if you say chinas army is better than usa your are wrong

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Stevo_the_gamer

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#251 Stevo_the_gamer  Moderator
Member since 2004 • 50257 Posts

The French went bankrupt because of their support of the revolutionary war......look it upjointed

Yes, who doesn't know this. After that, there was a food shortage, which led to the bloodiest revolutions in human history. How is this relevant to the Colonists winning the Revolutionary War? France was already having money problems due to all the wars with England.

The US spent billions in rebuilding Europe that is true....a Europe they helped destroy, together with the british and the Russians....name one nation the US helped to "rebuild" after the war damage had been repaired...

I find this a bit humorous, due to I can't recall any other countries rebuilding other countries. I just recall seeing the United States rebuilding. Hell, the United States economy was the ONLY economy that wasn't crippled by the end of the war. The United States rebuild Europe's economy. Even years AFTER the bloody war, the United States gave help to the countries, but of course this was to fight off communism, but still, after all the damage was repaired, the United States still gave help to the countries.

The Noble America who helped the Europeans in the war agaisnt the Nazi is far from what it has become today

You're right, instead, we removed one of the worst dictators in history, but we still not noble. We still don't care. We didn't care about the genocide in Turkey. We didn't care about the genocide in Somalia. We didn't care about South Korea and Japan when North Korea tested its nuclear weapons. We didn't care about terrorism. You're right, the noble America is no longer present. The have never lost a hot war. Never. What we lose is the political wars; Vietnam, and Iraq.

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deactivated-5901ac91d8e33

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#252 deactivated-5901ac91d8e33
Member since 2004 • 17092 Posts
[QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"]

Jointed,

You have no idea what you are talking about.  There were several reasons why the english "lost" the revolutionary war - french support was far from the most important.  In fact, most of the revolutionary war was fought without the aid of the french.  It wasn't until the US colonists had won a few key battles that the french decided to assist.  The revolutionary war was a war of attrition on england fought a world away.  Just as there were english loyalists in the US, there were US sympathizers in England - the war was unpopular there.  The US military during those times was a bare rag tag militia.  It's main job wasn't to crush the english army but rather harass and keep the cause alive.

The only key battle that the french assisted in was the battle of yorktown, which happened to be the final straw that broke the camel's back.  If the french had not assisted, the war would have lasted longer, but the outcome was inevitable.

As far as rebuilding Europe, the US did spend billions of dollars rebuilding cities and economies across the war torn country.  We also lost hundreds of thousands of our men and women in liberating much of western europe from an oppressive nazi regime - a war that the US did not start and wanted no part of.  The only european nation ever to repay the US was the UK.  However, not only did the US help rebuild those economies, but it helped protect them against an aggressive Soviet bloc that was determined to spread its influence throught europe.  The US was there when help was needed whether it was in airlifting in supplies to besieged western berlin during a soviet embargo or giving billions in aids to struggling european countries emerging from economic collapse.

Now our country is going through a rough but short time with an unpopular government and policy.  After decades of goodwill, suddenly europe declares our country evil and lashes out with blind hate of everything american.  Not having the decency or the respect to separate their dislike of the current US government from the average US citizen.  Instead its just blind hate and ignorant bashing of all americans. 

sonicare

First of all I would like to tell you that I know what I'm talking about, very much so infact...

The French went bankrupt because of their support of the revolutionary war......look it up

The US spent billions in rebuilding Europe that is true....a Europe they helped destroy, together with the british and the Russians....name one nation the US helped to "rebuild" after the war damage had been repaired...

The Noble America who helped the Europeans in the war agaisnt the Nazi is far from what it has become today

A europe they helped to destroy?  It wasn't a war the US wanted to be in.  The allies had been trying to get the US to enter the war for quite sometime before December 7th, 1941.  How in any way was the US obligated to rebuild Europe?  "thanks for liberating us, but here's the bill?"

West Germany.

I'd still say that the current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose past foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today.  Look up the creation of palestine and israel and see who was responsible for that.  Look up the division of Pakistan and India as well - how did that happen, hmmmmm

West Germany were divided into 4 zones....1 controlled by the americans and they really never did anything to help it after the war rebuilding.....West Berlin is a whole other matter..

The current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose PAST foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today?????

Want to talk about past policies?

- You ended your the slavery in 1865!! and even then you had a god damned civil war about it!!!

- The bay of pigs, cuba

- Arming Iraq with weapons to use against Iran.....Arming Iran with weapons to use against Iraq

- Distributing weapons to warlords in Africa

- Dropping 2 nukes on civilian cities

The US were actually one of the nations who helped to create Israel......and who's it god damned ally as we speak!?

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mark4091

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#253 mark4091
Member since 2007 • 3780 Posts

If it was just hand to hand combat china would win hands down, and i'll tell you why they have certain cities or town where everyone in the town practices martial arts just so they can get in the millitary.dahwnpapaya

martial arts is more discipline then actual fighting moves and this is coming from a red belt, and thats the purpose of training in the army anyways, it really comes down to the fact that china does not have modern combat experience.

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#254 acegunslinger
Member since 2004 • 1223 Posts
[QUOTE="sonicare"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"]

Jointed,

You have no idea what you are talking about.  There were several reasons why the english "lost" the revolutionary war - french support was far from the most important.  In fact, most of the revolutionary war was fought without the aid of the french.  It wasn't until the US colonists had won a few key battles that the french decided to assist.  The revolutionary war was a war of attrition on england fought a world away.  Just as there were english loyalists in the US, there were US sympathizers in England - the war was unpopular there.  The US military during those times was a bare rag tag militia.  It's main job wasn't to crush the english army but rather harass and keep the cause alive.

The only key battle that the french assisted in was the battle of yorktown, which happened to be the final straw that broke the camel's back.  If the french had not assisted, the war would have lasted longer, but the outcome was inevitable.

As far as rebuilding Europe, the US did spend billions of dollars rebuilding cities and economies across the war torn country.  We also lost hundreds of thousands of our men and women in liberating much of western europe from an oppressive nazi regime - a war that the US did not start and wanted no part of.  The only european nation ever to repay the US was the UK.  However, not only did the US help rebuild those economies, but it helped protect them against an aggressive Soviet bloc that was determined to spread its influence throught europe.  The US was there when help was needed whether it was in airlifting in supplies to besieged western berlin during a soviet embargo or giving billions in aids to struggling european countries emerging from economic collapse.

Now our country is going through a rough but short time with an unpopular government and policy.  After decades of goodwill, suddenly europe declares our country evil and lashes out with blind hate of everything american.  Not having the decency or the respect to separate their dislike of the current US government from the average US citizen.  Instead its just blind hate and ignorant bashing of all americans. 

jointed

First of all I would like to tell you that I know what I'm talking about, very much so infact...

The French went bankrupt because of their support of the revolutionary war......look it up

The US spent billions in rebuilding Europe that is true....a Europe they helped destroy, together with the british and the Russians....name one nation the US helped to "rebuild" after the war damage had been repaired...

The Noble America who helped the Europeans in the war agaisnt the Nazi is far from what it has become today

A europe they helped to destroy?  It wasn't a war the US wanted to be in.  The allies had been trying to get the US to enter the war for quite sometime before December 7th, 1941.  How in any way was the US obligated to rebuild Europe?  "thanks for liberating us, but here's the bill?"

West Germany.

I'd still say that the current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose past foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today.  Look up the creation of palestine and israel and see who was responsible for that.  Look up the division of Pakistan and India as well - how did that happen, hmmmmm

West Germany were divided into 4 zones....1 controlled by the americans and they really never did anything to help it after the war rebuilding.....West Berlin is a whole other matter..

The current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose PAST foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today?????

Want to talk about past policies?

- You ended your the slavery in 1865!! and even then you had a god damned civil war about it!!!

- The bay of pigs, cuba

- Arming Iraq with weapons to use against Iran.....Arming Iran with weapons to use against Iraq

- Distributing weapons to warlords in Africa

- Dropping 2 nukes on civilian cities

The US were actually one of the nations who helped to create Israel......and who's it god damned ally as we speak!?

