Question about evolution and atheism BIG READ

[QUOTE="Silenthps"]I thought you said you were going to grant me that claim that the Bible is the most historically accurate collection of books of all time? ;)-Sun_Tzu-

They can't explain how the Universe was Formed and they can't prove that there is no God. To compensate for this, scientists use "Coincidence".

Snipes_2

[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"][QUOTE="Silenthps"]I thought you said you were going to grant me that claim that the Bible is the most historically accurate collection of books of all time? ;)Silenthps

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="Silenthps"]Because for Satan to do that he would have to be God.Silenthps

I have had fundamentalist Christians tell me point blank that what I believe was delivered to me by Satan, despite the fact that it caused overwhelming joy and love for God in my heart, purely because they disagreed with its doctrine.

Satan seems to be much better at delivering doctrine to someone than the Holy Spirit, really, considering the number of people who are claimed to be deceived by Satan as opposed to having their eyes opened by the Holy Spirit.

I have not said anything of you or your parents other than what you just told me; that you're all christian. That is all i asked and all i needed to know. And do you REALLY fail to see the point or do you just refuse to acknowledge it?

The question is a simple one; how can a person seriously declare that their beliefs are true when the only reason they hold those beliefs are because of the sheer coincidence that they happened to be born to parents who also held those beliefs and naturally passed them on? Had you been born elsewhere, your beliefs would very likely be completely different. Does that not damage the legitimacy of those beliefs, when they are most of the time entirely governed by the complete chance of where and when you're born?

Beck (the musician) is a scientologist. The only reason he is a scientologist is because his father was his scientologist. Had his father not been a scientologist, and had rather been a christian, he would likely now have a COMPLETLEY DIFFERENT set of beliefs.

Do you not acknowledge that at all as a powerful argument against religion?

Ninja-Hippo

And no, it's not an argument at all. Just because theres a lot of wrong religions it doesn't prove that Christianity is a wrong religion or hurt its legitimacy in any way.

[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"][QUOTE="Silenthps"]I thought you said you were going to grant me that claim that the Bible is the most historically accurate collection of books of all time? ;)Silenthps

Just because theres a lot of wrong religions it doesn't prove that Christianity is a wrong religion or hurt its legitimacy in any way.Silenthps

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]I have not said anything of you or your parents other than what you just told me; that you're all christian. That is all i asked and all i needed to know. And do you REALLY fail to see the point or do you just refuse to acknowledge it?

The question is a simple one; how can a person seriously declare that their beliefs are true when the only reason they hold those beliefs are because of the sheer coincidence that they happened to be born to parents who also held those beliefs and naturally passed them on? Had you been born elsewhere, your beliefs would very likely be completely different. Does that not damage the legitimacy of those beliefs, when they are most of the time entirely governed by the complete chance of where and when you're born?

Beck (the musician) is a scientologist. The only reason he is a scientologist is because his father was his scientologist. Had his father not been a scientologist, and had rather been a christian, he would likely now have a COMPLETLEY DIFFERENT set of beliefs.

Do you not acknowledge that at all as a powerful argument against religion?

Silenthps

And no, it's not an argument at all. Just because theres a lot of wrong religions it doesn't prove that Christianity is a wrong religion or hurt its legitimacy in any way.

I'm talking about the Bible in its original form.Silenthps

Yes but you must surely realise that the VAST majority of people who assign themselves with a certain religion do so because they were brought up that way? And therefore the religion which you choose to believe is really an incredibly flippant and fickle thing as it really just comes down to when and where you're born. Like i said, Beck's a scientologist cuz his dad's a scientologist. If he was christian, he'd be christian. Doesn't that cheapen the whole thing? Does that not surely worry you? If you were born a Hindu, would you not believe in elephants gods just as strongly as you now do the christian god?

Ninja-Hippo

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]Yes but you must surely realise that the VAST majority of people who assign themselves with a certain religion do so because they were brought up that way? And therefore the religion which you choose to believe is really an incredibly flippant and fickle thing as it really just comes down to when and where you're born. Like i said, Beck's a scientologist cuz his dad's a scientologist. If he was christian, he'd be christian. Doesn't that cheapen the whole thing? Does that not surely worry you? If you were born a Hindu, would you not believe in elephants gods just as strongly as you now do the christian god?

Silenthps

EDIT: this would also require that Satan retroactively go back and create religions before your religion even came to be... although if you believe the earth is only 6000 years old, those people did not exist and therefore those religions did not exist. Satan must have instead planted them there. I guess. :?

