Samsung Barred from Selling Galaxy Tab in European Union

I acknowledge that there are some things that Apple's iPad legitimately does better than other tablets (battery life, stability, ease of use) and I also acknowledge that Apple's hardware is virtually second to none.The_Game21x

Even before I decided to get an Android tablet (yes I have one)The_Game21x

[QUOTE="psn8214"]

I mean, I just thought it was hilarious how he said there were better tablets than the iPad, while acknowledging that the iPad has better hardware and apps than the competition. :lol:

You can call me all the names you'd like, but I don't even have to say anything there!

110million

I guess this is what happenes when you read posts after drinking the apple kool-aid.

Apple products have always had solid hardware, but it isn't like the competition has stuff that will break when you hold it funny. This is true for PCs too, but I won't give up 95% of my games for better hardware.

He also said better NATIVE app support, the stuff that comes with it. Android is more about community made apps. The iPad is better out of the box, android tablets have the potential to be much better with a bit of time. A dedicated development community can mean the world. 

Also, this. 

Apple's hardware is unrivaled in virtually every respect. You'd have to be one of the blindest of all fanboys to deny this. 

That said, just because Apple's hardware is better does not mean that its tablet as a whole is the better buy for everyone. The development community for Android is AMAZING and have put together some amazing applications for Android tablets, those officially recognized by Google and those who aren't (mine is one of the latter).

And in the tablet market, although consumers haven't taken note in the same numbers as those who purchase iPads, the Nook Color (no, this isn't what I've got) is widely considered to be the best overall value on the market. Once rooted and a custom ROM is installed, it's amazing just how capable it becomes and for $250 new and $225 - $199 refurbished straight from B&N, you can't beat it.

[QUOTE="The_Game21x"] Even before I decided to get an Android tablet (yes I have one)Heil68

Good for you. I think I'll go enjoy my tablet now. :)

Heck, I even compared it to my dad's iPad 2 and quite frankly...I'm pleased with what I've got. :D

[QUOTE="Heil68"][QUOTE="The_Game21x"] Even before I decided to get an Android tablet (yes I have one)The_Game21x

Good for you. I think I'll go enjoy my tablet now. :)

Heck, I even compared it to my dad's iPad 2 and quite frankly...I'm pleased with what I've got. :D

Heck, I even compared it to my dad's iPad 2 and quite frankly...I'm pleased with what I've got. :D

The_Game21x

:lol::lol::lol: 

Keep telling yourself that! :P

[QUOTE="The_Game21x"]

Heck, I even compared it to my dad's iPad 2 and quite frankly...I'm pleased with what I've got. :D

psn8214

:lol::lol::lol: 

Keep telling yourself that! :P

Hmm...

And you say you aren't drinking the Kool-Aid? :?

[QUOTE="The_Game21x"]

Heck, I even compared it to my dad's iPad 2 and quite frankly...I'm pleased with what I've got. :D

psn8214

:lol::lol::lol: 

Keep telling yourself that! :P

[QUOTE="psn8214"][QUOTE="The_Game21x"]

Heck, I even compared it to my dad's iPad 2 and quite frankly...I'm pleased with what I've got. :D

The_Game21x

:lol::lol::lol: 

Keep telling yourself that! :P

Hmm...

And you say you aren't drinking the Kool-Aid? :?

Apple Fans:

Complain haters come out in full force with legitimate gripes, 

Can't begin to acknowledge other products exist in a usable fashion. 

Apple Fans:

Complain haters come out in full force with legitimate gripes, 

Can't begin to acknowledge other products exist in a usable fashion. 

 

110million

This thread didn't begin life as an Apple vs other tablets usability thread, it began life as a discussion about patents, intellectual property, and Samsung's inability to sell their tablet in Europe and Australia. So it would seem your point of view here is flawed. It wasn't the Kool-Aid drinking Apple fans that turned it into the thread it is now.

