Harvard University Confirms: 4th of July is Just Right-Wing Social Engineering

[QUOTE="lowkey254"][QUOTE="F1_2004"] yeah because one family is statistically significant :|GreySeal9

I bet they aren't, but you don't know that for sure. You'd have to run it through some statistical prodecures (like a t-test perhaps; well, no not a t-test since you'd be comparing alot of different ideologies) to test for statistical significance.

[QUOTE="F1_2004"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]My family always celebrated the 4th....and we're Democrats.:?lowkey254

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="lowkey254"] The stats listed aren't significant either. lowkey254

I bet they aren't, but you don't know that for sure. You'd have to run it through some statistical prodecures (like a t-test perhaps; well, no not a t-test since you'd be comparing alot of different ideologies) to test for statistical significance.

Yeah, it would.

I wish I had access to their data so I could run it through the prodecure. I think it would make this thread alot more interesting since I'd probably be accused of liberal bias. :P

[QUOTE="lowkey254"][QUOTE="F1_2004"] yeah because one family is statistically significant :|surrealnumber5

I'm pretty wary of the conclusion this study came to, but 2-4% can have stastical significance.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

Just because someone is saying something rudely doesn't suddenly transform their comments into something else.

GreySeal9

Oh boy. I'm not going to get into this crap with you.

Somebody I respect recommended, for my own sanity, that I stop repying to you, and I should have listened to them, so let's just drop it.

Yet another personal attack. Keep going. This is funny.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] Yet tone is very important to communication.SpartanMSU

Oh boy. I'm not going to get into this crap with you.

Somebody I respect recommended, for my own sanity, that I stop repying to you, and I should have listened to them, so let's just drop it.

Yet another personal attack. Keep going. This is funny.

I don't think you know what a personal attack is.

I'm just saying that I'm simply not going to get into it with him. I have wasted too much of my life going round and round and round and round and round with him over trivial crap.

To me, the Fourth of July is about reflecting on our Country, the great men and women who shaped it, and hope for a future that was as bright as the past. America has many, many problems right now, one of the bigger ones being how divided we are. But do you realize how far we have come in the years since our independence? Do you realize that it has been less than 250 years since we formed the country as it is known today? Compared to the rest of the world that is a drop in the bucket. Look at what we acheived in basically every field known to man in the span of 235 years..it is unbelievable. If being proud of our nations accomplishments and trying hard to be a productive member of its society makes me a Patriot then I am definitly guilty. Being a patriot doesn't mean you don't reconize that there are serious problems with our counrty, and it doesn't mean you don't respect anothers society or culture.

You're always going to have those people who scream that the 4th is nothing but a propaganda tool, or those cynical people who think patriotism isfor the "sheeple". But one thing I have always noticedabout our people, is that Americans for the most part cannot stand each other...until somethingreminds us that we are all in this together. Then the true United States of America comes out and does what needs to be done, before we overcome that obstacle and go back to hating each other!

So this might be super corny, but that is what I think about before the 4th is ruined by drunks and fireworks!Everycitizen of the United States of America should just take a minute to realize how fourtunatethey are to live in a Counrty as great asours. Because despite a multitude of flaws and problems, we are still a nation that millions of millions of people would do just about anything to be a part of, and for the most part we take that for granted

You're always going to have those people who scream that the 4th is nothing but a propaganda tool, or those cynical people who think patriotism isfor the "sheeple". But one thing I have always noticedabout our people, is that Americans for the most part cannot stand each other...until somethingreminds us that we are all in this together. Then the true United States of America comes out and does what needs to be done, before we overcome that obstacle and go back to hating each other!mission76

I get what you're saying, but where I differ is that I tend to think the whole world is in this together, so that what kind of nullifies patriotism to me personally.

But one thing I have always noticedabout our people, is that Americans for the most part cannot stand each other...until somethingreminds us that we are all in this together. Then the true United States of America comes out and does what needs to be done, before we overcome that obstacle and go back to hating each other!mission76

[QUOTE="mission76"]But one thing I have always noticedabout our people, is that Americans for the most part cannot stand each other...until somethingreminds us that we are all in this together. Then the true United States of America comes out and does what needs to be done, before we overcome that obstacle and go back to hating each other!kuraimen

So these countries you're talking about don't have patriotic ceremonies? :?

So, since they have the time to publish this stuff, I assume that they've already developed a cure for cancer, diabetes, obesity, and HIV right? :roll:

[QUOTE="mission76"]But one thing I have always noticedabout our people, is that Americans for the most part cannot stand each other...until somethingreminds us that we are all in this together. Then the true United States of America comes out and does what needs to be done, before we overcome that obstacle and go back to hating each other!kuraimen

http://www.hks.harvard.edu/fs/dyanagi/Research/FourthOfJuly.pdf the study, and i lol'd several times when reading it, it was almost as good as The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monstersurrealnumber5

Skimming over that study, it is rather flaky, but I still think people are overreacting to it.

