French Senate passes ban on full Muslim veils

[QUOTE="th3warr1or"][QUOTE="LaPiyamasDeGato"]Another freedom gone in the name of safety. I am appalled by this. LaPiyamasDeGato

[QUOTE="GazaAli"][QUOTE="EdenProxy"] The west is not about absolute freedom. Other wise I would be free to kill others and thats not right. DraugenCP

Frankly, playing the'bank robber' card is the only safe way of outlawing it since it's the only one that won't get you in trouble with EU legislation. This a small part of the problem, though. The essential problem is not 'fear', but the fact that women who wear these scarves are limiting themselves extremely within a society such as the French one. And in these times, we just can't allow that immigrants willingly exclude themselves and live at our expense.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

The same reason why you can't wear Ski masks in public inless its Halloween or extremely environmental conditions..

metroidfood

You're right, it's not like we let other people get away with wearing masks in public...

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

Last I checked inless your facing extremely cold temperatures.. Skiing or its halloween.. Or on private property.. You can't wear them..sSubZerOo

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="metroidfood"]Wait, so if they don't like another culture they can just ban it, personal liberties be damned?metroidfood

Its sad to see that some ppl have grown thinking freedom means you can do whatever you ******* like and if someone tells you other wise its violating your rights.

Good luck in the workforce .

EdenProxy

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="EdenProxy"] Your not allowedto have your hair over your face when getting a photo for id taken. Same with hats and hoodies. sSubZerOo

Ok firstly stop comparing a baseball cap to a veil.. They are not the same.. They do not obsecure the entire face.. IN which veils can and some do to a point you can even tell their eye color.. Not even shades, glasses, and a hoddie does this amount.. The veil is only akin to a ski mask.. Last I checked inless your facing extremely cold temperatures.. Skiing or its halloween.. Or on private property.. You can't wear them..

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

Thats private property.. In which they can enforce what ever rules they want.

metroidfood

What about walking or riding the bus there?

Your damned right.. That must mean every underage kid I can post up on the internet drinking booze even publically means that they are not breaking the law!.. Your logic is brilliant.. Please go further, this is highly amusing.

[QUOTE="KlepticGrooves"]

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"] French values include personal liberty to hold whatever values you ****ing want.Theokhoth

Clearly the French disagree :?

I don't think there's any danger of them voting for the either of those. In any case, the Senate voted 246 to 1. That suggests to me that the majority matters. After all, that's how voting works, right?

Its sad to see that some ppl have grown thinking freedom means you can do whatever you ******* like and if someone tells you other wise its violating your rights.

Good luck in the workforce .

EdenProxy

We never said we did. Stop making strawmen.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"] Then have the veil removed when having a photo taken. :|topsemag55

Theo, then what do you do when her husband thinks the family honor is besmirched by her showing her face for a photo?

He might decide to send her to their home country for severe punishment.

Simple solution for the French would be to just cut back on the amount of Arabs they allow in every year, they can keep their french heritage etc. I can see the US and Canada are cultural mosaics so we must be tolerant to others, but in Europe, accept European customs or leave...I would expect the same treatment in the middle east if I wasen't wearing appropriate clothing.KlownMaster

Its sad to see that some ppl have grown thinking freedom means you can do whatever you ******* like and if someone tells you other wise its violating your rights.

Good luck in the workforce .

EdenProxy

Workforce/=/government

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"] Then have the veil removed when having a photo taken. :|Theokhoth

Ok firstly stop comparing a baseball cap to a veil.. They are not the same.. They do not obsecure the entire face.. IN which veils can and some do to a point you can even tell their eye color.. Not even shades, glasses, and a hoddie does this amount.. The veil is only akin to a ski mask.. Last I checked inless your facing extremely cold temperatures.. Skiing or its halloween.. Or on private property.. You can't wear them..

ARE YOU SERIOUSLY.. Trying to compare THOSE to which you can see half of their face to some of the more extreme versions of the veil..http://observers.france24.com/files/images/total.jpgIn which you can't even identifiy which sex they are? Or their eye color?

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

Ok firstly stop comparing a baseball cap to a veil.. They are not the same.. They do not obsecure the entire face.. IN which veils can and some do to a point you can even tell their eye color.. Not even shades, glasses, and a hoddie does this amount.. The veil is only akin to a ski mask.. Last I checked inless your facing extremely cold temperatures.. Skiing or its halloween.. Or on private property.. You can't wear them..

EdenProxy

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

Ok firstly stop comparing a baseball cap to a veil.. They are not the same.. They do not obsecure the entire face.. IN which veils can and some do to a point you can even tell their eye color.. Not even shades, glasses, and a hoddie does this amount.. The veil is only akin to a ski mask.. Last I checked inless your facing extremely cold temperatures.. Skiing or its halloween.. Or on private property.. You can't wear them..

sSubZerOo

ARE YOU SERIOUSLY.. Trying to compare THOSE to which you can see half of their face to some of the more extreme versions of the veil..http://observers.france24.com/files/images/total.jpgIn which you can't even identifiy which sex they are? Or their eye color?

