Why I am against abortion

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allie2590

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#51 allie2590
Member since 2009 • 283 Posts

[QUOTE="allie2590"]

Abortions are none of your business unless you yourself are in that situation. If you don't believe in abortions, then you don't have to have anything to do with them. I suggest you get off your high horse and let other people live their lives.

Jacobistheman

So with that same logic, If I had a 3 month year old son, I could kill him right? If you say no I suggest you get off your high horse and let other people die becuase it is convent for the parents.

That's clearly murder. Your "3 month year old son" has been born. A fetus has not. Besides, my post was pretty neutral and apathetic. I'm not sure why you felt the need to argue against it.

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foxhound_fox

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#52 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

That's clearly murder. Your "3 month year old son" has been born. A fetus has not. Besides, my post was pretty neutral and apathetic. I'm not sure why you felt the need to argue against it.allie2590

What is the difference between a three week old foetus and three month old infant? Both will die without support. The infant can most easily die from exposure... it has no way to fend for itself, cannot feed or find food on its own (hell, few year-old toddlers probably couldn't survive more than a couple days) and has no ability to think objectively.

What makes in infant more human than a foetus? They are genetically the same creature, both have the same potential to grow into an adult.

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DjCristii

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#53 DjCristii
Member since 2009 • 247 Posts
abortion is a good way to stop overpopulation
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hip-hop-cola2

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#54 hip-hop-cola2
Member since 2007 • 2454 Posts

Well first of all, there are a lot of people who adopt babies who can take care of them. If you can't someone else will. Even if their childhood is hard, you shouldn't kill them becuase of that fact. LIke I said earlier, there is always a chance that a life will get better, and that is the choice of the person living the life. When someone is aborted, they don't have a say, and are gone forever.Jacobistheman

Did you even read...

He retracted his point on "poor familys".....

And way to go picking out all the easy points made in this thread to argue against.

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foxhound_fox

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#55 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

abortion is a good way to stop overpopulationDjCristii

So is mass genocide. And controlled drought.

That still doesn't make it right. The main reason the planet is facing overpopulation is because people are having more biological children than they need to replace them after they are dead. All families in first world countries should be limited to two biological children and have to adopt if they want more.

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efrucht

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#56 efrucht
Member since 2008 • 1596 Posts

[QUOTE="efrucht"][QUOTE="hip-hop-cola2"]

Even if the parents abuse the child, even if it ends up homeless, maybe it will still live a life worth living. I bet if you asked some of the homeless, or abuse victims, if they would rather not exsist, they would say no.

(Just playingDevil's advocate)

Jacobistheman

Sure. I still would have been nice of they had been spared that pain. True, sll life is precious, and you are 100% correct in what you just said. So I retract what I said about the starving children. The rest still stands.

Well first of all, there are a lot of people who adopt babies who can take care of them. If you can't someone else will. Even if their childhood is hard, you shouldn't kill them becuase of that fact. LIke I said earlier, there is always a chance that a life will get better, and that is the choice of the person living the life. When someone is aborted, they don't have a say, and are gone forever.

I agree, but you really should read what i originally wrote.

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Morning_Revival

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#57 Morning_Revival
Member since 2008 • 3475 Posts
Life is life, no matter how small. Nobody has the right to take another life, no matter how infantile. You took your pants off, you can push the baby out if it comes to that. Stupid people take stupid chances.
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TM_Darkside

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#58 TM_Darkside
Member since 2007 • 3993 Posts

I'm in favor of the right to choose because:

Reaches level 20 and evolves to:

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Morning_Revival

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#59 Morning_Revival
Member since 2008 • 3475 Posts

LOL! Wow, that kid is so ugly! :lol:

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Jacobistheman

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#60 Jacobistheman
Member since 2007 • 3975 Posts

[QUOTE="Jacobistheman"][QUOTE="allie2590"]

Abortions are none of your business unless you yourself are in that situation. If you don't believe in abortions, then you don't have to have anything to do with them. I suggest you get off your high horse and let other people live their lives.

allie2590

So with that same logic, If I had a 3 month year old son, I could kill him right? If you say no I suggest you get off your high horse and let other people die becuase it is convent for the parents.