If Europe could've taken care of it's own problems then WWII would've never happened. Europe destroyed itself and the US ended up footing the bill. At least the US had the respectability to repay its debts after the Revolutionary War, something many European countries have yet to do for the Marshall Plan.
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trophylocoste

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#255 trophylocoste
Member since 2006 • 8454 Posts
i've never seen a fat chinese person in my life.GeForce2187
lol....omg thats ture
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#256 acegunslinger
Member since 2004 • 1223 Posts
[QUOTE="GeForce2187"]i've never seen a fat chinese person in my life.trophylocoste
lol....omg thats ture

*** WARNING: VIEW AT YOUR OWN RISK*** http://bbs.chinadaily.com.cn/attachments/month_0609/fat-chinese_ru118a1ClVAG.jpg
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freeze893

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#257 freeze893
Member since 2004 • 1382 Posts
ya u can be fat and still shoot a gun and china has already taken over they make like everything like my PC and umm my socks
Lief_Ericson
True. If we ever went to war with China, our economy would be devastated.
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deactivated-5901ac91d8e33

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#258 deactivated-5901ac91d8e33
Member since 2004 • 17092 Posts
[QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"]

Jointed,

You have no idea what you are talking about.  There were several reasons why the english "lost" the revolutionary war - french support was far from the most important.  In fact, most of the revolutionary war was fought without the aid of the french.  It wasn't until the US colonists had won a few key battles that the french decided to assist.  The revolutionary war was a war of attrition on england fought a world away.  Just as there were english loyalists in the US, there were US sympathizers in England - the war was unpopular there.  The US military during those times was a bare rag tag militia.  It's main job wasn't to crush the english army but rather harass and keep the cause alive.

The only key battle that the french assisted in was the battle of yorktown, which happened to be the final straw that broke the camel's back.  If the french had not assisted, the war would have lasted longer, but the outcome was inevitable.

As far as rebuilding Europe, the US did spend billions of dollars rebuilding cities and economies across the war torn country.  We also lost hundreds of thousands of our men and women in liberating much of western europe from an oppressive nazi regime - a war that the US did not start and wanted no part of.  The only european nation ever to repay the US was the UK.  However, not only did the US help rebuild those economies, but it helped protect them against an aggressive Soviet bloc that was determined to spread its influence throught europe.  The US was there when help was needed whether it was in airlifting in supplies to besieged western berlin during a soviet embargo or giving billions in aids to struggling european countries emerging from economic collapse.

Now our country is going through a rough but short time with an unpopular government and policy.  After decades of goodwill, suddenly europe declares our country evil and lashes out with blind hate of everything american.  Not having the decency or the respect to separate their dislike of the current US government from the average US citizen.  Instead its just blind hate and ignorant bashing of all americans. 

acegunslinger

First of all I would like to tell you that I know what I'm talking about, very much so infact...

The French went bankrupt because of their support of the revolutionary war......look it up

The US spent billions in rebuilding Europe that is true....a Europe they helped destroy, together with the british and the Russians....name one nation the US helped to "rebuild" after the war damage had been repaired...

The Noble America who helped the Europeans in the war agaisnt the Nazi is far from what it has become today

A europe they helped to destroy?  It wasn't a war the US wanted to be in.  The allies had been trying to get the US to enter the war for quite sometime before December 7th, 1941.  How in any way was the US obligated to rebuild Europe?  "thanks for liberating us, but here's the bill?"

West Germany.

I'd still say that the current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose past foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today.  Look up the creation of palestine and israel and see who was responsible for that.  Look up the division of Pakistan and India as well - how did that happen, hmmmmm

West Germany were divided into 4 zones....1 controlled by the americans and they really never did anything to help it after the war rebuilding.....West Berlin is a whole other matter..

The current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose PAST foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today?????

Want to talk about past policies?

- You ended your the slavery in 1865!! and even then you had a god damned civil war about it!!!

- The bay of pigs, cuba

- Arming Iraq with weapons to use against Iran.....Arming Iran with weapons to use against Iraq

- Distributing weapons to warlords in Africa

- Dropping 2 nukes on civilian cities

The US were actually one of the nations who helped to create Israel......and who's it god damned ally as we speak!?

If Europe could've taken care of it's own problems then WWII would've never happened. Europe destroyed itself and the US ended up footing the bill. At least the US had the respectability to repay its debts after the Revolutionary War, something many European countries have yet to do for the Marshall Plan.

Taken care of its own problems, how?

Yea the US ended up footing the bill..........because you lost 50 million people!!!!!

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acegunslinger

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#259 acegunslinger
Member since 2004 • 1223 Posts
[QUOTE="acegunslinger"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"]

Jointed,

You have no idea what you are talking about.  There were several reasons why the english "lost" the revolutionary war - french support was far from the most important.  In fact, most of the revolutionary war was fought without the aid of the french.  It wasn't until the US colonists had won a few key battles that the french decided to assist.  The revolutionary war was a war of attrition on england fought a world away.  Just as there were english loyalists in the US, there were US sympathizers in England - the war was unpopular there.  The US military during those times was a bare rag tag militia.  It's main job wasn't to crush the english army but rather harass and keep the cause alive.

The only key battle that the french assisted in was the battle of yorktown, which happened to be the final straw that broke the camel's back.  If the french had not assisted, the war would have lasted longer, but the outcome was inevitable.

As far as rebuilding Europe, the US did spend billions of dollars rebuilding cities and economies across the war torn country.  We also lost hundreds of thousands of our men and women in liberating much of western europe from an oppressive nazi regime - a war that the US did not start and wanted no part of.  The only european nation ever to repay the US was the UK.  However, not only did the US help rebuild those economies, but it helped protect them against an aggressive Soviet bloc that was determined to spread its influence throught europe.  The US was there when help was needed whether it was in airlifting in supplies to besieged western berlin during a soviet embargo or giving billions in aids to struggling european countries emerging from economic collapse.

Now our country is going through a rough but short time with an unpopular government and policy.  After decades of goodwill, suddenly europe declares our country evil and lashes out with blind hate of everything american.  Not having the decency or the respect to separate their dislike of the current US government from the average US citizen.  Instead its just blind hate and ignorant bashing of all americans. 

jointed

First of all I would like to tell you that I know what I'm talking about, very much so infact...

The French went bankrupt because of their support of the revolutionary war......look it up

The US spent billions in rebuilding Europe that is true....a Europe they helped destroy, together with the british and the Russians....name one nation the US helped to "rebuild" after the war damage had been repaired...

The Noble America who helped the Europeans in the war agaisnt the Nazi is far from what it has become today

A europe they helped to destroy?  It wasn't a war the US wanted to be in.  The allies had been trying to get the US to enter the war for quite sometime before December 7th, 1941.  How in any way was the US obligated to rebuild Europe?  "thanks for liberating us, but here's the bill?"

West Germany.

I'd still say that the current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose past foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today.  Look up the creation of palestine and israel and see who was responsible for that.  Look up the division of Pakistan and India as well - how did that happen, hmmmmm

West Germany were divided into 4 zones....1 controlled by the americans and they really never did anything to help it after the war rebuilding.....West Berlin is a whole other matter..

The current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose PAST foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today?????

Want to talk about past policies?

- You ended your the slavery in 1865!! and even then you had a god damned civil war about it!!!

- The bay of pigs, cuba

- Arming Iraq with weapons to use against Iran.....Arming Iran with weapons to use against Iraq

- Distributing weapons to warlords in Africa

- Dropping 2 nukes on civilian cities

The US were actually one of the nations who helped to create Israel......and who's it god damned ally as we speak!?

If Europe could've taken care of it's own problems then WWII would've never happened. Europe destroyed itself and the US ended up footing the bill. At least the US had the respectability to repay its debts after the Revolutionary War, something many European countries have yet to do for the Marshall Plan.

Taken care of its own problems, how?

Yea the US ended up footing the bill..........because you lost 50 million people!!!!!

England and France's appeasement policy towards Hitler allowed Germany to grow extremely powerful. What do you mean by 50 million?
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deactivated-5901ac91d8e33

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#260 deactivated-5901ac91d8e33
Member since 2004 • 17092 Posts
[QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="acegunslinger"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"]

Jointed,

You have no idea what you are talking about.  There were several reasons why the english "lost" the revolutionary war - french support was far from the most important.  In fact, most of the revolutionary war was fought without the aid of the french.  It wasn't until the US colonists had won a few key battles that the french decided to assist.  The revolutionary war was a war of attrition on england fought a world away.  Just as there were english loyalists in the US, there were US sympathizers in England - the war was unpopular there.  The US military during those times was a bare rag tag militia.  It's main job wasn't to crush the english army but rather harass and keep the cause alive.