Now we begin to talk whatever we want. first the Quran says nothing about the veil. Second, I did not know majority means legitimacy. Third, I thought the west is about absolute freedom. GazaAli

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

sSubZerOo

A. It's not Halloween, this was Improve Everywhere who staged this in New York in the middle of May.

B. How is a gathered protest in public different from walking around by yourself in public when it comes to wearing a mask? Suddenly, several people are doing it so it's okay?

I can't say that I support the ban. I have little reason to believe that the reason for passing it had anything to do with public safety.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

metroidfood

A. It's not Halloween, this was Improve Everywhere who staged this in New York in the middle of May.

B. How is a gathered protest in public different from walking around by yourself in public when it comes to wearing a mask? Suddenly, several people are doing it so it's okay?

Yeah because the law is specifically there monitoring it.. Seriously if you want to know what I mean.. Please go into a store and walk around public during fall wearing a ski mask.. Lets go see how far you get..

[QUOTE="DraugenCP"]

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"] It's Nazi-like. "Be like us or you're not worth rights!"Sajo7

Nice Godwin there, but there's a difference between mass-murdering people and sending back people obviously making a living off crime back to where they came from (and even paying them).

[QUOTE="metroidfood"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

The same reason why you can't wear Ski masks in public inless its Halloween or extremely environmental conditions..

sSubZerOo

You're right, it's not like we let other people get away with wearing masks in public...

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

So often I see around town, people dressed in ugly full body uncle sam or statue of liberty costumes. They're holding signs advertising nearby stores. You couldn't possibly identify them, even their height or gender, they are 100% covered. Is it there for illegal for them to do this and I should call the cops?

And no, they arn't on private property. They're usually standing right next to crosswalks and such.

[QUOTE="KlepticGrooves"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"] French values include personal liberty to hold whatever values you ****ing want.Theokhoth

Tell me if you can identify these people: Theokhoth

The second one was a Beatle.:P

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"] Tell me if you can identify these people: topsemag55

The second one was a Beatle.:P

I could only identify the first one. The Undertaker.

He's got magic powers. Just try and tell him to not cover his face! BAM! Lightning bolt to the face. He done it before!

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

[QUOTE="EdenProxy"] If I had there photo ids I could. Thers a diff between covering your eyes and hair and your entire body. EdenProxy

The law wasn't past for public safety concerns. It had to do with protecting "cultural identity."

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="metroidfood"]

You're right, it's not like we let other people get away with wearing masks in public...

Pixel-Pirate

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

So often I see around town, people dressed in ugly full body uncle sam or statue of liberty costumes. They're holding signs advertising nearby stores. You couldn't possibly identify them, even their height or gender, they are 100% covered. Is it there for illegal for them to do this and I should call the cops?

And no, they arn't on private property. They're usually standing right next to crosswalks and such.

Actually yeah if the mask is fully distorting their views they can be arrested or very least ticketed.. Police just don't bother enforcing it very often because its not a problem because most don't do it.. Inless its making people extremely nervours or your suspicious.. But yet again.. If this were true please spend the entire day walking around with a ski mask on.. You will be ticketed at very least in public..

[QUOTE="Pixel-Pirate"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

EdenProxy

So often I see around town, people dressed in ugly full body uncle sam or statue of liberty costumes. They're holding signs advertising nearby stores. You couldn't possibly identify them, even their height or gender, they are 100% covered. Is it there for illegal for them to do this and I should call the cops?

And no, they arn't on private property. They're usually standing right next to crosswalks and such.

Huh? What does that have to do with anything? They arn't banning it to prevent terror. You could just as easily commit terrorist acts in a statue of liberty costume as you could in a veil. And does that mean I can wear a veil if I stand in one area? But how will people be able to ID me?! :|

[QUOTE="GazaAli"]Now we begin to talk whatever we want. first the Quran says nothing about the veil. Second, I did not know majority means legitimacy. Third, I thought the west is about absolute freedom. Hexagon_777

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="KlepticGrooves"]Clearly the French disagree :?Hexagon_777

[QUOTE="metroidfood"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

A. It's not Halloween, this was Improve Everywhere who staged this in New York in the middle of May.

B. How is a gathered protest in public different from walking around by yourself in public when it comes to wearing a mask? Suddenly, several people are doing it so it's okay?

Yeah because the law is specifically there monitoring it.. Seriously if you want to know what I mean.. Please go into a store and walk around public during fall wearing a ski mask.. Lets go see how far you get..

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"] Tell me if you can identify these people Theokhoth

ARE YOU SERIOUSLY.. Trying to compare THOSE to which you can see half of their face to some of the more extreme versions of the veil..http://observers.france24.com/files/images/total.jpgIn which you can't even identifiy which sex they are? Or their eye color?

...................... What in the hell are you talking about? We are able to tell several facial features except their eyes.. We can tell what sex they are.. and numerous other characteristics.. You can't seriously be argueing that there is no difference between this? When a police artist sketches something, its going to be far more detailed then a person like the veil I showed you.. So yet again.. Not a good comparison..

