Why is the United States constantly bashed?

[QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="jointed"]

There are currently 15.000 European troops in Afghanistan...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Security_Assistance_Force

Germany, Sweden and Bulgaria are in charge of the northern provinces. France, turkey and the US are in charge of the western ones...:roll:

jointed

Don't do what again? You're the one lurking around waiting for another pro American comment to show up so you can compliment it :roll:

Anyway, your logic fails. It doesn't matter whether Europe is a nation or not. The European nations' defense policy and actions have to be ratified by the EU parliament...making it a united operation.

And the size of the US is much larger than any individual European member state.

[QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="jointed"]

There are currently 15.000 European troops in Afghanistan...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Security_Assistance_Force

Germany, Sweden and Bulgaria are in charge of the northern provinces. France, turkey and the US are in charge of the western ones...:roll:

blackngold29

Don't do what again? You're the one lurking around waiting for another pro American comment to show up so you can compliment it :roll:

Anyway, your logic fails. It doesn't matter whether Europe is a nation or not. The European nations' defense policy and actions have to be ratified by the EU parliament...making it a united operation.

And the size of the US is much larger than any individual European member state.

So?

[QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="jointed"]

There are currently 15.000 European troops in Afghanistan...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Security_Assistance_Force

Germany, Sweden and Bulgaria are in charge of the northern provinces. France, turkey and the US are in charge of the western ones...:roll:

jointed

Don't do what again? You're the one lurking around waiting for another pro American comment to show up so you can compliment it :roll:

Anyway, your logic fails. It doesn't matter whether Europe is a nation or not. The European nations' defense policy and actions have to be ratified by the EU parliament...making it a united operation.

And the size of the US is much larger than any individual European member state.

So?

I don't hate America but you sometimes can be quite annoying.

- your obssesion with guns baffles me

- accent (personally lol)

- the fact you get all electrical goods early and cheap

- The fact that some of you are arrogant (automatically assuming America is the best country in the world to live)

These are all minor things and very personal reasons Every country has flaw. I don't see how people can hate america though

I don't hate America but you sometimes can be quite annoying.

- your obssesion with guns baffles me

- accent (personally lol)

- the fact you get all electrical goods early and cheap

- The fact that some of you are arrogant (automatically assuming America is the best country in the world to live)

These are all minor things and very personal reasons Every country has flaw. I don't see how people can hate america though

monkeysrfat

Not everyone has an obseesion with guns.

Accent? Which one? We have several....and not all the non American accents are pleasing to the ears as well.;)

Electronics?

I've noticed citizens from other countries being arrogant about their own country.

- your obssesion with guns baffles me

- the fact you get all electrical goods early and cheap

- The fact that some of you are arrogant (automatically assuming America is the best country in the world to live)

monkeysrfat

[QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="jointed"]

There are currently 15.000 European troops in Afghanistan...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Security_Assistance_Force

Germany, Sweden and Bulgaria are in charge of the northern provinces. France, turkey and the US are in charge of the western ones...:roll:

blackngold29

Don't do what again? You're the one lurking around waiting for another pro American comment to show up so you can compliment it :roll:

Anyway, your logic fails. It doesn't matter whether Europe is a nation or not. The European nations' defense policy and actions have to be ratified by the EU parliament...making it a united operation.

And the size of the US is much larger than any individual European member state.

So?

1. The EU is a supranational union and not a country.

2. I wasn't comparing the two.

[QUOTE="The_Last_Ride"]You also have to add the ignorance when they come to country and think everyone can speak perfect english and everything is made just for americans to see. That's the way i feel here in Norway at least.blackngold29

Well for americans there is truly only one

[QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="The_Last_Ride"]You also have to add the ignorance when they come to country and think everyone can speak perfect english and everything is made just for americans to see. That's the way i feel here in Norway at least.The_Last_Ride

Well for americans there is truly only one

[QUOTE="monkeysrfat"]

I don't hate America but you sometimes can be quite annoying.

- your obssesion with guns baffles me

- accent (personally lol)

- the fact you get all electrical goods early and cheap

- The fact that some of you are arrogant (automatically assuming America is the best country in the world to live)

These are all minor things and very personal reasons Every country has flaw. I don't see how people can hate america though

LJS9502_basic

Not everyone has an obseesion with guns.