The only key battle that the french assisted in was the battle of yorktown, which happened to be the final straw that broke the camel's back.  If the french had not assisted, the war would have lasted longer, but the outcome was inevitable.

As far as rebuilding Europe, the US did spend billions of dollars rebuilding cities and economies across the war torn country.  We also lost hundreds of thousands of our men and women in liberating much of western europe from an oppressive nazi regime - a war that the US did not start and wanted no part of.  The only european nation ever to repay the US was the UK.  However, not only did the US help rebuild those economies, but it helped protect them against an aggressive Soviet bloc that was determined to spread its influence throught europe.  The US was there when help was needed whether it was in airlifting in supplies to besieged western berlin during a soviet embargo or giving billions in aids to struggling european countries emerging from economic collapse.

Now our country is going through a rough but short time with an unpopular government and policy.  After decades of goodwill, suddenly europe declares our country evil and lashes out with blind hate of everything american.  Not having the decency or the respect to separate their dislike of the current US government from the average US citizen.  Instead its just blind hate and ignorant bashing of all americans. 

acegunslinger

First of all I would like to tell you that I know what I'm talking about, very much so infact...

The French went bankrupt because of their support of the revolutionary war......look it up

The US spent billions in rebuilding Europe that is true....a Europe they helped destroy, together with the british and the Russians....name one nation the US helped to "rebuild" after the war damage had been repaired...

The Noble America who helped the Europeans in the war agaisnt the Nazi is far from what it has become today

A europe they helped to destroy?  It wasn't a war the US wanted to be in.  The allies had been trying to get the US to enter the war for quite sometime before December 7th, 1941.  How in any way was the US obligated to rebuild Europe?  "thanks for liberating us, but here's the bill?"

West Germany.

I'd still say that the current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose past foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today.  Look up the creation of palestine and israel and see who was responsible for that.  Look up the division of Pakistan and India as well - how did that happen, hmmmmm

West Germany were divided into 4 zones....1 controlled by the americans and they really never did anything to help it after the war rebuilding.....West Berlin is a whole other matter..

The current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose PAST foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today?????

Want to talk about past policies?

- You ended your the slavery in 1865!! and even then you had a god damned civil war about it!!!

- The bay of pigs, cuba

- Arming Iraq with weapons to use against Iran.....Arming Iran with weapons to use against Iraq

- Distributing weapons to warlords in Africa

- Dropping 2 nukes on civilian cities

The US were actually one of the nations who helped to create Israel......and who's it god damned ally as we speak!?

If Europe could've taken care of it's own problems then WWII would've never happened. Europe destroyed itself and the US ended up footing the bill. At least the US had the respectability to repay its debts after the Revolutionary War, something many European countries have yet to do for the Marshall Plan.

Taken care of its own problems, how?

Yea the US ended up footing the bill..........because you lost 50 million people!!!!!

Europe's appeasement policy towards Hitler 50 million...?

So we should have just invaded Germany?

We lost 50 million people in that war so don't tell me that you ended up footing the bill..........The US lost close to NONE civillians! Ofcourse you ended up to be a world superpower when the american main land was untouched

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#261 tycoonmike
Member since 2005 • 6082 Posts
[QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]- If it wasn't for the United States, you would be speaking German(If you are European, African, Middle-Eastern)Granted, but I am not speaking of the past, I am speaking of the present. - The United States gave billions of dollars to help rebuild countries after World War II.Which basically enslaves Europe to us - The United States is the founding member the United Nations. Which the US uses to further its own political causes- The United States created the United Nations Security Council.See quote above - The United States has Hollywood,Bunch of hypocrites and idiots though they are, no culture found there Rock n' Roll,Granted, but music is only one part of a culture Sports are a national pastime.Overpaid lot that they are, no culture found in overpaying they who play a game for a living - Anyone in the US can be rich, or can be poor.Agreed - Anyone has the ability to go to College, if you can't afford it, there are plenty of loans you can get, or join the military.College doesn't guarantee a career - Emancipation.Affirmative Action, though that's another topic - Universal SufferageTell that to the electoral college, our votes don't mean squat - Free Speech Nope, if we had free speech the news wouldn't demonize the anti-war protesters - Free Religion Yeah, so long as you're a Christian, you aren't demonized- Environmentalism HA! Dont make me laugh! The US has far more to lose if we were environmentalists!


So far as I'm concerned, you haven't really proved your point. Then again, this isn't about the US culture-wise, this is a debate about how China's army may or may not be better than the US's army.
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#262 nazaric
Member since 2005 • 2026 Posts
Chinese people will never rule the World. Europeans 4ever!slackersunited
FTW
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#263 tycoonmike
Member since 2005 • 6082 Posts
[QUOTE="LukeAF24"][QUOTE="bt_the_great_78"]This is becoming another laughable anti-American thread.bt_the_great_78
You never cease to amuse me bt. :D

It gets old, brother. You can't have a mature discussion on here without someone butting in to stupidly unload their personal frustrations in the form of mindless anti-American b.s.

Oh, I'm so sorry that we're allowed to have our own opinions. I don't care if you think it's butting in to stupidly unload their personal frustrations in the form of mindless anti-American bs, but then again, that's how things change. Are you for the status quo, because it's the status quo makes us soft and weak.
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#264 LJS9502_basic
Member since 2003 • 180302 Posts
[QUOTE="Lief_Ericson"]ya u can be fat and still shoot a gun and china has already taken over they make like everything like my PC and umm my socks
freeze893
True. If we ever went to war with China, our economy would be devastated.

What do you think would happen to their economy?
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#265 tycoonmike
Member since 2005 • 6082 Posts

Those points you listed are hardly evil and are common flaws of western governments.

1. Capitalism - The US did not invent that system. Yes it has flaws and imperfections, but I still prefer it to other forms such as communism.

Agreed, but you would prefer inequality to equality?

2. Slow to act? - compared to whom? If anything, we are too fast of a responder.

Ok, wise guy, I said the wrong thing, I meant fast to act. I'll change the original now.

3. Government acting despite the lack of support? - Did you pay attention to the elections of 06? That was a referendum on what happens when elected officials don't listen to the people -> they get voted out of office.

Yeah, and I also pay attention to the war in Iraq and how around only 35% support it. The elected officials aren't listening to the people. Does that mean they all should be out of office?

4. Affirmative Action - I don't know what this has to do with your argument. This was a system that was designed to give disadvantaged minorities better access to education and job opportunities. That's hardly evil.

Yeah, it's also racist vs. whites. Two wrongs don't make a right, I'm afraid.

5. Nationalistic citizens - you have those people in every country. Foreign nations just like to highlight ours because it makes it easier to blindly hate on the US.

And yet there are plenty of people like that on here who wouldn't bother to say a single bad thing about the USA if communists were holding their families hostage. People who criticize the USA are the people that actually recognize the faults of our govenrnment.

6. Lack of Culture - I strongly disagree. There is a strong american culture despite the youth of our nation.

Yeah, the music is crap, Hollywood is full of scandal and everyone wants to be just like the actors. The news is obsessed with crime, scandal, and disaster and not on what really matters, the family unit is breaking down, even they with culture, the Native Americans, were and are being supressed.

7. Lack of Fairness - Unlike other nations, our population is not homogenous. With diversity comes conflict. Yet despite that, I think our country has made progress. We have laws and protections for all groups and legal systems that try to enforce those rights. Discrimination exists and will continue to exist whenever you have two differing gropus.

8. Government corruption - No crap. Most governments are corrupt. Ours is far from the most, and is also policed by the population, the press, and the opposing parties.

Population- No politician cares about the public, only what will make him or her the most money.

Press- Controlled by big business.

Opposing parties- Who are made up of the corrupt politicians. For every one good politician you have nine who are corrupt.

9. Hypocricy - There is no true democracy. We are a representative democracy - it would be impossible to run a true democracy with the size of our country. It's impossible to consult every person in the country regarding state affairs.

And yet anyone can vote who is over the age of 18. It is possible to consult every person in the country, but every person in the country doesn't wish to spend 20 minutes of their time and give their opinion. It isn't the state's fault that the people don't give their opinion, it's the people's fault.