To this point, not one single person has said that Android tablets are unusable, so once again we're seeing a misconception on your part in regards to this thread. And quite frankly, I haven't seen many gripes about the iPad at all, other than it isn't as customizable as other tablets on the market. It's a small price to pay if it means having the largest app store, the most software support, the best hardware support and the most stable and consistent OS, to name a few advantages. It seems pertinent to add that the company that makes it has more money than the US government.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that there are some of us who would call into question the desire for a simply "usable" tablet, when drastically better products are available.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that there are some of us who would call into question the desire for a simply "usable" tablet, when drastically better products are available.

musicalmac

Don't understand this concept of drastically better. Its fully possible that a android tablet is able to satisfy every single need of someone.

You can have a million aps, but if someone got a tablet mostly for internet browsing or similar tasks, its irrelevant, and somewhat limiting with the iPad's lack of flash. You can talk about how there are no major sites that are based on flash or that flash games don't work well with tablets, but those are opinions regardless.

I can't even fathom what I would use apps for. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't that appstore need to have approved apps while android ones you can just add to the device through like a normal usb interface? I imagine emulation and the likes would work better then.  

Don't understand this concept of drastically better. Its fully possible that a android tablet is able to satisfy every single need of someone.

You can have a million aps, but if someone got a tablet mostly for internet browsing or similar tasks, its irrelevant, and somewhat limiting with the iPad's lack of flash. You can talk about how there are no major sites that are based on flash or that flash games don't work well with tablets, but those are opinions regardless.

I can't even fathom what I would use apps for. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't that appstore need to have approved apps while android ones you can just add to the device through like a normal usb interface? I imagine emulation and the likes would work better then.  

110million

To show up on the App store, you need approval from Apple. Though there are other means to put apps on jailbroken iPads, though I haven't had enough of a reason to be swayed to do such a thing. The advantage is that the selection is quite a bit better, and the risk of invasive software is almost insignificant, which is proved by how Google has had to employ their "kill switch" to forcibly remove applications from the marketplace and users' phones. Naughty developers making invasive, privacy-breaching software...

You lost me when you stated that you couldn't fathom what you would use apps for. What wouldn't you use apps for is probably a more logical question.

Am I the only person in this union who can get by in life without any of these?!CJL13

Naw, you're just the first one to say something

[QUOTE="CJL13"]Am I the only person in this union who can get by in life without any of these?!PatchMaster

Naw, you're just the first one to say something

You lost me when you stated that you couldn't fathom what you would use apps for. What wouldn't you use apps for is probably a more logical question.

musicalmac

Let me break it down like this.

I see commercials that go like: do you task A? There is an app for that. Do you task b? There is an app for that? etc 

But its like, tablets have internet, if I need to find a way to get somewhere, I can use google maps, and it can show you nearby restaurants and all that.

I have never heard of an app that would make my life a whole lot easier, just a bunch of simple ones that may save you 1 or 2 seconds at a time.

Let me ask you, what apps do you find significantly help you accomplish things you can't just google for? I'm not trying to troll if it comes off that way, but I am genuinely curious.  

Let me ask you, what apps do you find significantly help you accomplish things you can't just google for? I'm not trying to troll if it comes off that way, but I am genuinely curious.  

110million

I think you may be underestimating the iPad.

Netflix and Youtube apps are obvious. Comics is an app for DC, Marvel, Darkhorse, Image, and other big comic names, with a guided view that makes comic books more interesting to read. iBooks, Kindle, and Nook apps allow me to access every major ereader library. Google maps is a good app. iTeleport allows me to remotely access my desktop. Pages, Numbers, and Keynote allow me to create and edit documents, spreadsheets, and presentations (fully compatible with MS Office). NoteTaker HD is a great way to take and organize written notes. Pandora is Pandora. Xfinity app let's me change the channel, browse the guide, watch TV, and schedule recordings on my DVR (Comcast). Evernote is Evernote. Skype is Skype. Colloquy is a fantastic IRC app. CNBC Real Time let's me follow all my stocks in real time (very cool). Of course there are games like Sim City, Avadon: The Black Fortress, Sid Meier's Pirates, NBA Jam, Plants vs Zombies, X-Plane 9, Football Manager 2011, Anomaly: Warzone, and thousands and thousands more.

Games aside we're about 2 pages in to some of the apps I have installed on my iPad. There are so many more.