[QUOTE="Pixel-Pirate"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

sSubZerOo

So often I see around town, people dressed in ugly full body uncle sam or statue of liberty costumes. They're holding signs advertising nearby stores. You couldn't possibly identify them, even their height or gender, they are 100% covered. Is it there for illegal for them to do this and I should call the cops?

And no, they arn't on private property. They're usually standing right next to crosswalks and such.

Actually yeah if the mask is fully distorting their views they can be arrested or very least ticketed.. Police just don't bother enforcing it very often because its not a problem because most don't do it.. Inless its making people extremely nervours or your suspicious.. But yet again.. If this were true please spend the entire day walking around with a ski mask on.. You will be ticketed at very least in public..

Then it must simply not be illegal where I live. Because people are PAID 50 dollars a day to stand out doing this. Companies hire people to, according to you, break the law in full public view on highly populated street corners where squad cars will constantly drive by and yet, for some reason, not ticket that person.

[QUOTE="DraugenCP"]

[QUOTE="GazaAli"] Absolute freedom as long as you are not hurting anyone around you. Look, I do not oppose the decision at all, its their country and their laws. But lets not justify things and say "We dont want shops to get robbed and whatnot" just admit its about fear of the Islamic culture and even the west is hypocritical at times.GazaAli

Frankly, playing the'bank robber' card is the only safe way of outlawing it since it's the only one that won't get you in trouble with EU legislation. This a small part of the problem, though. The essential problem is not 'fear', but the fact that women who wear these scarves are limiting themselves extremely within a society such as the French one. And in these times, we just can't allow that immigrants willingly exclude themselves and live at our expense.

Yes, women wearing burkas (so not veils in general) will probably not find a job if they insist on keeping on their burka on all occasions, not to mention that as being more hardline muslims they probably want to focus more on raising kids anyway.

[QUOTE="Pixel-Pirate"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

sSubZerOo

So often I see around town, people dressed in ugly full body uncle sam or statue of liberty costumes. They're holding signs advertising nearby stores. You couldn't possibly identify them, even their height or gender, they are 100% covered. Is it there for illegal for them to do this and I should call the cops?

And no, they arn't on private property. They're usually standing right next to crosswalks and such.

Actually yeah if the mask is fully distorting their views they can be arrested or very least ticketed..

[QUOTE="Pixel-Pirate"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

A) halloween costumes.. In which drum roll HALLOWEEN!! Thats right folks, if they want one day a year to wear it, well they can wear it on halloween like eevery one else!..

B) Thats Britain or another European area not the US.. Furthermore Its a gathered meeting/protest where you can do such things.. But like I said again in public if you walk around with a ski mask on, you will be breaking the law inless its either halloween, or time of extreme cold weather to which a ski mask is approriate.. But yeah keep going on with this..

sSubZerOo

So often I see around town, people dressed in ugly full body uncle sam or statue of liberty costumes. They're holding signs advertising nearby stores. You couldn't possibly identify them, even their height or gender, they are 100% covered. Is it there for illegal for them to do this and I should call the cops?

And no, they arn't on private property. They're usually standing right next to crosswalks and such.

Actually yeah if the mask is fully distorting their views they can be arrested or very least ticketed.. Police just don't bother enforcing it very often because its not a problem because most don't do it.. Inless its making people extremely nervours or your suspicious.. But yet again.. If this were true please spend the entire day walking around with a ski mask on.. You will be ticketed at very least in public..

Varies state by state, as well as local jurisdictions.

[QUOTE="GazaAli"][QUOTE="DraugenCP"]

Frankly, playing the'bank robber' card is the only safe way of outlawing it since it's the only one that won't get you in trouble with EU legislation. This a small part of the problem, though. The essential problem is not 'fear', but the fact that women who wear these scarves are limiting themselves extremely within a society such as the French one. And in these times, we just can't allow that immigrants willingly exclude themselves and live at our expense.

DraugenCP

Yes, women wearing burkas (so not veils in general) will probably not find a job if they insist on keeping on their burka on all occasions, not to mention that as being more hardline muslims they probably want to focus more on raising kids anyway.

Now we begin to talk whatever we want. first the Quran says nothing about the veil. Second, I did not know majority means legitimacy. Third, I thought the west is about absolute freedom. GazaAli

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]You're a bit extreme, aren't you? Killing people or banning whole religions is not the case here. That's in a whole other league. Banning an article of clothing in public is what we are talking about.

EdenProxy

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="Pixel-Pirate"]

So often I see around town, people dressed in ugly full body uncle sam or statue of liberty costumes. They're holding signs advertising nearby stores. You couldn't possibly identify them, even their height or gender, they are 100% covered. Is it there for illegal for them to do this and I should call the cops?

And no, they arn't on private property. They're usually standing right next to crosswalks and such.

Theokhoth

Actually yeah if the mask is fully distorting their views they can be arrested or very least ticketed..