You're reasons have been debunked. Thanks for playing.

sonicare

Your reactions, minus number seven, have been debunked. Thanks for playing as well.
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CaptHawkeye

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#266 CaptHawkeye
Member since 2004 • 13977 Posts
[QUOTE="sonicare"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"]

Jointed,

You have no idea what you are talking about.  There were several reasons why the english "lost" the revolutionary war - french support was far from the most important.  In fact, most of the revolutionary war was fought without the aid of the french.  It wasn't until the US colonists had won a few key battles that the french decided to assist.  The revolutionary war was a war of attrition on england fought a world away.  Just as there were english loyalists in the US, there were US sympathizers in England - the war was unpopular there.  The US military during those times was a bare rag tag militia.  It's main job wasn't to crush the english army but rather harass and keep the cause alive.

The only key battle that the french assisted in was the battle of yorktown, which happened to be the final straw that broke the camel's back.  If the french had not assisted, the war would have lasted longer, but the outcome was inevitable.

As far as rebuilding Europe, the US did spend billions of dollars rebuilding cities and economies across the war torn country.  We also lost hundreds of thousands of our men and women in liberating much of western europe from an oppressive nazi regime - a war that the US did not start and wanted no part of.  The only european nation ever to repay the US was the UK.  However, not only did the US help rebuild those economies, but it helped protect them against an aggressive Soviet bloc that was determined to spread its influence throught europe.  The US was there when help was needed whether it was in airlifting in supplies to besieged western berlin during a soviet embargo or giving billions in aids to struggling european countries emerging from economic collapse.

Now our country is going through a rough but short time with an unpopular government and policy.  After decades of goodwill, suddenly europe declares our country evil and lashes out with blind hate of everything american.  Not having the decency or the respect to separate their dislike of the current US government from the average US citizen.  Instead its just blind hate and ignorant bashing of all americans. 

jointed

First of all I would like to tell you that I know what I'm talking about, very much so infact...

The French went bankrupt because of their support of the revolutionary war......look it up

The US spent billions in rebuilding Europe that is true....a Europe they helped destroy, together with the british and the Russians....name one nation the US helped to "rebuild" after the war damage had been repaired...

The Noble America who helped the Europeans in the war agaisnt the Nazi is far from what it has become today

A europe they helped to destroy?  It wasn't a war the US wanted to be in.  The allies had been trying to get the US to enter the war for quite sometime before December 7th, 1941.  How in any way was the US obligated to rebuild Europe?  "thanks for liberating us, but here's the bill?"

West Germany.

I'd still say that the current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose past foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today.  Look up the creation of palestine and israel and see who was responsible for that.  Look up the division of Pakistan and India as well - how did that happen, hmmmmm

West Germany were divided into 4 zones....1 controlled by the americans and they really never did anything to help it after the war rebuilding.....West Berlin is a whole other matter..

The current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose PAST foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today?????

Want to talk about past policies?

- You ended your the slavery in 1865!! and even then you had a god damned civil war about it!!!

I don't see how fighting for freedom is something to hold against a country. Also, the "IT TOOK AMERICANS TILL 1865 TO GET RID OF SLAVERY" is absolute bull. The European nations had slavery for thousands of years.

- The bay of pigs, cuba

And you think the US is the only country in the world which has launched unwarrented invasions?

- Arming Iraq with weapons to use against Iran.....Arming Iran with weapons to use against Iraq

Something the French, British, Russians, Chinese, and a host of other countries do as well.

- Distributing weapons to warlords in Africa

Read above.

- Dropping 2 nukes on civilian cities

Hiroshima and Nagasaki were two of Japan's biggest military supply depots since the Meiji restoration. But I swear to god if this thread devolves into a "warrented nukes" discussion I will have to start killing innocent kittens.

The US were actually one of the nations who helped to create Israel......and who's it god damned ally as we speak!?

Your point?

So not only are you arguably the most ignorant person i've ever seen on Gamespot, but you also lied straight faced about your anti american agenda, nice.

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LJS9502_basic

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#267 LJS9502_basic
Member since 2003 • 180302 Posts
[QUOTE="sonicare"]

Those points you listed are hardly evil and are common flaws of western governments.

1. Capitalism - The US did not invent that system. Yes it has flaws and imperfections, but I still prefer it to other forms such as communism.

Agreed, but you would prefer inequality to equality?

If you want to achieve something you should work for it.....it's inequality to be given something for nothing.

2. Slow to act? - compared to whom? If anything, we are too fast of a responder.

Ok, wise guy, I said the wrong thing, I meant fast to act. I'll change the original now.

Confused?

3. Government acting despite the lack of support? - Did you pay attention to the elections of 06? That was a referendum on what happens when elected officials don't listen to the people -> they get voted out of office.

Yeah, and I also pay attention to the war in Iraq and how around only 35% support it. The elected officials aren't listening to the people. Does that mean they all should be out of office?

Too many people were for the war initially, now it's too complicated to just pull out.

4. Affirmative Action - I don't know what this has to do with your argument. This was a system that was designed to give disadvantaged minorities better access to education and job opportunities. That's hardly evil.

Yeah, it's also racist vs. whites. Two wrongs don't make a right, I'm afraid.

Unfortunately, it's hard to find a system that will make everyone happy. 

5. Nationalistic citizens - you have those people in every country. Foreign nations just like to highlight ours because it makes it easier to blindly hate on the US.

And yet there are plenty of people like that on here who wouldn't bother to say a single bad thing about the USA if communists were holding their families hostage. People who criticize the USA are the people that actually recognize the faults of our govenrnment.

Recognizing faults and constant bashing are two entirely different things.

6. Lack of Culture - I strongly disagree. There is a strong american culture despite the youth of our nation.

Yeah, the music is crap, Hollywood is full of scandal and everyone wants to be just like the actors. The news is obsessed with crime, scandal, and disaster and not on what really matters, the family unit is breaking down, even they with culture, the Native Americans, were and are being supressed.

Entertainment is not American culture....every state and every city has it's own.  Is it too hard to look for the good....would that upset your world?

7. Lack of Fairness - Unlike other nations, our population is not homogenous. With diversity comes conflict. Yet despite that, I think our country has made progress. We have laws and protections for all groups and legal systems that try to enforce those rights. Discrimination exists and will continue to exist whenever you have two differing gropus.

8. Government corruption - No crap. Most governments are corrupt. Ours is far from the most, and is also policed by the population, the press, and the opposing parties.

Population- No politician cares about the public, only what will make him or her the most money.

Press- Controlled by big business.

Opposing parties- Who are made up of the corrupt politicians. For every one good politician you have nine who are corrupt.

What government doesn't have those problems?

9. Hypocricy - There is no true democracy. We are a representative democracy - it would be impossible to run a true democracy with the size of our country. It's impossible to consult every person in the country regarding state affairs.

And yet anyone can vote who is over the age of 18. It is possible to consult every person in the country, but every person in the country doesn't wish to spend 20 minutes of their time and give their opinion. It isn't the state's fault that the people don't give their opinion, it's the people's fault.

Point?

You're reasons have been debunked. Thanks for playing.

tycoonmike


Your reactions, minus number seven, have been debunked. Thanks for playing as well.

Your points don't hold up.  Constructive criticism is fine........you just criticized. 

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CaptHawkeye

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#268 CaptHawkeye
Member since 2004 • 13977 Posts

[QUOTE="bt_the_great_78"]This is becoming another laughable anti-American thread.tycoonmike
Then explain to me why America is so great? I can tell you why America is evil:

- Capitalism

And you think Socialism or Communism are perfect? Where have you been?
- It's fast to act

It isn't, actually. Nor is it supposed to be, the government is supposed to deliberate and argue with itself. Democracy is about debate.
- The government acting despite the lack of support among the populace

What is your definition of support? You do realize it's impossible for any country to get 100% support form its populace on any issue right?
- Capitalism

I get it, you hate Capitalism.
- Affirmative Action (though that's another topic)

Indeed.
- Overly Nationalistic citizens ruining our credibility among the other nations

A problem yes, but again, what makes you think the US is the only country in the world with this problem?
- Capitalism

Your maturity is going down, fast.
- Lack of culture (except for the Native Americans)

What the? You consider this a problem? Christ, and I thought my mother was overcultured.
- Lack of fairness among the people of the populace

What do you mean by this?
- Government corruption while the people do nothing about it

Because it isn't as corrupt as you think. Mass corruption in the US government doesn't really even fit into Occam's Razor. Mass incompetance and panic do though.
- Hypocracy (we are the stronghold of democracy and yet we aren't even a true democracy)

Ouch, someone made a opinionated statement and that's evidence enough to consider the entire US hypocritical.