[QUOTE="110million"]

Let me ask you, what apps do you find significantly help you accomplish things you can't just google for? I'm not trying to troll if it comes off that way, but I am genuinely curious.  

musicalmac

I think you may be underestimating the iPad.

Netflix and Youtube apps are obvious. Comics is an app for DC, Marvel, Darkhorse, Image, and other big comic names, with a guided view that makes comic books more interesting to read. iBooks, Kindle, and Nook apps allow me to access every major ereader library. Google maps is a good app. iTeleport allows me to remotely access my desktop. Pages, Numbers, and Keynote allow me to create and edit documents, spreadsheets, and presentations (fully compatible with MS Office). NoteTaker HD is a great way to take and organize written notes. Pandora is Pandora. Xfinity app let's me change the channel, browse the guide, watch TV, and schedule recordings on my DVR (Comcast). Evernote is Evernote. Skype is Skype. Colloquy is a fantastic IRC app. CNBC Real Time let's me follow all my stocks in real time (very cool). Of course there are games like Sim City, Avadon: The Black Fortress, Sid Meier's Pirates, NBA Jam, Plants vs Zombies, X-Plane 9, Football Manager 2011, Anomaly: Warzone, and thousands and thousands more.

Games aside we're about 2 pages in to some of the apps I have installed on my iPad. There are so many more.

I don't mean to start another fire, but a lot of these apps are also available on the Android side too. Stock checking, kindle/google reader, google Maps (duh), games, pandora, Note taking apps, etc. I don't have an android tablet, so these apps being available for the bigger screens, i don't know about, but I must admit that while some of these things are available, I do not feel there's anything there I use more often aside from gaming, browsing, music, and IMing. Now I know you find your iPad worth it, i think mine is cool to have, but I don't think either iPad or Android tablets are any better in this regard. I admit the iPad is really well built, the OS is nice and easy to use, but it isn't perfect or exactly something I consider "above and beyond" when you consider it's the apps that mostly make these things... what they are. It's just the iPad is a more standard system, so naturallly you'll get better performing apps that don't have to go through different architectures and systems. yoshi_64

Meh. Again, Apple has the bigger app store but you have to ask yourself...how many apps are you really going to use? Just based on my iPod Touch, I have a crapload of apps that I've downloaded over the years that aren't even installed on my iPod anymore and just reside on my hard drive, many of them which will never be installed again because they're either outdated, buggy, or have been replaced by better apps. Android does not have a lot of native Honeycomb apps, true enough, but it covers most (if not all) of the bases most people have. I'll use my experience as an example

Video - Moboplayer, MX Video Player, Netflix (yep. works flawlessly for me),

Document Viewing/Editing - Quick Office HD, Documents to Go, ezPDFReader, MicroJournal, 

Web Browsing - Too many to list. I've literally got a browser for each day of the week, should I choose to use them (and not because one isn't enough or that they're all deficient in some way oh, and they play flash)

Navigation - Google Maps

E-Mail - Native GMail (which is awesome), generic Honeycomb E-mail client for non GMail accounts, Kaiten Mail

Social Networking - TweetComb, Facebook, FriendMe, jTalk, AndChat, Tapatalk Pro, Google +

Comics - Android Comic Viewer, Comixology, Perfect Viewer

Music - PowerAmp, Amazon MP3 (with Cloiud Player built in), Google Music Beta, Last FM, Pandora

Photo Browsing/Editing - Photoshop Express, QuickPic,

File Browsing - Oh wait, iOS doesn't even allow this unless you jailbreak your phone/tablet so let's not even start that.

News - Pulse, USA Today, Engadget,  IMDB, SkyGrid,

E-Reader - Kindle, Nook, 

Other -  Autodesk Sketchbook, Splashtop Remote HD, Wapedia

And so on, and so on. I'm not even going to bother listing the games. 

Fact of the matter is, there are plenty of apps available for Honeycomb tablets that will satisfy most users. The iPad app selection is better, no doubt but the fact of the matter is, most users aren't going to use even a tiny fraction of the apps available in either app store and that both won't appeal perfectly to every user.

My biggest issue is that Apple fanboys don't seem to even acknowledge that legitimate alternatives exist or that they can't fathom why people would buy them because "[insert Apple product here] is so much better". One size does not fit all. 

