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#1  Edited By DarthBuzzard
Member since 2019 • 360 Posts

@Dark_sageX said:
@jackamomo said:

I think all the comments on here about how exciting and brilliant VR is are all paid shills by an industry desperately trying to create itself out of thin air.

It hurts your neck, you look silly, you have to constantly move your head and eyes around. You are disorientated. Your house could be being robbed as you sit their like a wally. You still need a control pad. Waggle sticks are cumbersome.

There is nothing practical about VR at all.

The best possible use of it as as a kind of iMax at home.

This is the only way it will sell.

VR is pretty cool, I went to a VR arcade with a couple of friends and we had a blast playing this zombie shooting game, its just that this would not be an experience that I would be interested to have at home, I think its best suited for arcades.

VR in arcades doesn't make much sense compared to the home. It's a very limited use of the technology. Arcade VR games are never as good as real VR games.

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#2 DarthBuzzard
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@outworld222 said:

AR is better. But I 100% agree with TC. It’s not practical.

It's better in some ways, and VR is better in others. You can't surely believe one is overall better than the other in everything?

And of course it's practical. It just needs improvements. AR too needs improvements, even more so than VR as it's still some years behind.

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#3  Edited By DarthBuzzard
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@jackamomo said:

The point of this thread was supposed to be not how can we make VR popular but should we.

Technology should bring people together and enrich our lives, not isolate us further.

These are the dangers sc-fi writers tackle repeatedly. Some optimistically but usually pessimistically.

I'm not sure VR is the direction I want technology to go in to be frank. I simply don't see the advantage over a flat screen for the majority of applications.

As for haptic feedback. I would be worried that someone could drug me in my sleep and hook me up to a computer and I would never know and be stuck in a virtual nightmare like the film Inception or The Matrix.

Technology needs to progress with humanity not leading, because it can so easily overwhelm if not treated with caution.

I would request the mods lock this thread now because that is my closing statement and it's repeating itself.

I'm going to stop you there. VR is objectively speaking the most connective technology ever created. It's the only way people can connect in a way that mimics real life.

VR will also greatly enrich our lives. I mean how can it not? Anyone having a panic attack can immediately transport themselves to a calm environment by a riverside. Someone who hates the state of their real life (like billions of us) can choose to escape for a bit. People who can't move or go anywhere can do so in VR. People who can't afford to travel can do so in VR. People who want access to high quality equipment can often simulate it in VR. People who want to live new types of lives can do it in VR, living a second life. People who want to try new things can do so in VR. People who want to become someone else can do so in VR. People who want to relive their memories of their wedding, birthday party can do so in VR. Someone who wants a productive work environment has a lot to gain with VR.

You don't see an advantage because you keep ignoring everything that people state. You don't like the idea, so you plug your ears, pretending you never heard anything.

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#4 DarthBuzzard
Member since 2019 • 360 Posts

Ready Player One has always shown where VR was going. The facial capture there uses mocap, which can likely be done just as equally well in VR in about 5-10 years:

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#5  Edited By DarthBuzzard
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@jackamomo said:

@darthbuzzard:

How is that more immersive than an actual video of that person?

That's only useful if you want to lean to the side to see the side of their virtual head.

No, this is basically like real life. Ask yourself why do we socailize in real life? In a video call, you don't have eye contact, you feel disconnected, and you feel apart. In VR, you feel like you are literally next to someone on an atomic level. Not only that, but you can suddenly do all kinds of activities in a virtual space. You also have 3D audio, and eventually the ability to touch someone using haptics. Videos are a massive step down in social connectivity.

This feels like the distant future. Like 100+ years.

100 years? More like 5 years. This is the state of facial capture today. You're going to have a hard time telling what's real and what's facial tracking.

Is this a technique for mapping faces onto 3d models? Sounds cool if it's not just for overlaying moustaches onto your face.

Yes. This is an example of how that would look, although this is pretty outdated now.

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#6  Edited By DarthBuzzard
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@jackamomo said:

@darthbuzzard: Then the VR aspect is redundant as you don't need to see the other person from multiple directions if your are both sat still.

You are proposing simply displaying a 3d image instead of your face so a VR headset would be of no use.

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I'm not sure what your point is. Video chat would work the same but at a virtual level, it's just a feature you can make use of. Your avatar can be indistinguishable from your real world self given enough advances.

The main use for communication would be two avatars in the same virtual space together. This makes you feel like you are with another person for real. Only VR and AR can do this.

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#7  Edited By DarthBuzzard
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@jackamomo said:

Can I just say. If you use it for video calls then your face would be obscured for the other person.

