[QUOTE="ymi_basic"][QUOTE="dvader654"]

I am beyond super pissed, no store wants to sell this game on the day its supposed to be out!!!!!!!!!!! Everyone has some stupid crappy store policy of releasing stuff on tuesday, never mind that they have the game, they could sell it if they want to but no they want to lose customers instead. Plus no GS in the entire Miami area got the game.

This is my mental state right now:

dvader654

Yes, I am always serious in gaming message boards...

I am beyond super pissed, no store wants to sell this game on the day its supposed to be out!!!!!!!!!!! Everyone has some stupid crappy store policy of releasing stuff on tuesday, never mind that they have the game, they could sell it if they want to but no they want to lose customers instead. Plus no GS in the entire Miami area got the game.

This is my mental state right now:

dvader654

[QUOTE="ymi_basic"]

I have had an hour or so with Prime and that experience did not make me optimistic. I found targeting outside of the dead zone (ie while turning) to be very erratic. I realize that to be fair, one really needs to invest hundreds of hours in it. Even then, the only way to have a fair comparison would be to have head-to-head matches using the wiimote versus dual analog. I'd have to say though, at this point despite your assurances to the contrary, I believe agood player with dual analog would destroy someone playing with any of the current Wii schemes.gaminggeek

Virtually every review says the same thing about prime 3: it has the best controls for a console FPS ever. So I really don't see where you're coming from. Maybe you could argue that a dual analogue player could beat a wii-mote player, but only because of generous auto aim on dual analogue set-ups. Give them the same restrictions on aiming, the same point by point contact and there wouldn't be any competition. I could shoot someone in the head, in the crotch, then flip and shoot them in the ass before they could even turn around.

The Wii needs a real shooter with a community of highly skilled players before any judgement can be made.

[QUOTE="ymi_basic"]

[QUOTE="nopalversion"]Really, guys, that is too much...gaminggeek

the fundamental flaw to your argument is that you're basing it all on theory and what you've /seen/ other people done, instead of actually trying out the game, and seeing how it can work...Skylock00

If I were you I'd get chummy with the local games shop owner and ask to play Prime 3 on the advanced setting in the shop or borrow a wii from a friend. Or rent a few shooters and go to a friends house. I think you'd be suprised. It's not flat out perfect control wise, but IMHO it is SO much better than dual analogue. I agree some of the games aren't too hot, COD3 is a joke and the control is the only good thing about it. So far, Prime 3 and this new MOH game are the only shooters on Wii worth one damn, although red steel can be fun in bursts but has what is generally considered to be one of the worst control schemes.

Really, guys, that is too much...nopalversion

the fundamental flaw to your argument is that you're basing it all on theory and what you've /seen/ other people done, instead of actually trying out the game, and seeing how it can work...Skylock00

[QUOTE="ymi_basic"]I'm sorry to keep this going, but you're just wrong here. If you are circle strafing, your target must be at the center of your circle in order for it to be fixedin your view. Think of it from the frame of reference of an observer from above. If the shooter is circling the target clockwise with the Wii MoHH system, hisaim must always be pushed to the right of thecenter in order to maintainhis clockwise rotation. If the target is in that line of sight, it won't be for long because that line of sight does not rotate about the target.Skylock00

[QUOTE="ymi_basic"]Your rotation rate would only be constant if you are literally strafing in a circle. In a more general case like running in a straight line while targeting someone off to your side, you have to continuously adjustyour rotation rate. Even literal circle strafing is not possible because your target can not be at the center of your circle. It would be some sort of spiral strafe.Skylock00

I'm not saying that there isn't a learning curve to doing FPS controls on the Wii from the player standpoint, simply that what you are claiming as impossible/almost impossible is in fact neither - they are completely possible manuvers to execute, and after practice with the controls, are ones that I've found more comfortable and logical to execute than dual analog ever offered me.

It becomes even more complex in the case of varying rotation rate situations. It's obvious to me from the gameplay videos that none of those guys are very effective in run-and-gun situations unless they are running almost directly at their target... and even then they are making use of a very generous auto-aim. Maybe it's just those particular players, but I know I can do muchbetter run-and-gun targeting using dual sticks in games like Unreal and Timesplitters.

[QUOTE="ymi_basic"]

I don't believe that. You don't have independent control of your rotation rate and your reticle position. That makes it almost impossible to target someone while turning. With the reticle locked, you could focus onyour target while you run past him. The rotation rate required to keep him centered would come naturally. With the MoHH system, you would have to have some complex balance of rotation rate and continously changing reticle position to stay targeted. It's obvious to me that no one in the videos is able to do it.

Skylock00

I would know, because I've done this on other FPSs on the Wii without too much difficulty at all.

You can still focus on your target. You just have to get over the fact that the target doesn't have to be in the center of the screen for you to be focused on it. It's not that complex at all, honestly, since it's the same convention found in dual analog, with the only difference is that the reticle isn't locked in the center of the screen, because mechanically based on the idea that you can't have a way of resetting the Wii Remote's position (like you can with a mouse), it simply can't work that way.

[QUOTE="Angry_Beaver"]

Wouldn't work without a way to recenter. The Wiimote isn't a mouse, after all.

Skylock00

It's just easier, and more natural to go with having the reticle move based where you are pointing, than to try and have the reticle fixed.

... it obliterates dual analogue. gaminggeek