Why do atheists call believers stupid in thinking that a magical god either always exited or popped into existence and intelligently created

over what atheists believe in that the universe magically popped into existence, or always existed and magically started coding itself.

[QUOTE="Silenthps"]I'm talking about the Bible in its original form.Hewkii

Why do atheists call believers stupid in thinking that a magical god either always exited or popped into existence and intelligently created

over what atheists believe in that the universe magically popped into existence, or always existed and magically started coding itself.

sintygypsy

No I mean the original manuscripts of all the writings. They were written way before that. Silenthps

[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"][QUOTE="Silenthps"] if the Bible is the most accurate collection of books of all time, then what the Bible says about God is true. Silenthps

The Bible was compiled by Roman Catholic priests. There was no original Bible, only a few books that men (Not God) hand picked out of a group of countless others to form a holy text. Any book included could have been complete BS (assuming that Christianity itself isn't) as long as it was theologically convincing.

[QUOTE="Silenthps"]No I mean the original manuscripts of all the writings. They were written way before that. Hewkii

[QUOTE="Silenthps"][QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"] False, because the bible is full of inconsistencies, was edited by the church more than once and even had several gospels removed and destroyed.Lab392

The Bible was compiled by Roman Catholic priests. There was no original Bible, only a few books that men (Not God) hand picked out of a group of countless others to form a holy text. Any book included could have been complete BS (assuming that Christianity itself isn't) as long as it was theologically convincing.

Here's the kicker; you have absolutely no means whatsoever of knowing whether the bible as it currently stands is an accurate copy of the older originals from which it is drawn, as these 'originals' are only known to be original and from the time because of carbon dating, which you claim is broken science created by satan to fool us. ;)

The Old Testament was arranged waay back around 300 B.C. although I don't remember if they included Ruth back then or not. But they actually were arranged before Nicea, Nicea just basically made it official. But the majority of the church at that time had a good clue as to which were the inspired writings.Silenthps

Why on Earth do you and most pro-theistic debaters like to generalize and strawman Atheists? I don't absolutely believe that there is no god, but I could be classified as an Atheist because my opinion is that there is insufficient evidence that the universe was designed by a sentient omnipotent being as depicted in popular religion. Therefore, I fit the definition of Atheism which is the rejection of theism. I don't appreciate it when you try to define my views for me (and incorrectly, at that) and then argue that I'm irrational based on your false interpretation of my beliefs.

Why do atheists call believers stupid in thinking that a magical god either always exited or popped into existence and intelligently created

over what atheists believe in that the universe magically popped into existence, or always existed and magically started coding itself.

sintygypsy

Guys guys guys! Okay so I'm chilling out watching TV when suddenly the handkerchief on my coffee table speaks to me. It says it was sewn from the thread spun from the material taken from an ungerminated plant. It is the son of the holy napkin. And I have seen it perform miracles! We're currently traveling along with 11 other dudes. Anybody want to join?Got_to_go

I'm not going to read that because I no longer possess the adequate tolerance for such discussion.

Read. Look it up. Don't ask people here if you have a question about evolution, look the actual, definitive answer up, educate yourself, and then you'll find your answer.

This thread is amazing.clayron

In what way?

[QUOTE="clayron"]This thread is amazing.SgtKevali

In what way?

[QUOTE="sintygypsy"]

Why do atheists call believers stupid in thinking that a magical god either always exited or popped into existence and intelligently created

over what atheists believe in that the universe magically popped into existence, or always existed and magically started coding itself.

RiskAverseStock

Can you read? I clearly said it either popped into existence or always existed. Try reading next time before you make yourself look like a fool. Would holding out your hand and having a complex structure form inside of your palm be a good example of how the things in the universe first began? With no information around to start things off, such complex things arose? To me it seems like that is how it happened. In terms of evolution, the first appearance of life seemed to be pre programmed with the ability to copy itself? The absence of an intelligent designer and creator makes no sense to me. So again, if you can justify it, please try. I've waited a long time to hear an acceptable reply.

[QUOTE="clayron"]This thread is amazing.SgtKevali

In what way?