Also it wouldn’t be possible to 3d map the face of the recipient without some kind of binocular camera device which may not exist.

Video calls can be done virtually using your avatar, which will in the not too distant future be an exact duplicate of you in real life. Well, as long as you want to show your real face. Your avatar will just become an extension of yourself. People already do interviews, video commentary, take selfies using their avatars.

Facial capture has existed for years. Even the latest iPhone models do this. It's also progressing at alarmingly fast rates and will be a pretty default thing in the next 3-5 years.

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#8 DarthBuzzard
Member since 2019 • 360 Posts

@HalcyonScarlet said:
@darthbuzzard said:
@HalcyonScarlet said:

@darthbuzzard: No, VR has no primary uses. When i say primary uses, I mean how computers and smartphones are fundamental to a lot of peoples lives. A computer runs business or controls other machinery. That's primary use.

VR is used in some interesting fields sure.

As for my point, this article details many of my thoughts:

https://econsultancy.com/why-are-vr-headset-sales-declining/

And that could be leading to developer interest possibly declining:

https://mashable.com/2018/01/24/virtual-reality-gaming-loser-gdc-2018-survey/?europe=true#5sh9nMeYD5qN

Just because you don't have the capacity to think about what VR enables doesn't make it so. You have things like social VR, telepresence with 360 photos and videos + reconstructions. Those are massive on a scale of the invention of phonecalls and videos. You have other things like being able to simulate screens, lifestyle and exercise, artistic expression, living new kinds of lives. Basically you have full control over the perception system. That is world-changing. I also only listed consumer applications, not any of the enterprise stuff.

Your first link is pointless and was already debunked many times in the articles it got posted in. It was mostly skewed data to make things look bad, not any real valid data apart from Oculus Go, which by the way, exceeded sales targets.

Your second link isn't that big of a deal. The quality of games coming out is only increasing. Developers are learning more, and there are plenty of big developers working on VR.

That point wasn't that VR didn't have uses, only that it was a false equivalency to compare it to the PC and smartphones.

The first article wasn't pointless, you just missed the point. It was posing ideas that could have a negative impact, like I was.

The second article is the difference between a developer truly committing from the ground up or just tacked on experiences. Developers don't historically properly commit to a device until it has a huge growing base, because of the lack of financial viability with time and effort. At least for now.

What is the main function of a smartphone? It's a multi-purpose device that evolved from phonecalls and texting. That was the unique feature of phones. VR is the same. You have the ability to do anything a smartphone can do, but much more. The history of communication works like this: Phonecalls -> Texting -> Video Calls. Now we have VR/AR, the next paradigm in communication, and just as big if not bigger than the aforementioned. Like the others, this will change how society works; it's that big of a deal.

The first article is mostly pointless in regards to the data used. As I said, it's mostly skewed to drive a false narrative.

The second article is still not as worrying as you think. There are quite a number of developers making full VR games at this point.

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#9  Edited By DarthBuzzard
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@HalcyonScarlet said:

@darthbuzzard: No, VR has no primary uses. When i say primary uses, I mean how computers and smartphones are fundamental to a lot of peoples lives. A computer runs business or controls other machinery. That's primary use.

VR is used in some interesting fields sure.

As for my point, this article details many of my thoughts:

https://econsultancy.com/why-are-vr-headset-sales-declining/

And that could be leading to developer interest possibly declining:

https://mashable.com/2018/01/24/virtual-reality-gaming-loser-gdc-2018-survey/?europe=true#5sh9nMeYD5qN

Just because you don't have the capacity to think about what VR enables doesn't make it so. You have things like social VR, telepresence with 360 photos and videos + reconstructions. Those are massive on a scale of the invention of phonecalls and videos. You have other things like being able to simulate screens, lifestyle and exercise, artistic expression, living new kinds of lives. Basically you have full control over the perception system. That is world-changing. I also only listed consumer applications, not any of the enterprise stuff.

Your first link is pointless and was already debunked many times in the articles it got posted in. It was mostly skewed data to make things look bad, not any real valid data apart from Oculus Go, which by the way, exceeded sales targets.

Your second link isn't that big of a deal. The quality of games coming out is only increasing. Developers are learning more, and there are plenty of big developers working on VR.

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#10 DarthBuzzard
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@Jacanuk said:
@darthbuzzard said:

I'm talking about people who have tried VR. Those who haven't don't have an opinion that counts.

Clearly, when VR has not hit the mainstream and can at least go into the double digits, it´s not a good sign that it´s anything else than a fad.

But be glad you enjoy it, that is all that matters for you.

This is a sign of nothing. Do you say this about any technology that was in single digits? Because everything you've ever used was at that stage and stuck there for years.