That's clearly murder. Your "3 month year old son" has been born. A fetus has not. Besides, my post was pretty neutral and apathetic. I'm not sure why you felt the need to argue against it.

Well it is still a human life even if it isn't born. A 3 month old would die almost as fast without others as the unborn child would. I felt I needed to argue because if I "let other people live there lives" many babies are being killed.
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Faber_Fighter

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#61 Faber_Fighter
Member since 2006 • 1890 Posts

[QUOTE="Faber_Fighter"]



That bride right there also has the same chance to turn out to be someone like this



Sorry but I reckon your reason against abortion is flawed. I know that there may be some legit reasons to be against abortion, and personally i'm for abortion. But your reason makes no sense. Yes you might be taking away a person's life which could have turned out to be great, but you might also have saved someone who will have a sick and depressed life. I'm not saying you should have an abortion purely because you think your child will have a better life in the "afterlife?" but i just don't see any reason why you would be against abortion for purely your reason.

Jacobistheman

So are you saying we should just kill eveyone becuase their life could turn out bad. This is dumb. Also there is always a chance for sick and depressed people to change and they are sick and depressed by their own will, if you kill someone there is no chance to change that and they don't make that choice.

No you missed my point. What I was saying is that you shouldn't be against abortion purely because you are restricting someone of having a good life, because you can't guarantee that they will have a good one.

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foxhound_fox

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#62 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

No you missed my point. What I was saying is that you shouldn't be against abortion purely because you are restricting someone of having a good life, because you can't guarantee that they will have a good one.Faber_Fighter

That is a stupid excuse. That kind of gamble is not something that should be played with human lives. You have absolutely NO idea of what their life is going to turn out like.

And you cannot guarantee they will have a bad one. The only way that kind of reasoning would work is if you could guarantee that their live is going to be miserable... like if they have a genetic disorder that causes physical malformations that lead to chronic pain.

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Faber_Fighter

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#63 Faber_Fighter
Member since 2006 • 1890 Posts

[QUOTE="Faber_Fighter"]No you missed my point. What I was saying is that you shouldn't be against abortion purely because you are restricting someone of having a good life, because you can't guarantee that they will have a good one.foxhound_fox


That is a stupid excuse. That kind of gamble is not something that should be played with human lives. You have absolutely NO idea of what their life is going to turn out like.

And you cannot guarantee they will have a bad one. The only way that kind of reasoning would work is if you could guarantee that their live is going to be miserable... like if they have a genetic disorder that causes physical malformations that lead to chronic pain.

I know that kind of gamble is completely unfair for the child, but if you PURELY decide to be against abortion for that one reason then that's something i wouldn't agree with.

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foxhound_fox

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#64 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

I know that kind of gamble is completely unfair for the child, but if you PURELY decide to be against abortion for that one reason then that's something i wouldn't agree with.Faber_Fighter

Anyone with a non-religious objection to abortion don't tend to ride on a single argument. And that particular one is a pretty good one, considering the highly assumptive nature of your counter argument.

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hip-hop-cola2

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#65 hip-hop-cola2
Member since 2007 • 2454 Posts

[QUOTE="Faber_Fighter"]I know that kind of gamble is completely unfair for the child, but if you PURELY decide to be against abortion for that one reason then that's something i wouldn't agree with.foxhound_fox


Anyone with a non-religious objection to abortion don't tend to ride on a single argument. And that particular one is a pretty good one, considering the highly assumptive nature of your counter argument.

Why put so much value on something that "Can be".

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foxhound_fox

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#66 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

Why put so much value on something that "Can be".hip-hop-cola2

Why not? If you don't, you could justify infanticide as easily as abortion.