Accent? Which one? We have several....and not all the non American accents are pleasing to the ears as well.;)

Electronics?

I've noticed citizens from other countries being arrogant about their own country.

I stil don't believe its good that people can get guns easily in America

Its personal, but to me its annoying

Well I live in Australia so for instance I was pissed off when Medal of honor heroes 2 came out here with no online.

So have I but I've noticed Americans often saying that there country is the best place to live.

[QUOTE="monkeysrfat"]

- your obssesion with guns baffles me

- the fact you get all electrical goods early and cheap

- The fact that some of you are arrogant (automatically assuming America is the best country in the world to live)

blackngold29

Second one is more of jealousy that annoys me sometimes, although usually it isn't an issue.

Well I live in Australia so for instance I was pissed off when Medal of honor heroes 2 came out here with no online.monkeysrfat

- thinking you guys are all that great and are obove europe/asia

whoody12

Sure, your average redneck who lives in a trailer and wears an American flag bandana over his balding head will say that but I'm pretty sure most of us think of the world as just full of people. Nobody is "better" than anybody else because of what country they live in.

[QUOTE="DeeJayInphinity"][QUOTE="The_Last_Ride"]

You also have to add the ignorance when they come to country and think everyone can speak perfect english and everything is made just for americans to see. That's the way i feel here in Norway at least.

dsmccracken

There are plenty of reasons to love America. Being a tv junky, I consume vast quantities of American media... music also. I have American relatives. If I had to live anywhere other than where I am, NYC would be my first choice. However, the TC DID ask why people bash the U.S., not why they praise it.

[QUOTE="whoody12"]

- thinking you guys are all that great and are obove europe/asia

MajorSport

Sure, your average redneck who lives in a trailer and wears an American flag bandana over his balding head will say that but I'm pretty sure most of us think of the world as just full of people. Nobody is "better" than anybody else because of what country they live in.

Well I must admit one thing that the US government has annoyed me about is this constant throwing around of "evil". The last time we did this, we were burning innocent people at the stake for witchcraft.

I am an American. I really like America, but I do understand that it has it flaws. My question is what can we as regular citizens do to change these flaws? Lets say that I had proof, solid evidence that the government went after Iraq for personal gain and that the 911 incident was created by are government, you know damn well that I would disappear. There are to many ignorant citizens out there and everyone who tries to warn them or tell the truth will most likely be killed.DireOwl

:roll: Please don't start the 911 conspiracy again....

I am an American. I really like America, but I do understand that it has it flaws. My question is what can we as regular citizens do to change these flaws? Lets say that I had proof, solid evidence that the government went after Iraq for personal gain and that the 911 incident was created by are government, you know damn well that I would disappear. There are to many ignorant citizens out there and everyone who tries to warn them or tell the truth will most likely be killed.DireOwl

The greatest tool you have is your vote. Don't reelect those who misled you. I know you were talking in the hypothetical, but you don't really believe that 9/11 was staged do you?

[QUOTE="DireOwl"]I am an American. I really like America, but I do understand that it has it flaws. My question is what can we as regular citizens do to change these flaws? Lets say that I had proof, solid evidence that the government went after Iraq for personal gain and that the 911 incident was created by are government, you know damn well that I would disappear. There are to many ignorant citizens out there and everyone who tries to warn them or tell the truth will most likely be killed.LJS9502_basic

:roll: Please don't start the 911 conspiracy again....

Sorry, I am not trying to start it again, I just used it as an example. What I am trying to say is the government has are balls in a vice. And if you try and fight, you will loose.

[QUOTE="DireOwl"]I am an American. I really like America, but I do understand that it has it flaws. My question is what can we as regular citizens do to change these flaws? Lets say that I had proof, solid evidence that the government went after Iraq for personal gain and that the 911 incident was created by are government, you know damn well that I would disappear. There are to many ignorant citizens out there and everyone who tries to warn them or tell the truth will most likely be killed.dsmccracken

The greatest tool you have is your vote. Don't reelect those who misled you. I know you were talking in the hypothetical, but you don't really believe that 9/11 was staged do you?