Need I go on?

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tycoonmike

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#269 tycoonmike
Member since 2005 • 6082 Posts
[QUOTE="tycoonmike"][QUOTE="sonicare"]

Those points you listed are hardly evil and are common flaws of western governments.

1. Capitalism - The US did not invent that system. Yes it has flaws and imperfections, but I still prefer it to other forms such as communism.

Agreed, but you would prefer inequality to equality?

If you want to achieve something you should work for it.....it's inequality to be given something for nothing.

Agreed. It's also unfair for the person who works hard all his life to be stuck in a dead end job while they who do squat advance or are rich. Solution? To actually reward they who actually work for a living and let the deadbeats continue to be deadbeats, just don't reward them for being deadbeats.

2. Slow to act? - compared to whom? If anything, we are too fast of a responder.

Ok, wise guy, I said the wrong thing, I meant fast to act. I'll change the original now.

Confused?

I thought fast to act, I wrote slow to act, I was too slow to act upon my mistake.

3. Government acting despite the lack of support? - Did you pay attention to the elections of 06? That was a referendum on what happens when elected officials don't listen to the people -> they get voted out of office.

Yeah, and I also pay attention to the war in Iraq and how around only 35% support it. The elected officials aren't listening to the people. Does that mean they all should be out of office?

Too many people were for the war initially, now it's too complicated to just pull out.

I agree that it would be complicated, but then again, that's the will of the people, and according to his logic, the will of the people is that the war is ended. According to him, the politicians who support the war should be kicked out of office for not following the will of the people. Solution? According to him, kick Pres. Bush out of office.

4. Affirmative Action - I don't know what this has to do with your argument. This was a system that was designed to give disadvantaged minorities better access to education and job opportunities. That's hardly evil.

Yeah, it's also racist vs. whites. Two wrongs don't make a right, I'm afraid.

Unfortunately, it's hard to find a system that will make everyone happy.

Agreed.

5. Nationalistic citizens - you have those people in every country. Foreign nations just like to highlight ours because it makes it easier to blindly hate on the US.

And yet there are plenty of people like that on here who wouldn't bother to say a single bad thing about the USA if communists were holding their families hostage. People who criticize the USA are the people that actually recognize the faults of our govenrnment.

Recognizing faults and constant bashing are two entirely different things.

:| I don't constantly bash the USA. It does its share of good in the world, it's just that its evils sometime overshadow its good. Solution? Recognize all faults, not just some.

6. Lack of Culture - I strongly disagree. There is a strong american culture despite the youth of our nation.

Yeah, the music is crap, Hollywood is full of scandal and everyone wants to be just like the actors. The news is obsessed with crime, scandal, and disaster and not on what really matters, the family unit is breaking down, even they with culture, the Native Americans, were and are being supressed.

Entertainment is not American culture....every state and every city has it's own. Is it too hard to look for the good....would that upset your world?

No, it wouldn't upset my world, I look for the good wherever I go, and yet, when I look to the USA, I see more evil than good. Solution? Explain to me what is the American culture, without using a term like "melting pot" or "salad bowl." though not here, as this thread is reserved for the debate as to who has the better army, China or the US.

7. Lack of Fairness - Unlike other nations, our population is not homogenous. With diversity comes conflict. Yet despite that, I think our country has made progress. We have laws and protections for all groups and legal systems that try to enforce those rights. Discrimination exists and will continue to exist whenever you have two differing gropus.

8. Government corruption - No crap. Most governments are corrupt. Ours is far from the most, and is also policed by the population, the press, and the opposing parties.

Population- No politician cares about the public, only what will make him or her the most money.

Press- Controlled by big business.

Opposing parties- Who are made up of the corrupt politicians. For every one good politician you have nine who are corrupt.

What government doesn't have those problems?

I'm not saying all government doesn't, but if the people would realize this, they could be wiped out, instead they are brainwashed into thinking they can't change the world they live in. Solution? Educate the populace about corruption and use the populace to stamp it out.

9. Hypocricy - There is no true democracy. We are a representative democracy - it would be impossible to run a true democracy with the size of our country. It's impossible to consult every person in the country regarding state affairs.

And yet anyone can vote who is over the age of 18. It is possible to consult every person in the country, but every person in the country doesn't wish to spend 20 minutes of their time and give their opinion. It isn't the state's fault that the people don't give their opinion, it's the people's fault.

Point?

My point being that a government can consult the populace, it does it every year there's an election, but if the people don't want to be consulted, they don't vote.

You're reasons have been debunked. Thanks for playing.

LJS9502_basic


Your reactions, minus number seven, have been debunked. Thanks for playing as well.

Your points don't hold up. Constructive criticism is fine........you just criticized.


Then I have explained them further. I have also given you a solution to the responses I deemed it necessary for a solution, in a perfect world, mind you. There is no such thing as a perfect world.

And with that, I'm done with this argument. You (all) can give me evidence as to why my opinion is wrong, and I can give you evidence as to why your opinion(s) is/are wrong, and neither side is going to change them because of a debate on an anonymous internet forum site. You have my opinions, and that's all I can give you, been nice debating with you (all).
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OODALOOP

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#270 OODALOOP
Member since 2004 • 36350 Posts
Ask for evidence and support for why China's military is superior and you get trite anti-American nonsense. If you hate this country so much, I've got to wonder what keeps you here. I can't say I like the idea that my tax dollars provide you with services, nor do I like the thought that my friends protect your freedoms. You should take the bad attitude to Sierre Leone. Maybe after some growing up, you'll appreciate the things you never realized you had.
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tycoonmike

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#271 tycoonmike
Member since 2005 • 6082 Posts
Ask for evidence and support for why China's military is superior and you get trite anti-American nonsense. If you hate this country so much, I've got to wonder what keeps you here. I can't say I like the idea that my tax dollars provide you with services, nor do I like the thought that my friends protect your freedoms. You should take the bad attitude to Sierre Leone. Maybe after some growing up, you'll appreciate the things you never realized you had.bt_the_great_78

Oh really? You made it into an anti-American thread by proclaiming it to be an anti-American thread. Had you not said, this, I wouldn't have gone off on a rant against America, thus the thread wouldn't have become that which you proclaimed it to be. If you had gone off in an anti-American rant, I can guarantee you I would have gone off on a pro-America rant, so you can just thank yourself for making it into what you clearly hate.

Your friends protect my freedoms to complain, as the military did during every single war ever fought by America. If I do not have that freedom, then please, show me where in the Constitution or in the Bill of Rights where it says this. Otherwise I will continue complaining, because it is that freedom, the ability to whine and complain about the government and its idiocy, that makes this country great.

I gave you the evidence of past battles to support why China's army is better than America's, in some ways, because of numbers, which I used in threads past and present. You obviously ignored it.

Oh, and before you tell me to grow up, fix your spelling. It's SierrA Leone.
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OODALOOP

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#272 OODALOOP
Member since 2004 • 36350 Posts
Oh really? You made it into an anti-American thread by proclaiming it to be an anti-American thread. Had you not said, this, I wouldn't have gone off on a rant against America, thus the thread wouldn't have become that which you proclaimed it to be. If you had gone off in an anti-American rant, I can guarantee you I would have gone off on a pro-America rant, so you can just thank yourself for making it into what you clearly hate.tycoonmike
Are you seriously trying to tell me that I forced you to be an idiot? [QUOTE="tycoonmike"] Your friends protect my freedoms to complain, as the military did during every single war ever fought by America. If I do not have that freedom, then please, show me where in the Constitution or in the Bill of Rights where it says this. Otherwise I will continue complaining, because it is that freedom, the ability to whine and complain about the government and its idiocy, that makes this country great.