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MrGeezer

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#67 MrGeezer
Member since 2002 • 59765 Posts

there are a lot of people who adopt babies who can take care of them. If you can't someone else will. Jacobistheman

And the ONLY reason why that is true is because abortions are legal.

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hip-hop-cola2

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#68 hip-hop-cola2
Member since 2007 • 2454 Posts

[QUOTE="hip-hop-cola2"]Why put so much value on something that "Can be".foxhound_fox


Why not? If you don't, you could justify infanticide as easily as abortion.

As worrying as it sounds, I could justify it. It's drawing the line where I struggle, a 3 month old has no idea it even exists so why not allow a family who has undergone a sudden economic struggle to euthanasia there child, Im sure almost nobody would, but why not.

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MrGeezer

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#69 MrGeezer
Member since 2002 • 59765 Posts

[QUOTE="Faber_Fighter"]No you missed my point. What I was saying is that you shouldn't be against abortion purely because you are restricting someone of having a good life, because you can't guarantee that they will have a good one.foxhound_fox


That is a stupid excuse. That kind of gamble is not something that should be played with human lives. You have absolutely NO idea of what their life is going to turn out like.

And you cannot guarantee they will have a bad one. The only way that kind of reasoning would work is if you could guarantee that their live is going to be miserable... like if they have a genetic disorder that causes physical malformations that lead to chronic pain.

However, the mother usually DOES have a VERY freaking good idea of what kind of life that kid is gonna have.

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lonewolf604

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#70 lonewolf604
Member since 2007 • 8748 Posts
plus murder is supposed to be illegal. seriously.uncreativebutt
then i should be in jail for massive genocide for pouring water in an ant hill
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Toriko42

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#71 Toriko42
Member since 2006 • 27562 Posts
That's all fine and dandy but I respect the woman's right to choose. I'm not going to impose my beliefs on anyone.
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sAndroid17

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#72 sAndroid17
Member since 2005 • 8715 Posts
[QUOTE="uncreativebutt"]plus murder is supposed to be illegal. seriously.lonewolf604
then i should be in jail for massive genocide for pouring water in an ant hill

you evil person:o
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CleanPlayer

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#73 CleanPlayer
Member since 2008 • 9822 Posts
I'm against abortion.
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jamacian_zombie

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#74 jamacian_zombie
Member since 2008 • 310 Posts

So if a woman is raped and she becomes pregnant, you think she should just suffer? :?

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CleanPlayer

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#75 CleanPlayer
Member since 2008 • 9822 Posts

So if a woman is raped and she becomes pregnant, you think she should just suffer? :?

jamacian_zombie
She could give the child up for adoption? There's always alternatives than abortion.
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#76 jamacian_zombie
Member since 2008 • 310 Posts

[QUOTE="jamacian_zombie"]

So if a woman is raped and she becomes pregnant, you think she should just suffer? :?

CleanPlayer

She could give the child up for adoption? There's always alternatives than abortion.

Oh yeah, giving birth isn't painful at all. Yeah, hospitals are extremely cheap. Oh yes, we all know that she won't have major psychological problems after the whole affair. No, lets just close our eyes and stick our heads in the sand and pretend everything is okay. :D

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AnObscureName

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#77 AnObscureName
Member since 2008 • 2069 Posts
I used to be pro-choice but I have gradually drifted to being more pro-life. Now the only case where I would consider abortion an appropriate route would be where the baby was conceived through incest or where there is significant proof that the child will be severly mentally or physically retarded.
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HellsAngel2c

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#78 HellsAngel2c
Member since 2004 • 5540 Posts
Abortion should always be available. At that stage, there is only 1 person who can determin the type of life they will give to their child and that is the mum. If they believe they wont be able to look ater the child for various reasons (be it the child is a product of rape and they wont love it, or they can provide it with financial support or they themselves are just not ready) then they have the right to decide how to solve the issue. Some go for adoption- some dont want to do that because they fear that as soon as they give birth they wil develope a maternal attachment or fear the child will return in the future as a blast from the past. You cant force someone to raise a kid if they are not ready or in the right situation too. Saying 'they could grow up to be the greatest scientist ever' does not change the fact that in the HERE and NOW the mother is not ready. Forcing them to raise a child is worse than abortion.
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TheFlush

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#79 TheFlush
Member since 2002 • 5965 Posts
I don't like babies
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htekemerald

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#80 htekemerald
Member since 2004 • 7325 Posts

Emotional appeals are appeals to emotion.