No, I don't.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="DireOwl"]I am an American. I really like America, but I do understand that it has it flaws. My question is what can we as regular citizens do to change these flaws? Lets say that I had proof, solid evidence that the government went after Iraq for personal gain and that the 911 incident was created by are government, you know damn well that I would disappear. There are to many ignorant citizens out there and everyone who tries to warn them or tell the truth will most likely be killed.DireOwl

:roll: Please don't start the 911 conspiracy again....

Sorry, I am not trying to start it again, I just used it as an example. What I am trying to say is the government has are balls in a vice. And if you try and fight, you will loose.

Voting solves that.;)

[QUOTE="DireOwl"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="DireOwl"]I am an American. I really like America, but I do understand that it has it flaws. My question is what can we as regular citizens do to change these flaws? Lets say that I had proof, solid evidence that the government went after Iraq for personal gain and that the 911 incident was created by are government, you know damn well that I would disappear. There are to many ignorant citizens out there and everyone who tries to warn them or tell the truth will most likely be killed.LJS9502_basic

:roll: Please don't start the 911 conspiracy again....

Sorry, I am not trying to start it again, I just used it as an example. What I am trying to say is the government has are balls in a vice. And if you try and fight, you will loose.

Voting solves that.;)

True.

[QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="whoody12"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="whoody12"]

becouse they are easy targetted ? so many things US did wrong

and in OT it is common too confront somebody with its mistakes, not it's things he did

whoody12

-vietnam

-iraq

-funding alquida(zomg spelling)

-violating human rights

and much more

- Vietnam, fighting again communism is useless

-Iraq, the government KNEW that there weren't any chemical weapons

- Soulja boy, no need to explain

-funding alquida in the 80's so that they could become in total power in Iraq

- violating human rights : only can think of 1 example right now, Napalm

- thinking they are the only important country in this world

- over patriotic, zomg babtist church

- thinking you guys are all that great and are obove europe/asia

[QUOTE="whoody12"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="whoody12"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="whoody12"]

becouse they are easy targetted ? so many things US did wrong

and in OT it is common too confront somebody with its mistakes, not it's things he did

LoeJance

-vietnam

-iraq

-funding alquida(zomg spelling)

-violating human rights

and much more

- Vietnam, fighting again communism is useless

-Iraq, the government KNEW that there weren't any chemical weapons

- Soulja boy, no need to explain

-funding alquida in the 80's so that they could become in total power in Iraq

- violating human rights : only can think of 1 example right now, Napalm

- thinking they are the only important country in this world

- over patriotic, zomg babtist church

- thinking you guys are all that great and are obove europe/asia

Really? You get that impression from a lot or Bulgarians and Malasians, do you?

Why the United States are constantly bashed (and examples):

1. The illusion of the "American Dream" which has polluted the ideals of other nations.
2. The ideology that any way of doing things other than their own way is wrong, or undemocratic.
3. Involving themselves in situations where they are not needed or wanted.
4. A hyper-patriotic mindset that so many American citizens have.
5. Their general butchering of the English language.
6. Hypocrisy over Communist nations.
7. Ignores the UN.

-------------------------

And the examples:

1. Other nations in the world wanting liberties or rights because America has them (In Germany, for example, people were protesting the non-existence of a minimum wage, when they were doing fine without one. However, because America has one, they want one).
2. Critisism of North Korea for possession of nuclear weapons.
3. Korean War, Vietnam, Iraq (twice), Afghanistan.
4. (Just view some above comment and you'll find some great examples)
5. Color, Labor, Center, "Speak English Good".
6. Hates Cuba, on good terms with China.
7. Invasion of Iraq (well, that's obvious)

[QUOTE="LoeJance"][QUOTE="whoody12"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="whoody12"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="whoody12"]

becouse they are easy targetted ? so many things US did wrong

and in OT it is common too confront somebody with its mistakes, not it's things he did

dsmccracken

-vietnam

-iraq

-funding alquida(zomg spelling)

-violating human rights

and much more

- Vietnam, fighting again communism is useless

-Iraq, the government KNEW that there weren't any chemical weapons

- Soulja boy, no need to explain

-funding alquida in the 80's so that they could become in total power in Iraq

- violating human rights : only can think of 1 example right now, Napalm

- thinking they are the only important country in this world

- over patriotic, zomg babtist church

- thinking you guys are all that great and are obove europe/asia

Really? You get that impression from a lot or Bulgarians and Malasians, do you?