Meh. Again, Apple has the bigger app store but you have to ask yourself...how many apps are you really going to use? Just based on my iPod Touch, I have a crapload of apps that I've downloaded over the years that aren't even installed on my iPod anymore and just reside on my hard drive, many of them which will never be installed again because they're either outdated, buggy, or have been replaced by better apps. Android does not have a lot of native Honeycomb apps, true enough, but it covers most (if not all) of the bases most people have. I'll use my experience as an example

List of Applications

Fact of the matter is, there are plenty of apps available for Honeycomb tablets that will satisfy most users. The iPad app selection is better, no doubt but the fact of the matter is, most users aren't going to use even a tiny fraction of the apps available in either app store and that both won't appeal perfectly to every user.

My biggest issue is that Apple fanboys don't seem to even acknowledge that legitimate alternatives exist or that they can't fathom why people would buy them because "[insert Apple product here] is so much better". One size does not fit all. 

The_Game21x

I sat here in disbelief for close to five minutes, re-reading your post over and over, trying to understand why you wrote what you did, because so much of it is neither factual nor reasonable.

Time for more facts. Giving the number of Honeycomb apps the benefit of the doubt (in an absurd way), lets assume there are 232 different kinds of applications available. That would mean you have one app to satisfy every need. Lets compare that with Apple's tablet app availability of 100,000 and handicap it in an absurd way, assuming there are still only 232 kinds of applications in the world. That would mean for every 1 app android users have available to them, iPad owners would have approximately 431 different choices to choose from to find the app that best fits them.

Continuing with that line of thinking, it's true that one size will never truly fit all. However, why would you ever recommend a non-iPad tablet to anybody unless they have an unusually high amount of distain for Apple? Even according to Google's numbers, there are only about 1.2 million android tablets out there today, as compared with over 28 million iPads (source).

Other important things to keep in mind: A lot of iOS developers are making money, significant amounts of it. Braveheart developer Noah Bordner (a game available on iOS and Android) spilled his guts to the Huffington Post about money and the differences between developing for Apple and Google. Even though his game is a top 50 title on Android and a top 200 title on iOS, he is making more money from his iOS version.

Bordner actually writes that "a polished, high quality product is more likely to be embraced on Android than on iOS because the quality bar on the android market is so pathetically low." Battleheart is reviewed more highly and more often on Android, which he credits to a "lack of competition."HuffingtonPost

That's surprisingly blunt coming from a developer. The article continues --

Source.

He ends up getting more hate-mail than he expected, so he backtracked a little and said he has had an "overwhelmingly" positive experience developing for Android devices (which sounds a lot like a veiled insult to me, and a way to get people to stop sending him hate mail). The other thing to realize here is that Bordner isn't talking specifically about tablet apps, he's talking about the entire android marketplace. I know I wouldn't want to be strapped with an even thinner selection of what some developers seem to think is of a pathetically low quality (not my words, his).

To finish up before my flight, the idea that Apple fanboys are the problem here is the third head scratcher I've seen from you in this thread. Nobody denied the obvious fact that there are android tablets which can do many things the iPad can do. But when you look at the facts (actual numbers, interviews with actual developers, device sales, and company stability), it's hard to look at android tablets as legitimate alternatives to anybody other than people who are vehemently anti-Apple.

Do you understand?

My biggest issue is that Apple fanboys don't seem to even acknowledge that legitimate alternatives exist.The_Game21x

Let's back up a bit, so a lot of the argument is that the iPad has like 400 options for every application the Android has. 

Why would an Apple user prefer loads of application options but turn around and use OS X over Windows? 

Is one quality application for a specific purpose not enough? 

 

Let's back up a bit, so a lot of the argument is that the iPad has like 400 options for every application the Android has. 

Why would an Apple user prefer loads of application options but turn around and use OS X over Windows? 

Is one quality application for a specific purpose not enough? 

110million

[QUOTE="110million"]

 

Let's back up a bit, so a lot of the argument is that the iPad has like 400 options for every application the Android has. 

Why would an Apple user prefer loads of application options but turn around and use OS X over Windows? 

Is one quality application for a specific purpose not enough? 