You dont treat something as what it could be you treat it as what it is.

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TheFlush

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#81 TheFlush
Member since 2002 • 5965 Posts

Emotional appeals are appeals to emotion.

You dont treat something as what it could be you treat it as what it is.

htekemerald
bingo, and I don't feel sorry for a bunch of cells that don't have a conscience yet. However, there's a set amount of time in which you can get an abortion, in some countries this amount of time is too long and I'm strongly opposed to abortion after a certain period of pregnancy (unless it's for medical reasons of the mother). And I do think that people should be more responsible if they don't want to have a child, there are enough birth control options available.
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FUBAR24

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#82 FUBAR24
Member since 2005 • 12185 Posts
Life is life, no matter how small. Nobody has the right to take another life, no matter how infantile. You took your pants off, you can push the baby out if it comes to that. Stupid people take stupid chances.Morning_Revival
once again a blind supporter not addressing the rape issue
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jimmyjammer69

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#83 jimmyjammer69
Member since 2008 • 12239 Posts
[QUOTE="Morning_Revival"]Life is life, no matter how small. Nobody has the right to take another life, no matter how infantile. You took your pants off, you can push the baby out if it comes to that. Stupid people take stupid chances.FUBAR24
once again a blind supporter not addressing the rape issue

Because the rape example constitutes is a tiny, tiny minority of cases, and it's not on this basis that most pro-abortionists argue. Rather, they tend to argue that abortion should always be the mother's option. If you asked in here who was in favour of the death penalty, I imagine you'd find a relatively small number of supporters; but if you then asked who would favour the death of a convicted murderer in one isolated example where it would save the lives of several innocents, you're likely to get an entirely different response. Those respondents aren't being inconsistent, they're just admitting that sometimes abortion may be the lesser of two evils. Whether or not you like it, a foetus IS a lifeform, and if you want to draw a line as to which human lives have intrinsic value then you're the one who will eventually find yourself on a slippery slope.
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-Sun_Tzu-

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#84 -Sun_Tzu-
Member since 2007 • 17384 Posts

I am not "pro-abortion" (if there even is such a thing) but I am not pro-life. I don't believe that the government should have the right to choose what individuals can do in relation to their own body.

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tofu-lion91

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#85 tofu-lion91
Member since 2008 • 13496 Posts

What if that 6 day old baby was a product of a 13 year old girl getting raped by her grandfather?
I'm not joking, there is a place for abortion in society.
It's not always so cut and dry.

One more thing: The people going for abortions have their reasons. If they were forced to raise a child against their will, you can change that picture of a happy bride to a crackhead in a jail uniform.

Conjuration

This sums up part of my arguement for pro-choice. I think it's ridiculous how the government don't trust people with their own judgement anymore. I'm pro-choice. I probably will never need an abortion in my life but I support them because women deserve the choice to decide what they want to do.

It doesn't mean there'll be no children left in care homes to be adopted because I'm sure a great deal of the population would choose to give the kid away rather than abort. And it doesn't mean pro-choice people are baby killers as a fetus that can't survive outside the womb is not a baby. It also means the people in power are not baby killers (i.e Obama - I'm not joking, somebody has called him that before)

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noswear

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#86 noswear
Member since 2008 • 3263 Posts
I'm for abortion because, just look at the first picture. It's like killing a goddamn mosquito, noone's going to miss that little sea monkey.
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tofu-lion91

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#87 tofu-lion91
Member since 2008 • 13496 Posts
[QUOTE="TheFlush"] bingo, and I don't feel sorry for a bunch of cells that don't have a conscience yet. However, there's a set amount of time in which you can get an abortion, in some countries this amount of time is too long and I'm strongly opposed to abortion after a certain period of pregnancy (unless it's for medical reasons of the mother). And I do think that people should be more responsible if they don't want to have a child, there are enough birth control options available.