[QUOTE="RiskAverseStock"]

[QUOTE="sintygypsy"]

Why do atheists call believers stupid in thinking that a magical god either always exited or popped into existence and intelligently created

over what atheists believe in that the universe magically popped into existence, or always existed and magically started coding itself.

sintygypsy

Can you read? I clearly said it either popped into existence or always existed. Try reading next time before you make yourself look like a fool. Would holding out your hand and having a complex structure form inside of your palm be a good example of how the things in the universe first began? With no information around to start things off, such complex things arose? To me it seems like that is how it happened. In terms of evolution, the first appearance of life seemed to be pre programmed with the ability to copy itself? The absence of an intelligent designer and creator makes no sense to me. So again, if you can justify it, please try. I've waited a long time to hear an acceptable reply.

Seems to me like you can accept nothing creating something, and the universe having always existed and coding itself, but you cant accept the idea that a god arose or always existed and intelligent designed it all. Both are magic.

[QUOTE="Got_to_go"]Guys guys guys! Okay so I'm chilling out watching TV when suddenly the handkerchief on my coffee table speaks to me. It says it was sewn from the thread spun from the material taken from an ungerminated plant. It is the son of the holy napkin. And I have seen it perform miracles! We're currently traveling along with 11 other dudes. Anybody want to join?RiskAverseStock

Everyone hold the phone!

Darkmatter2525 found the TRUE ten commandments after moses broke the first two after ordering the death of 3000 people! Anyways read this

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Exodus+34&version=KJV

One of the new commandments say 23Thrice in the year shall all your menchildren appear before the LORD God, the God of Israel.

So where is it? Is it living on the clouds from where it came but we seen nothing up there did it move?

Opps forgot to thank darkmatter2525 for finding this!

This thread is amazing.clayron

you bet! I've never seen a thread grow this fast before. In an hour like 20 pages or replies! thats incredible! I guess i can THANKS GOD for the amazing popularity rofl. 1000s of years from now the atheists will look back into our history and say "hmm, well, nobody created this topic, it wrote itself, the topic creator doesnt exist. we've no proof"

[QUOTE="clayron"]This thread is amazing.deadpool86x

you bet! I've never seen a thread grow this fast before. In an hour like 20 pages or replies! thats incredible! I guess i can THANKS GOD for the amazing popularity rofl. 1000s of years from now the atheists will look back into our history and say "hmm, well, nobody created this topic, it wrote itself, the topic creator doesnt exist. we've no proof"

I post that this thread is amazing due to the lack of offensiveness in the first 5 or so pages, then someone gets offensive. I have yet to even get very far in the thread and I am already not wanting to because of this post and the post about "Hankerchesus"

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

[QUOTE="clayron"]This thread is amazing.clayron

In what way?

Eh...as the thread goes on those personal attacks start popping up.

[QUOTE="clayron"][QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

In what way?

SgtKevali

Eh...as the thread goes on those personal attacks start popping up.

Plus all of the side discussions are plenty good.clayron

I'm reading Snipes_2's argument on page 5 right now and I have to disagree with you on that. He's excellent at proving that he can't debate properly.

[QUOTE="clayron"]Plus all of the side discussions are plenty good.Barbariser

I'm reading Snipes_2's argument on page 5 right now and I have to disagree with you on that. He's excellent at proving that he can't debate properly.

25 pages of atheists dodging the questions posed. lol

Can you read? I clearly said it either popped into existence or always existed. Try reading next time before you make yourself look like a fool. Would holding out your hand and having a complex structure form inside of your palm be a good example of how the things in the universe first began? With no information around to start things off, such complex things arose? To me it seems like that is how it happened. In terms of evolution, the first appearance of life seemed to be pre programmed with the ability to copy itself? The absence of an intelligent designer and creator makes no sense to me. So again, if you can justify it, please try. I've waited a long time to hear an acceptable reply.

Seems to me like you can accept nothing creating something, and the universe having always existed and coding itself, but you cant accept the idea that a god arose or always existed and intelligent designed it all. Both are magic.

sintygypsy

The universe didn't always exist. We can trace it's expansion from a singularity through background radiation spread around the universe. No, we don't know how the singularity arose, but we do know it was there.

Seeing as how RNA has been discovered formed naturally in the universe, and that RNA can both store information and act as enzymes, I would indeed say it is a possibility that life arose from self-replicating molecules.

I could say that God did all that himself as opposed to the natural explanations, but wouldn't that be complicating things?

[QUOTE="Barbariser"]

[QUOTE="clayron"]Plus all of the side discussions are plenty good.clayron

I'm reading Snipes_2's argument on page 5 right now and I have to disagree with you on that. He's excellent at proving that he can't debate properly.

I don't think you're the type of person who would use the Bible for proof in a rational debate.... as a matter of fact I'm quite sure that most Christians are good enough at reasoning that they won't even try and do that.