Heil68

That isn't even within the same realm, I'm talking about products from some of the same companies we are talking about. The philosophy of application choices is not limited to tablets, if its so important to have a wide range of choices for one device, why isn't it for another from the same company? 

I knew the questioned would be ignored though, but I didn't think anyone would exagerate it so something so different. :roll:  

[QUOTE="Heil68"][QUOTE="110million"]

 

Let's back up a bit, so a lot of the argument is that the iPad has like 400 options for every application the Android has. 

Why would an Apple user prefer loads of application options but turn around and use OS X over Windows? 

Is one quality application for a specific purpose not enough? 

110million

That isn't even within the same realm, I'm talking about products from some of the same companies we are talking about. The philosophy of application choices is not limited to tablets, if its so important to have a wide range of choices for one device, why isn't it for another from the same company? 

I knew the questioned would be ignored though, but I didn't think anyone would exagerate it so something so different. :roll:  

 Derrp, the topic here is tablets? But leave it to you to bring in Windows vs OSX to the mix. I guess that's what you do when you're loosing the argument so badly. Misdirections and grasping at straw. :roll:.Heil68

Kool aid buffet eh. 

I specifically used that scenerio to bring up a point, I wasn't trying to change the argument. I find the best way to make a point is to give an example people will understand.

I was saying that OS X does just fine with quality apps instead of quantity apps, even on Windows, a lot of the choices are crap, there is one zip program that is the best, one burning program that can accomplish everything you need, and the likes.

Game listed android apps that accomplish the same tasks as what mac listed, mac's main counterpoint was that the tablet store has 400 variations for every option, but why is it that quantity alone is the winner? Is it better to sift through the mud to find the best apps? Whether I was using an android tablet or an ipad, I would look up to see what is considered the best and just get that. If something is truly worthwhile, I'm sure there is a version made for both.

I'm kind of disgusted that everytime there seems to be a cool headed response praising android, the response is some kind of "i had to laugh for 5 minutes at how stupid you are" instead of "here is why I disagree".  

Hmm...

And you say you aren't drinking the Kool-Aid? :?

The_Game21x

Nope. I'm 100% objective, as I always am. :) I've owned both Android and Apple devices and seen the difference with my own eyes. I think you're suffering from post-Android-purchase jealously, an unfortunate side effect of delving into lesser tablets. It's OK though, it'll get better with time. :P

I specifically used that scenerio to bring up a point, I wasn't trying to change the argument. I find the best way to make a point is to give an example people will understand. I was saying that OS X does just fine with quality apps instead of quantity apps, even on Windows110million

 

Let's back up a bit, so a lot of the argument is that the iPad has like 400 options for every application the Android has. 

Why would an Apple user prefer loads of application options but turn around and use OS X over Windows? 

Is one quality application for a specific purpose not enough? 

110million

[QUOTE="110million"]I specifically used that scenerio to bring up a point, I wasn't trying to change the argument. I find the best way to make a point is to give an example people will understand. I was saying that OS X does just fine with quality apps instead of quantity apps, even on WindowsHeil68

If all OSes were made equal in terms of games, I would be using Linux all day erryday.

Especially since in a week I'll have my info security degree. :wink:  

Game listed android apps that accomplish the same tasks as what mac listed, mac's main counterpoint was that the tablet store has 400 variations for every option, but why is it that quantity alone is the winner? Is it better to sift through the mud to find the best apps? Whether I was using an android tablet or an ipad, I would look up to see what is considered the best and just get that. If something is truly worthwhile, I'm sure there is a version made for both. 

110million

First of all, your last sentence is wishful thinking. As for this point above, I appreciate how hard-fast you're sticking to my very generous example, but it's time to think critically. There are obviously more than 232 kinds of applications, which means your selection with native Honeycomb apps is incredibly limited, and the chances of finding quality apps is greatly diminished.

I'm kind of disgusted that everytime there seems to be a cool headed response praising android, the response is some kind of "i had to laugh for 5 minutes at how stupid you are" instead of "here is why I disagree". 110million

I'm disappointed that people have such terrible reading comprehension. I said no such thing. Read it again with a cooler head.