Yes, freedom of speech exists. Constructive criticism, even when it's not what is easy to always hear is a great thing. Whining about how the country sucks and doing nothing, however, is not something I ever considered I was fighting to provide you with. No one ever suggested you weren't free to be a do-nothing complainer. I merely wondered why you would want to stay in a place you didn't like. Be my guest and lay around and feel sorry for yourself.
I gave you the evidence of past battles to support why China's army is better than America's, in some ways, because of numbers, which I used in threads past and present. You obviously ignored it.tycoonmike
You have provided nothing but unsupported (and foolish) claims.
Oh, and before you tell me to grow up, fix your spelling. It's SierrA Leone.
tycoonmike
Thanks for the tip. I can imagine how pointing out a typo must have given you small thrill.
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thotoz

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#273 thotoz
Member since 2006 • 941 Posts
chinese people have bad aim because they can't..:)
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1337_ownage

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#274 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts
sure chinas ground force are bigger but thats only because they have 1billion people
plus most of there hardware is still lagging behind it basically
a 300 lb fat man versus a 250 pound man whos is in shape and is all muscle

cliffs: us>china
MrJesusisnthere


WRONG!!!!
1 billion will own this country
they have secert melitary weapons...that you dont kno about
PFFFTTT iyea chinese are fat and big ass burger eatin tube of lards called americans are skinny [sarcastic]
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1337_ownage

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#275 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts
oh i dont mean to be offensive on my earlier post.....but ive never seen a fat chinese....not half chinese i mean a full chinese
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Vampyronight

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#276 Vampyronight
Member since 2002 • 3933 Posts
It's funny- over 170 posts ago, I pretty much proved that China is a non-factor in any large scale war, yet we still have people that cling to the argument that China could win due to a larger military. It's funny- not one pro-China person even attempted to rebuff my arguments, instead going on tangents about unrelated history/blatant ant-Americanism. For every military that won with a larger army, there was one that won with a smaller one. The point? Size of the military has no correlation with who wins a war. Now, let's focus on the only realistic battle scenario: an invasion of Taiwan, with the US coming to its aid. If you think there's another one, I'd love to hear it, but this is pretty much the only one. Oh, and by the way, for all of those who believe this war is impossible- believe it. China WILL attack Taiwan one day. But you have to remember- the US doesn't need to INVADE China to win this war, just keep China away from Taiwan. It takes far more units to attack, and even more when its a naval invasion. China not only lacks the naval capability (not just to compete with the US on the water, but they don't even ships that could carry massive numbers of soldiers over), but the sheer numbers that would be required would be far greater than China could muster. Then again, it always comes back to the fact that to fight a war, you need a total war machine. You need soldiers, technology, supporting roles (building the guns/tanks), and resources. If you lack any of these in any meaningful way, the war is over. As I pointed out in my first post, the Malacca Straits would be secured easily by the US Navy, which would cut off the majority of China's oil supplies thus crippling any war effort. Even if you believe they could conscript 350 million soldiers (they can't), it won't make a difference if you can't power the tanks to fight the war or the factories that produce the tools of war.
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1337_ownage

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#277 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts
chinese people have bad aim because they can't..:)thotoz


**** YOU
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1337_ownage

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#278 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts
[QUOTE="Vampyronight"]It's funny- over 170 posts ago, I pretty much proved that China is a non-factor in any large scale war, yet we still have people that cling to the argument that China could win due to a larger military. It's funny- not one pro-China person even attempted to rebuff my arguments, instead going on tangents about unrelated history/blatant ant-Americanism. For every military that won with a larger army, there was one that won with a smaller one. The point? Size of the military has no correlation with who wins a war. Now, let's focus on the only realistic battle scenario: an invasion of Taiwan, with the US coming to its aid. If you think there's another one, I'd love to hear it, but this is pretty much the only one. Oh, and by the way, for all of those who believe this war is impossible- believe it. China WILL attack Taiwan one day. But you have to remember- the US doesn't need to INVADE China to win this war, just keep China away from Taiwan. It takes far more units to attack, and even more when its a naval invasion. China not only lacks the naval capability (not just to compete with the US on the water, but they don't even ships that could carry massive numbers of soldiers over), but the sheer numbers that would be required would be far greater than China could muster. Then again, it always comes back to the fact that to fight a war, you need a total war machine. You need soldiers, technology, supporting roles (building the guns/tanks), and resources. If you lack any of these in any meaningful way, the war is over. As I pointed out in my first post, the Malacca Straits would be secured easily by the US Navy, which would cut off the majority of China's oil supplies thus crippling any war effort. Even if you believe they could conscript 350 million soldiers (they can't), it won't make a difference if you can't power the tanks to fight the war or the factories that produce the tools of war.



they always have to get into peoples buisnees dont they............they get into every war they can......and china can cut off US supply and watch the use burn to the ground.

AND CHINA DESERVES TO OWN TAIWAN!! CHINA FTW

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Vampyronight

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#279 Vampyronight
Member since 2002 • 3933 Posts
oh i dont mean to be offensive on my earlier post.....but ive never seen a fat chinese....not half chinese i mean a full chinese1337_ownage
There's frequently reports in Chinese newspapers/China's news shows about the growing epidemic of obesity in this country. Not as bad as the US, easily, but in the cities, I have seen plenty of fat Chinese people. Here's a link from a Chinese newspaper commenting on the issue: http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2007-01/30/content_795890.htm
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1337_ownage

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#280 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts
[QUOTE="tycoonmike"]Numbers will subdue technology. It's been proven numerous times in history, the Battle of Stalingrad, the Battle of Moscow, the Battle of the Bulge, just to name a few. So far as I know, China can call upon a third of its population to serve in the armed forces, which would outnumber the entire population of the United States.BranKetra
Not neccessarily...with a nuke as part of the equation.....



if us nukes....us will get attacked by every country out there
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mark4091

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#281 mark4091
Member since 2007 • 3780 Posts
the Chinese army does not have the experience once again, one skilled soldier can take down many.
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Vampyronight

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#282 Vampyronight
Member since 2002 • 3933 Posts
[QUOTE="1337_ownage"][QUOTE="Vampyronight"]It's funny- over 170 posts ago, I pretty much proved that China is a non-factor in any large scale war, yet we still have people that cling to the argument that China could win due to a larger military. It's funny- not one pro-China person even attempted to rebuff my arguments, instead going on tangents about unrelated history/blatant ant-Americanism. For every military that won with a larger army, there was one that won with a smaller one. The point? Size of the military has no correlation with who wins a war. Now, let's focus on the only realistic battle scenario: an invasion of Taiwan, with the US coming to its aid. If you think there's another one, I'd love to hear it, but this is pretty much the only one. Oh, and by the way, for all of those who believe this war is impossible- believe it. China WILL attack Taiwan one day. But you have to remember- the US doesn't need to INVADE China to win this war, just keep China away from Taiwan. It takes far more units to attack, and even more when its a naval invasion. China not only lacks the naval capability (not just to compete with the US on the water, but they don't even ships that could carry massive numbers of soldiers over), but the sheer numbers that would be required would be far greater than China could muster. Then again, it always comes back to the fact that to fight a war, you need a total war machine. You need soldiers, technology, supporting roles (building the guns/tanks), and resources. If you lack any of these in any meaningful way, the war is over. As I pointed out in my first post, the Malacca Straits would be secured easily by the US Navy, which would cut off the majority of China's oil supplies thus crippling any war effort. Even if you believe they could conscript 350 million soldiers (they can't), it won't make a difference if you can't power the tanks to fight the war or the factories that produce the tools of war.



they always have to get into peoples buisnees dont they............they get into every war they can......and china can cut off US supply and watch the use burn to the ground.