[QUOTE="kuraimen"][QUOTE="mission76"]But one thing I have always noticedabout our people, is that Americans for the most part cannot stand each other...until somethingreminds us that we are all in this together. Then the true United States of America comes out and does what needs to be done, before we overcome that obstacle and go back to hating each other!GreySeal9

So these countries you're talking about don't have patriotic ceremonies? :?

[QUOTE="kuraimen"][QUOTE="mission76"]But one thing I have always noticedabout our people, is that Americans for the most part cannot stand each other...until somethingreminds us that we are all in this together. Then the true United States of America comes out and does what needs to be done, before we overcome that obstacle and go back to hating each other!sonicare

I don't know if the studies mean anything. Either way, the concept of patriotism is complete and utter nonsense.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="kuraimen"] That's actually one of the things I find more absurd about american patriotism. They do all this noise about how great is their country but internally they are like "I only care about me and it is my family against the world!" survival of the fittest kind of mentality. That's why I think it's a phony partriotism. Many other places are probably not as vocal as americans when they show "pride" for their country but I find them more patriotic in that they actually care and work together without having to resort to fireworks and Independence Day movies to boost their patriotism.kuraimen

So these countries you're talking about don't have patriotic ceremonies? :?

Some Americans hate eachother, just like some people in other countries bicker and are intolerant of one another.

Also, I see no evidence that Americans in general remind themselves of how patriotic they are on the 4th. I would guess that most people just see it as a holiday and an excuse to let their hair down. It's mostly the politicans that push the excessive patriotism angle.

Social engineering, no. A bunch of patriotic bull**** meant to inspire blind enthusiasm at best and jingoism at worst, yes. Frankly, I find patriotism to be a rather inane concept, basically being proud of something for the sake of being proud of it regardless of whether or not it's actually a good thing or a bad thing. It's nothing, though, that ****tacular summer blockbusters made by immature manchildren with hard-ons for angsty jerks who have a strictly linear moral compass don't do. The fouth is simply a Micheal Bay movie without an explicit narrative.

theone86

You're an inane concept.

I don't know if the studies mean anything. Either way, the concept of patriotism is complete and utter nonsense.

Barbariser

Here you go:

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]http://www.hks.harvard.edu/fs/dyanagi/Research/FourthOfJuly.pdf the study, and i lol'd several times when reading it, it was almost as good as The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti MonsterGreySeal9

Skimming over that study, it is rather flaky, but I still think people are overreacting to it.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]http://www.hks.harvard.edu/fs/dyanagi/Research/FourthOfJuly.pdf the study, and i lol'd several times when reading it, it was almost as good as The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monstersurrealnumber5

Skimming over that study, it is rather flaky, but I still think people are overreacting to it.

I still think it's an interesting question (whether the 4th influences politics at all), but yeah, the methodology is rather funky and he seems to be making leaps in logic. I'll give you that.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

Skimming over that study, it is rather flaky, but I still think people are overreacting to it.

GreySeal9

I still think it's an interesting question (whether the 4th influences politics at all), but yeah, the methodology is rather funky abd he seems to me making leaps in logic. I'll give you that.

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] i think any action to it is an overreaction, i am not sure if the study was made because some guy wanted to practice his math or troll but either way i found his justification and methodology laughable, but then again i feel this way about most studies that try to mathematically pin human action/reaction and/or opinion formation to a specific trait. hell the study even states that only 34% of the people they studied were republican, and for the effectiveness of the 4th they compared rained out attendance vs sunny and how people in those areas would have voted. even if there is a small correlation and even if i thought you could express human action in a formula i still would not be willing to state causation.

surrealnumber5

I still think it's an interesting question (whether the 4th influences politics at all), but yeah, the methodology is rather funky abd he seems to me making leaps in logic. I'll give you that.

Yeah, it would probably be more enlightening if approached from more of a psych/human behavior angle.

[QUOTE="kuraimen"][QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

So these countries you're talking about don't have patriotic ceremonies? :?

GreySeal9

Some Americans hate eachother, just like some people in other countries bicker and are intolerant of one another.

Also, I see no evidence that Americans in general remind themselves of how patriotic they are on the 4th. I would guess that most people just see it as a holiday and an excuse to let their hair down. It's mostly the politicans that push the excessive patriotism angle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFZrzg62Zj0

Doesn't EVERY country have an independence day? Whoop-de-****ing-do, Harvard.

So?

DON'T tell me this makes democrats want to ban INDEPENDENCE DAY of ALL things because it makes different politically minded people. SMH. You people are dumb. Facepalm worthy.

http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/washington-whispers/2011/06/30/harvard-july-4th-parades-are-right-wing

Click the link to read the story. Key points:

"There is no evidence of an increased likelihood of identifying as a Democrat, indicating that Fourth of July shifts preferences to the right rather than increasing political polarization," the two wrote.

The three key findings of those attending July 4th celebrations:

• When done before the age of 18, it increases the likelihood of a youth identifying as a Republican by at least 2 percent.
• It raises the likelihood that parade watchers will vote for a Republican candidate by 4 percent.
• It boosts the likelihood a reveler will vote by about 1 percent and increases the chances they'll make a political contribution by 3 percent.

Should we ban 4th of July celebrations?

moneymatterz

Really don't know what to say to that...