And feel free to ignore the other points I made in my post, they are pretty difficult to refute.

what a fantastic bullcrap by Apple, thankfully Apple is not Nintendo or we would be playing with joysicks right now, ONLY NINTENDO MAKES CONTROLLERS :cry:HAZE-Unit

Clearly, you cannot be convinced that Android is a legitimate and perfectly good alternative to the iPad and iOS and seriously, the following says it all.

"However, why would you ever recommend a non-iPad tablet to anybody unless they have an unusually high amount of distain for Apple?"

"it's hard to look at android tablets as legitimate alternatives to anybody other than people who are vehemently anti-Apple."

And really, what more needs to be said? The idea that an Android tablet (or any other tablet for that matter) can't be viewed as a reasonable alternative for anyone UNLESS they really don't like Apple is absurd.

Honeycomb adoption has been slow in comparison to Apple but that's primarily due to the facts that 1) Apple did put together a great piece of hardware 2) Apple has great marketing and, perhaps most importantly, 3) Apple beat everyone to the punch.

Am I saying the tablet wars would have been flip flopped if Google had come up with the idea for a tablet first? Not necessarily. Would things have been different? Yep.

But I'm not here to debate what ifs. But using one developer's opinion of Android's App Market as some sort of blanket statement or objective truth is also silly.

"I know I wouldn't want to be strapped with an even thinner selection of what some developers seem to think is of a pathetically low quality"

I wasn't aware that one man's opinion could somehow equal "some developers".

But whatever. If you want to believe that Apple is the be-all and end-all in the tablet space, then go right ahead. This "debate" is very tiring and the unnecessarily condescending tone of your posts is a chore to deal with. To say that Android defenders are fanboys purely because of their descision to support a platform that isn't Apple is ludicrous.  

[QUOTE="The_Game21x"]

Hmm...

And you say you aren't drinking the Kool-Aid? :?

psn8214

Nope. I'm 100% objective, as I always am. :) I've owned both Android and Apple devices and seen the difference with my own eyes. I think you're suffering from post-Android-purchase jealously, an unfortunate side effect of delving into lesser tablets. It's OK though, it'll get better with time. :P

Oh boy. This says so much. 

If you want to believe I'm jealous of iPad owners, go ahead. It isn't exactly the most mature thing to do but I'll understand anyway. :)

If you want to believe I'm jealous of iPad owners, go ahead. It isn't exactly the most mature thing to do but I'll understand anyway. :)

The_Game21x

Want to believe? That seems to imply that there is any lack of doubt of said jealously. :o

Oh, and please don't bring maturity into this discussion, Mr. Got-me-moderated-twelve-times21x. :P

[QUOTE="The_Game21x"]

If you want to believe I'm jealous of iPad owners, go ahead. It isn't exactly the most mature thing to do but I'll understand anyway. :)

psn8214

Want to believe? That seems to imply that there is any lack of doubt of said jealously. :o

Oh, and please don't bring maturity into this discussion, Mr. Got-me-moderated-twelve-times21x. :P

Yes, because when someone's only response to an argument is "you're just jealous", that person definitely represents a pillar of maturity.

Also, I'm sorry you feel that way Mr. Did-things-to-get-himself-moderated-twelve-times-and-is-mad-that-he-was-punished-for it-8214" :)

Yes, because when someone's only response to an argument is "you're just jealous", that person definitely represents a pillar of maturity.

Also, I'm sorry you feel that way Mr. Did-things-to-get-himself-moderated-twelve-times-and-is-mad-that-he-was-punished-for it-8214" :)

The_Game21x

I'm not arguing with you - where'd you get that idea? I'm just pointing things out as I see them. :) Mac and 110 are arguing. I'm just noting things that I've observed. No need to get all personal. :P

Oh, and please don't bring maturity into this discussion, Mr. Got-me-moderated-twelve-times21x. :P

psn8214

Also, I'm sorry you feel that way Mr. Did-things-to-get-himself-moderated-twelve-times-and-is-mad-that-he-was-punished-for it-8214" :)

The_Game21x

LOL

This thread is sad.

and not in a good way.

This thread is sad.

and not in a good way.

siLVURcross

damn mac, really? lulsSky-

Say whuuuuuu...

SO... I guess the Apple-people win this round! :D