AND CHINA DESERVES TO OWN TAIWAN!! CHINA FTW

Why is China getting into Taiwan's business? Taiwan hasn't been a part of China for over a hundred years and was only a province of China for 10 years. China has absolutely no ability to cut off US oil supplies- you're just trying to be obnoxious, clearly.
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1337_ownage

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#283 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts
[QUOTE="1337_ownage"]oh i dont mean to be offensive on my earlier post.....but ive never seen a fat chinese....not half chinese i mean a full chineseVampyronight
There's frequently reports in Chinese newspapers/China's news shows about the growing epidemic of obesity in this country. Not as bad as the US, easily, but in the cities, I have seen plenty of fat Chinese people. Here's a link from a Chinese newspaper commenting on the issue: http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2007-01/30/content_795890.htm



of course theres fat chinese ppl....i just dont see them since im in california in a white/mexican town....
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Vampyronight

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#284 Vampyronight
Member since 2002 • 3933 Posts
the Chinese army does not have the experience once again, one skilled soldier can take down many.mark4091
Argh, your post reminded me! China does not have a single general that's actually seen military combat. The last one retired a few years ago. Another reason to say China's military is far weaker.
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Vampyronight

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#285 Vampyronight
Member since 2002 • 3933 Posts
[QUOTE="Vampyronight"][QUOTE="1337_ownage"]oh i dont mean to be offensive on my earlier post.....but ive never seen a fat chinese....not half chinese i mean a full chinese1337_ownage
There's frequently reports in Chinese newspapers/China's news shows about the growing epidemic of obesity in this country. Not as bad as the US, easily, but in the cities, I have seen plenty of fat Chinese people. Here's a link from a Chinese newspaper commenting on the issue: http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2007-01/30/content_795890.htm



of course theres fat chinese ppl....i just dont see them since im in california in a white/mexican town....

Ok, well I live in China and my degree was studying Asia....they exist.
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#286 mozzle
Member since 2005 • 2610 Posts
its kinda sad, when poeple are proud that they have a bigger army. . . its like saying "hey guess what guys, we put billions of more dollars a year into makeing are country better and more efficient at killing"
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1337_ownage

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#287 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts
China has a large army, in fact, it has a MASSIVE army, the debilitating factor in that is that their are too many mouths to feed. I don't think China could afford to feed its army and its people at the same time if a major conflict between them and America broke out. Peasants revolts and things of that nature would ensue.KrayzieJ


they can now..free markets...and they eat anything...not just your basic 3 meats.....and americas will fall with out the chinese producing the stuff they need!
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Thunderjack

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#288 Thunderjack
Member since 2003 • 588 Posts
All this talk about troop counts is ridiculous. If the US fought China it would be a Nuclear war.
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#289 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts
[QUOTE="Vampyronight"]Ok, I took the time to read most people's opinions. First, I should state a couple of things about myself. First, I am an American. But also, I live in China. My major when I was in college was called Far East Studies, which is the history, economics, politics, and geography of Asia. And since my school didn't have much with other countries, most of my education was specifically about China. Throughout this post, I'll try to clear up some misconceptions about China and its people. To be blunt, the main point of the thread (no matter how random it came to be) is absolutely spot on. Short of massive incompetence (and when I say that, I mean more than you can probably imagine...if you Bush is incompetent as a leader, think of him as a rousing success then imagine incompetence based off that) on the part of the US military, the People's Liberation Army (PLA from hereafter) stands absolutely no chance at winning any realistically based war (as in, one based off real, current political situations that could result in war). This is a fact- disagreement, no matter what argument you make, is one ultimately devoid of reality. Without turning this into one of the longest posts ever seen on a forum, I'll try to focus on a few key select things that makes this true. The first is the situation in regards to a navy. Almost never has a country won a war without a superior navy- the only example I can think of is Athens vs Sparta, and that was due to massive incompetence. And the fact of the matter is that the US has a true blue water navy (one that can go anywhere, at any time) and China still has plenty of of ships from the 60s and 70s (and a few from the 40s and 50s, hah!). The Chinese want to build aircraft carriers, but the fact is that they don't have any hulls in the water at this point, let alone functioning ones. The key to a war with China would be for the US to secure the Malacca Straits. For those of you don't know, this is a tiny waterway between Singapore and Indonesia. The vast majority of the Chinese oil supplies come through this way- if the US were to secure this strait (which it could, easily), it would cripple any military capability from China.China also can barely feed its own people, let alone handle a time of war (and it would take total war to fight the US). Up until about 2 years ago, China was still receiving food aid because it couldn't feed its own people. Fighting a war takes a serious commitment of resources, especially money, which leads to my second point. China's not developing like it says it is. This is the point where I'm afraid I could go on and on with, so I'll try to keep it brief. China's lying through its teeth when it comes to reporting its growth. Two quick and easy examples to prove that they're lying. The first is its yearly GDP growth, which they love to claim comes in at 8 or 9 percent. It's funny, though, because those GDP numbers come out BEFORE the year is even finished. Surely, with a country as big and as populated in China, it would take some time to calculate these numbers. But hey, maybe Chinese economists have a crystal ball and the numbers are spot on. I'll let you be the judge. The second example is their provincial growth rates versus the national growth rates. I forget which year (can find it if you're oh-so-inclined) but basically if you look at the provincial growth numbers, all but one of the provinces (Anhui) had higher numbers than the national government's numbers. Amazing, isn't it? Somebody's lying, or more likely, both. Just one more quick example to really illustrate what it's like here. There are these people in cities that have these massive brooms (don't know how to describe them any better than that) just just sweep trash, dirt, and other junk off the streets and sidewalks. In a city in Guangdong province, there were 7 open positions. They had 280+ people apply that college degrees or higher! They ended up taking 4 with bachelor's degrees, 2 with masters degrees, and one with a PhD. This is a bottom of the barrel job- surely a person with a PhD could get a better job in an economy growing so fast. I can provide plenty of more examples. By the way, if you want a real adventure, go to Guangdong. It's sort of like the Wild West- there's virtually no laws. Just be careful. Some remaining tidbits left. -Chinese people are fairly nationalistic, but there's also a sizable majority that is quite disenchanted with the current situation here in China. Corruption is seen as the worst thing happening, and thus the people have little faith in the government. If a war were to break out, I don't think you'd see the 'rally around the flag' type thing happen as much in China. Furthermore, most people would not serve in the military if they could- most see it as job security. - Americans are very well liked by the Chinese. If a war were to break out, it would undermine support. Now if it was Japan, well, total war it is! -The PLA is NOT well trained. Whoever said that knows nothing. -Chinese people as a whole cannot seem to dance well. I don't know why.




1.dude your just some white guy that lives there so what...do you have acess to the military??? yea i dodnt think so

2.we are in the 21st centry....so thats usless crap

3.the chinese would probly kno you would go there so probly heavily fortified! DEE DEE DEE

4.if china cant feed its population how the **** is it soo big?!? answer that

5.dude they getting money from US....US owes China money

6.usless crap

7.better reason to join the army

8.WE HAVE BUSH AS PRESIDENT THIS IS WORST THING IN AMERICAN HISTORY

9.off course we give you stuff and we get money, without the chinese whos gonna make all your stuff?

10.well cause their stuff is too expensive but the best

11.WTF...who cares about dancing?

Right here i just owned you HARD.....try harder next time..NOOB



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deactivated-5f9e3c6a83e51

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#290 deactivated-5f9e3c6a83e51
Member since 2004 • 57548 Posts
[QUOTE="sonicare"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="sonicare"]

Jointed,

You have no idea what you are talking about.  There were several reasons why the english "lost" the revolutionary war - french support was far from the most important.  In fact, most of the revolutionary war was fought without the aid of the french.  It wasn't until the US colonists had won a few key battles that the french decided to assist.  The revolutionary war was a war of attrition on england fought a world away.  Just as there were english loyalists in the US, there were US sympathizers in England - the war was unpopular there.  The US military during those times was a bare rag tag militia.  It's main job wasn't to crush the english army but rather harass and keep the cause alive.

The only key battle that the french assisted in was the battle of yorktown, which happened to be the final straw that broke the camel's back.  If the french had not assisted, the war would have lasted longer, but the outcome was inevitable.

As far as rebuilding Europe, the US did spend billions of dollars rebuilding cities and economies across the war torn country.  We also lost hundreds of thousands of our men and women in liberating much of western europe from an oppressive nazi regime - a war that the US did not start and wanted no part of.  The only european nation ever to repay the US was the UK.  However, not only did the US help rebuild those economies, but it helped protect them against an aggressive Soviet bloc that was determined to spread its influence throught europe.  The US was there when help was needed whether it was in airlifting in supplies to besieged western berlin during a soviet embargo or giving billions in aids to struggling european countries emerging from economic collapse.

Now our country is going through a rough but short time with an unpopular government and policy.  After decades of goodwill, suddenly europe declares our country evil and lashes out with blind hate of everything american.  Not having the decency or the respect to separate their dislike of the current US government from the average US citizen.  Instead its just blind hate and ignorant bashing of all americans. 

jointed

First of all I would like to tell you that I know what I'm talking about, very much so infact...