Agreed. I'm against late term abortions as it can survive outside the womb and using abortion as a method of contraceptive is disgusting. It's supposed to be a last resort and there's tons of contraceptives out there including the morning after pill if they're that deseperate.
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calvinsora

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#88 calvinsora
Member since 2009 • 7076 Posts

I completely agree with TC on this. Abortion for convenience is just wrong. There are of course horrible pregnancies, but they're not the only ones who get abortions. There are many who just don't want kids. Every infant, in cell-form or not, will eventually have a life, and no-one has the right to take it away from them.

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jimmyjammer69

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#89 jimmyjammer69
Member since 2008 • 12239 Posts

I am not "pro-abortion" (if there even is such a thing) but I am not pro-life. I don't believe that the government should have the right to choose what individuals can do in relation to their own body.

-Sun_Tzu-
The problem is that as soon as something is legal, there is a percentage of people who will see it as a universal thumbs-up. It would be nice to live in a world where people do honestly think for themselves, but actually we live a sanitized life where we're not confronted by the consequences of our actions, and it's much easier to take the path of least resistance where everything is ok as long as someone assures us it is.
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tofu-lion91

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#90 tofu-lion91
Member since 2008 • 13496 Posts
I completely agree with TC on this. Abortion for convenience is just wrong. There are of course horrible pregnancies, but they're not the only ones who get abortions. There are many who just don't want kids. Every infant, in cell-form or not, will eventually have a life, and no-one has the right to take it away from them.calvinsora
What about natural abortions i.e miscarriages? God must be a baby killer :o Let's ban that too! Then the world will be perfect >____>
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-Sun_Tzu-

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#91 -Sun_Tzu-
Member since 2007 • 17384 Posts
[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"]

I am not "pro-abortion" (if there even is such a thing) but I am not pro-life. I don't believe that the government should have the right to choose what individuals can do in relation to their own body.

jimmyjammer69
The problem is that as soon as something is legal, there is a percentage of people who will see it as a universal thumbs-up. It would be nice to live in a world where people do honestly think for themselves, but actually we live a sanitized life where we're not confronted by the consequences of our actions, and it's much easier to take the path of least resistance where everything is ok as long as someone assures us it is.

What do you mean when you say a "universal thumbs up"?
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bean-with-bacon

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#92 bean-with-bacon
Member since 2008 • 2134 Posts
Women will be getting abortions whether or not they are legal, better in a safe sanitized enviroment then a back alley with a coat hanger (well probably not coat hanger but you get my drift :P)
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scoots9

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#93 scoots9
Member since 2006 • 3505 Posts

cells are not life. they help make life. thats it.

RaistlinMajere8

Cell- the structural and functional unit of all known living organisms. It is the smallest unit of an organism that is cIassfied as living, and is often called the building bricks of life.

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jimmyjammer69

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#94 jimmyjammer69
Member since 2008 • 12239 Posts
[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"][QUOTE="jimmyjammer69"][QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"]

I am not "pro-abortion" (if there even is such a thing) but I am not pro-life. I don't believe that the government should have the right to choose what individuals can do in relation to their own body.

The problem is that as soon as something is legal, there is a percentage of people who will see it as a universal thumbs-up. It would be nice to live in a world where people do honestly think for themselves, but actually we live a sanitized life where we're not confronted by the consequences of our actions, and it's much easier to take the path of least resistance where everything is ok as long as someone assures us it is.

What do you mean when you say a "universal thumbs up"?

