with a more Majora's Mask approach.

However, the example pictures you gave... *hands TC a flameshield*

xYamatox

Agreed. MM is pretty much a perfect amount of grittiness IMO.

Heh.

I wish Microsoft would buy the rights and give Zelda the credit it deserves!xDanimal

What Zelda needs is a better mythos. But if I was handling the Zelda franchise I would make it more gritty, by having Link fight more humanoid enemies, like enemy soldiers instead comical little monsters. I would also have Link's armor and attire look more and more tattered and beaten, to emphasize that he's in life and death fights and not kiddy bloodless fights.

The whole universe needs better back story. What is the actual geography of the world of Hyrule? There should be rival kingdoms, Hylian noble men (some good and others bad).

There should be competent Hylian knights and warriors with their own heroic deeds. Link should actually have allies comprised of Hylian knights who help him out. Link should actually be a trained warrior. Zelda needs to have more to do, like TWW and OOT tried to do. Ganondorf should not appear again, until after several games, his presence just margnializes the urgency of the crisis in every story he's been in since after OOT.

Ganondorf was great in OOT, he had his chance for glory and now should be eliminated (he was pointless in TWW and TP), now give us more villains.

What Zelda needs is a better mythos. But if I was handling the Zelda franchise I would make it more gritty, by having Link fight more humanoid enemies, like enemy soldiers instead comical little monsters. I would also have Link's armor and attire look more and more tattered and beaten, to emphasize that he's in life and death fights and not kiddy bloodless fights.

The whole universe needs better back story. What is the actual geography of the world of Hyrule? There should be rival kingdoms, Hylian noble men (some good and others bad).

There should be competent Hylian knights and warriors with their own heroic deeds. Link should actually have allies comprised of Hylian knights who help him out. Link should actually be a trained warrior. Zelda needs to have more to do, like TWW and OOT tried to do. Ganondorf should not appear again, until after several games, his presence just margnializes the urgency of the crisis in every story he's been in since after OOT.

Ganondorf was great in OOT, he had his chance for glory and now should be eliminated (he was pointless in TWW and TP), now give us more villains.

RRJaden

im glad you arent.

personally i would love to see a really dark gritty zelda game with great voice actors(in a perfect world actors like hugh laurie for the voice of the owl and peter dinklage for the drunk and pissed off tingle) a really dark depressed link with like one up beat character that tries to get link back to his old job of saving the world. and as the game progresses link slowly slips out of his depression and back to his old self. make a trilogy of sorts where as he continues getting back to his old self and helping people the world around him changes and becomes more and more like the other games. bring in a save transfer system like mass effect so side missions and choices can actually affect the continuing story line. like maybe link never helps the fishing guy in the first game so he kills himself and some thug takes over the fishing area and link then has a choice to do a new side quest to get rid of this guy. things like that. overall i think this would be a great move to bring back in a lot of old school fans of the genre that have aged. for instance i grew up with oot and mm and although they could be better i enjoy the new games where as a lot of my friends and my older brother simply say they are kids games and shun them. this reboot could bring back sooo many of the people that wish the game was still viable for their age range. put in some kind of free running and parkour elements i think alot of links gadgets(especially the hookshot) would lend themselves really well to a game with a really good free running movement system. not to mention the amount of movement options you have gives you so many more options for how to proceed in a dungeon or complete a puzzle.if anyone ever makes a kickstarter for this i will literally throw all my spare money at them.reload2456

Play Dark Souls. It pretty much is a dark version of Zelda.BPoole96

Not sure how. Anyway, forget dark and gritty, II would be okay with Ocarina of time art style. What they need t fix is all the hand-holding mechanics, make a better world, one that you can actually explore and give us freedom to take on any castle which ever way we want.

[QUOTE="BPoole96"]Play Dark Souls. It pretty much is a dark version of Zelda.Pete-B

Not sure how. Anyway, forget dark and gritty, II would be okay with Ocarina of time art style. What they need t fix is all the hand-holding mechanics, make a better world, one that you can actually explore and give us freedom to take on any castle which ever way we want.

Agreed.

[QUOTE="reload2456"]personally i would love to see a really dark gritty zelda game with great voice actors(in a perfect world actors like hugh laurie for the voice of the owl and peter dinklage for the drunk and pissed off tingle) a really dark depressed link with like one up beat character that tries to get link back to his old job of saving the world. and as the game progresses link slowly slips out of his depression and back to his old self. make a trilogy of sorts where as he continues getting back to his old self and helping people the world around him changes and becomes more and more like the other games. bring in a save transfer system like mass effect so side missions and choices can actually affect the continuing story line. like maybe link never helps the fishing guy in the first game so he kills himself and some thug takes over the fishing area and link then has a choice to do a new side quest to get rid of this guy. things like that. overall i think this would be a great move to bring back in a lot of old school fans of the genre that have aged. for instance i grew up with oot and mm and although they could be better i enjoy the new games where as a lot of my friends and my older brother simply say they are kids games and shun them. this reboot could bring back sooo many of the people that wish the game was still viable for their age range. put in some kind of free running and parkour elements i think alot of links gadgets(especially the hookshot) would lend themselves really well to a game with a really good free running movement system. not to mention the amount of movement options you have gives you so many more options for how to proceed in a dungeon or complete a puzzle.if anyone ever makes a kickstarter for this i will literally throw all my spare money at them.DragonfireXZ95

I would be very okay with another Zelda game like the original, although not be as cryptic as that game was. None of that "burn this very specific tree out of a thousand to enter dungeon 8" bologna.

Reboot's are a terrible idea.  Just make something entirely new instead of ruining something old.

All Zelda need's is to find that sweet spot between dark and atmospheric and cheery and upbeat and drop the ridiculous handholding, I don't think i've ever known 6 year olds to play Zelda.

Twilight Princess is easily the best Zelda, an incredible game, Skyward Sword really dropped the ball on some things (handholding,padding), but does some things better than TP. 

Play Dark Souls. It pretty much is a dark version of Zelda.BPoole96

Reboot's are a terrible idea.  Just make something entirely new instead of ruining something old.

All Zelda need's is to find that sweet spot between dark and atmospheric and cheery and upbeat and drop the ridiculous handholding, I don't think i've ever known 6 year olds to play Zelda.

Twilight Princess is easily the best Zelda, an incredible game, Skyward Sword really dropped the ball on some things (handholding,padding), but does some things better than TP. 

Chozofication

Dont try and insert your horrible opinion as fact, many people hated it including myself. More then half of that game was some of the most boring gaming I have ever experianced.

@drops: Damn right! I was quite young when I first played it, these mofo would give me the creeps. >=(

Will never forget my first encounter D=

They should remake Adventure of link, it would be like playing a new game considering it was a 2d sidescroller. Going up against them b's with 3d graphics would be amazing.