The French went bankrupt because of their support of the revolutionary war......look it up

The US spent billions in rebuilding Europe that is true....a Europe they helped destroy, together with the british and the Russians....name one nation the US helped to "rebuild" after the war damage had been repaired...

The Noble America who helped the Europeans in the war agaisnt the Nazi is far from what it has become today

A europe they helped to destroy?  It wasn't a war the US wanted to be in.  The allies had been trying to get the US to enter the war for quite sometime before December 7th, 1941.  How in any way was the US obligated to rebuild Europe?  "thanks for liberating us, but here's the bill?"

West Germany.

I'd still say that the current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose past foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today.  Look up the creation of palestine and israel and see who was responsible for that.  Look up the division of Pakistan and India as well - how did that happen, hmmmmm

West Germany were divided into 4 zones....1 controlled by the americans and they really never did anything to help it after the war rebuilding.....West Berlin is a whole other matter..

The current US is still more noble than the imperialistic european nations whose PAST foreign policy is a large reason why there is so much conflict today?????

Want to talk about past policies?

- You ended your the slavery in 1865!! and even then you had a god damned civil war about it!!!

- The bay of pigs, cuba

- Arming Iraq with weapons to use against Iran.....Arming Iran with weapons to use against Iraq

- Distributing weapons to warlords in Africa

- Dropping 2 nukes on civilian cities

The US were actually one of the nations who helped to create Israel......and who's it god damned ally as we speak!?

Now you are just talking out of your rear.  There isn't space on this forum to list every transgression that european nations have done throughout history.  The history of europe is full of imperialsim/mercantalism, subjugation and destruction of other cultures, wars, slavery (fyi - the dutch founded the african slave trade), corruption, religious intolerance and persecution, fascism, genocide, etc.  If you want to argue about past policies, you are going to lose that argument every time. 

Now I certainly am not going to stand behind a lot of the US foreign policy.  I frankly think a lot of it is wrong and unjust, but unlike some hypocritical europeans, I can acknowledge the mistakes of my country.  But seriously, who do you guys think you are to point the finger at us?!?  Look to your own nations dark past first.  You have no moral authority to criticize others.

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1337_ownage

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#291 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts
[QUOTE="Vampyronight"][QUOTE="1337_ownage"][QUOTE="Vampyronight"]It's funny- over 170 posts ago, I pretty much proved that China is a non-factor in any large scale war, yet we still have people that cling to the argument that China could win due to a larger military. It's funny- not one pro-China person even attempted to rebuff my arguments, instead going on tangents about unrelated history/blatant ant-Americanism. For every military that won with a larger army, there was one that won with a smaller one. The point? Size of the military has no correlation with who wins a war. Now, let's focus on the only realistic battle scenario: an invasion of Taiwan, with the US coming to its aid. If you think there's another one, I'd love to hear it, but this is pretty much the only one. Oh, and by the way, for all of those who believe this war is impossible- believe it. China WILL attack Taiwan one day. But you have to remember- the US doesn't need to INVADE China to win this war, just keep China away from Taiwan. It takes far more units to attack, and even more when its a naval invasion. China not only lacks the naval capability (not just to compete with the US on the water, but they don't even ships that could carry massive numbers of soldiers over), but the sheer numbers that would be required would be far greater than China could muster. Then again, it always comes back to the fact that to fight a war, you need a total war machine. You need soldiers, technology, supporting roles (building the guns/tanks), and resources. If you lack any of these in any meaningful way, the war is over. As I pointed out in my first post, the Malacca Straits would be secured easily by the US Navy, which would cut off the majority of China's oil supplies thus crippling any war effort. Even if you believe they could conscript 350 million soldiers (they can't), it won't make a difference if you can't power the tanks to fight the war or the factories that produce the tools of war.



they always have to get into peoples buisnees dont they............they get into every war they can......and china can cut off US supply and watch the use burn to the ground.

AND CHINA DESERVES TO OWN TAIWAN!! CHINA FTW

Why is China getting into Taiwan's business? Taiwan hasn't been a part of China for over a hundred years and was only a province of China for 10 years. China has absolutely no ability to cut off US oil supplies- you're just trying to be obnoxious, clearly.




SCREW TAIWAN...ive seen what they did on the news...chinese news......china can own them in a min...TAIWAN is alrdy fallin apart from all the rioting...if you do know that.....and i ment the US gettin into ppls bussiness..and i dont mean oil supply...i ment the crap people buy in targets,wal marts, dollar stores...the stuff that everybody uses everyday
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jerami

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#292 jerami
Member since 2003 • 1676 Posts
Yes...USA pwns.... and i'm not sure that the fat man to in-shape man was the best comparison...but I understood your general meaning
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joetira

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#293 joetira
Member since 2005 • 2879 Posts
People don't seem to understand that China only has numbers and lacks the ability to attack us, and our military is based on attacking other countries. If we were to go to war with them, we wouldn't be fighting it on our soil. China can't even invade tiwain....
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Vampyronight

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#294 Vampyronight
Member since 2002 • 3933 Posts



1.dude your just some white guy that lives there so what...do you have acess to the military??? yea i dodnt think so

2.we are in the 21st centry....so thats usless crap

3.the chinese would probly kno you would go there so probly heavily fortified! DEE DEE DEE

4.if china cant feed its population how the **** is it soo big?!? answer that

5.dude they getting money from US....US owes China money

6.usless crap

7.better reason to join the army

8.WE HAVE BUSH AS PRESIDENT THIS IS WORST THING IN AMERICAN HISTORY

9.off course we give you stuff and we get money, without the chinese whos gonna make all your stuff?

10.well cause their stuff is too expensive but the best

11.WTF...who cares about dancing?

Right here i just owned you HARD.....try harder next time..NOOB



1337_ownage
1. My degree is studying China- what formal background do you have studying China? 2. Missing the point much? All throughout history, the country or countries with a better Navy has won. The one I said I could think of that is otherwise is that one...not an example to prove my point, just a concession that it hasn't been 100% true. 3. China knows this, and that's why they haven't started a war with Taiwan. And that's the point- they know it, but there's nothing they can do to stop it right now. China can't "fortify" this area because it's Singapore and Indonesia, not China. Learn to read. 4. China was getting food aid until very recently. It still has to import food. 5. China's in much worse debt than the US when you look at it in terms of yearly GDP. The US is still in what's considered the "safe zone," though we're pushing it. China's debt is bigger than its GDP. 6. How is China not developing important? It takes money to fight wars...money they don't have. Resources they don't have. 7. China can't afford a bigger military- like in the US, many more people try to join than actually get in. 8. Even if you think Bush is terrible, the US government is more than one person. Rampant corruption permeates throughout the Chinese government, which is far worse than what you see in any developed nation. 9. You know nothing of international economics- stop speaking. 10. ??? 11. While being absolutely true, it was a joke. Not a single fact in your rebuttal. Wow, you so 'owned' me.
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Rabid_Moogle

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#295 Rabid_Moogle
Member since 2006 • 285 Posts
Chinese people will never rule the World. Europeans 4ever!slackersunited

u better hope some monk didnt hear that, or he summons a comet to destroy europe. lol
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1337_ownage

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#296 1337_ownage
Member since 2006 • 1668 Posts

1. Who said this?

2. So what?

3. Doesn't matter. Within thirty years, China will be the leader of the global market economy.

Media_geek20


thanks you

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kamix

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#297 kamix
Member since 2003 • 734 Posts
You know going by this and other Gamespot threads Chinese people usually have better English grammar and spelling than Americans. Kind of funny and sad at the same time really.
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Devouring_One

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#298 Devouring_One
Member since 2004 • 32312 Posts
The US army is better, China can only win by numbers.
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SunofVich

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#299 SunofVich
Member since 2004 • 4665 Posts
You know going by this and other Gamespot threads Chinese people usually have better English grammar and spelling than Americans. Kind of funny and sad at the same time really.kamix


It's so true.  I will admit I am not a grammatical artist or a spelling wiz. 

I am sure I spelled something wrong in the sentence above and in this one.  Its just that I dont care.
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#300 yamum2
Member since 2007 • 5879 Posts
china just have more people