Like a green light or a seal of approval. I always imagined that in capitalist economies, anything that is legal is going to be a source of revenue for some, and hence marketed. Like after the release of Prozac, there were a record number of cases of depression recorded. People like making themselves out to be victims, so anything that gives us a way out of accepting consequences (regardless of what powers it involves relinquishing) becomes a good thing. Sure, there are some cases where abortion seems like the only option, but what does it mean for the value of human life if it becomes equivalent to retrospective contraception?
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Funky_Llama

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#95 Funky_Llama
Member since 2006 • 18428 Posts
I'm for abortion because, just look at the first picture. It's like killing a goddamn mosquito, noone's going to miss that little sea monkey.noswear
Harsh but true. :P
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drj077

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#96 drj077
Member since 2003 • 8375 Posts

Sure, there are some cases where abortion seems like the only option, but what does it mean for the value of human life if it becomes equivalent to retrospective contraception?jimmyjammer69

This statement is important. But, you know what the problem is? Too much conservative involvement in the proper implementation of adequate sexual education programs and distribution of contraceptives to even middle school age children. We now have at least two generations of adults in this country that continue to have children, but never learned how to properly teach their new children about intercourse.Their own education was either limited by the school system or their own parent's own lack of understanding.

Fix that and you'll fix more problems that you can possibly imagine. Make young children watch videos about sexual relationships and then show a video of a pregnant women being torn from V to A during a delivery. Then, I can almost guarantee that noyoung woman will let a man touch them without protection for a very long time.

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escapeoftheape

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#97 escapeoftheape
Member since 2007 • 1576 Posts
TC, you are narrow minded. what if the baby is born without skin and has to suffer all her life? are you so evil you want her to live a life of misery because "its murder"? you obivously didnt think this through. people who take abortion usually have good reasons to do this. if you dont let them, they will get needles and stick them in their ****** and kill both them and their baby. if this is what makes you happy, you disgust me.
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-Sun_Tzu-

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#98 -Sun_Tzu-
Member since 2007 • 17384 Posts

Sure, there are some cases where abortion seems like the only option, but what does it mean for the value of human life if it becomes equivalent to retrospective contraception?jimmyjammer69
What you are saying is both a slippery slope and a straw man. Even if you were to assume that a fetus is as human as you or me, if the mother-to-be does not want to carry said fetus to term, then she shouldn't have to carry said fetus to term. I think that someone in this thread already brought up the work of Judith Thomson. She argued that abortion doesn't deny a fetus the right to live, rather abortion deprives the fetus the use of the mother's womb, a use that no one has a right to use without permission of the mother. If an unwelcomed visitor comes to your house, you are not under any obligation to provide food a shelter to said visitor, and you have every right to evict said visitor from your residence if you choose to do so.

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FirstDiscovery

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#99 FirstDiscovery
Member since 2008 • 5508 Posts

[QUOTE="FirstDiscovery"]

[QUOTE="carrot-cake"]
Exactly.
Also, what if the person was raped? Must they suffer a child because someone sexually assaulted them?
What guarantees that the person will grow up to be like that? There is none. Not everyone will have a good life and be happy.

carrot-cake

Many people who staunchly stand against abortion believe in it in such cases


Exactly! Either you are against it or you arent. No middle ground regarding this topic.

Err no, why should a woman have to suffer, getting raped wasnt her choice, having sex unprotected, or sleeping around in the first place, is.

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FirstDiscovery

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#100 FirstDiscovery
Member since 2008 • 5508 Posts
[QUOTE="escapeoftheape"]TC, you are narrow minded. what if the baby is born without skin and has to suffer all her life? are you so evil you want her to live a life of misery because "its murder"? you obivously didnt think this through. people who take abortion usually have good reasons to do this. if you dont let them, they will get needles and stick them in their ****** and kill both them and their baby. if this is what makes you happy, you disgust me.

How often does that happen:? And again, in the cases that the child will endanger the mother or will turn out severely ill, then in such a case abortion isnt a prolem.