Why the United States are constantly bashed (and examples):

1. The illusion of the "American Dream" which has polluted the ideals of other nations.
2. The ideology that any way of doing things other than their own way is wrong, or undemocratic.
3. Involving themselves in situations where they are not needed or wanted.
4. A hyper-patriotic mindset that so many American citizens have.
5. Their general butchering of the English language.
6. Hypocrisy over Communist nations.
7. Ignores the UN.

-------------------------

And the examples:

1. Other nations in the world wanting liberties or rights because America has them (In Germany, for example, people were protesting the non-existence of a minimum wage, when they were doing fine without one. However, because America has one, they want one).
2. Critisism of North Korea for possession of nuclear weapons.
3. Korean War, Vietnam, Iraq (twice), Afghanistan.
4. (Just view some above comment and you'll find some great examples)
5. Color, Labor, Center, "Speak English Good".
6. Hates Cuba, on good terms with China.
7. Invasion of Iraq (well, that's obvious)

'Nuff said.ineedanap

On the language thing... language evolves, especially in isolation. The word "english" itself was once spelled Englysh... so I don't see that as a fair criticism. That said, I cringe at the thought of the word "night" finally mutating into "nite."

On the North Korea thing... I mean c'mon, Kim is bat-**** crazy! Can't we all agree that him with nuclear weaponry is dangerous? The guy claims that he gets a hole-in-one on every hole every time he plays golf for pete's sake! Further, in regards to Afghanistan, that was pretty necessary IMO.

I can live with the rest of your post. The first item had me scratching my head though.

[QUOTE="ineedanap"]

Why the United States are constantly bashed (and examples):

1. The illusion of the "American Dream" which has polluted the ideals of other nations.
2. The ideology that any way of doing things other than their own way is wrong, or undemocratic.
3. Involving themselves in situations where they are not needed or wanted.
4. A hyper-patriotic mindset that so many American citizens have.
5. Their general butchering of the English language.
6. Hypocrisy over Communist nations.
7. Ignores the UN.

-------------------------

And the examples:

1. Other nations in the world wanting liberties or rights because America has them (In Germany, for example, people were protesting the non-existence of a minimum wage, when they were doing fine without one. However, because America has one, they want one).
2. Critisism of North Korea for possession of nuclear weapons.
3. Korean War, Vietnam, Iraq (twice), Afghanistan.
4. (Just view some above comment and you'll find some great examples)
5. Color, Labor, Center, "Speak English Good".
6. Hates Cuba, on good terms with China.
7. Invasion of Iraq (well, that's obvious)

'Nuff said.dsmccracken

On the language thing... language evolves, especially in isolation. The word "english" itself was once spelled Englysh... so I don't see that as a fair criticism. That said, I cringe at the thought of the word "night" finally mutating into "nite."

On the North Korea thing... I mean c'mon, Kim is bat-**** crazy! Can't we all agree that him with nuclear weaponry is dangerous? The guy claims that he gets a hole-in-one on every hole every time he plays golf for pete's sake! Further, in regards to Afghanistan, that was pretty necessary IMO.

I can live with the rest of your post. The first item had me scratching my head though.

Do you understand that what Kim is doing is a political tactic.. He wants to appear mad to other nations, meaning that any of his demands are made will most likely be obeyed.. HE actually had this to work in the early 90s with a large sum of money to shut up.. Its political chicken nothing more nothing less, if he were clearly mad his generals would have shot him long ago.

Ah, I'm from Canada, and I personally love America, a lot of things there are just so cool! However, your eating portions in resurants aren't realistic. I was never fully finishing my plate of food, our portions up here are just smaller more human like :P. One more thing as well is that you guys can be very rude, oh and you don't like to cover up your ghettos I took one wrong turn in Buffalo and thought someone was going to steal my car. It was like -20 out and there were random people standing on the side walks looking off in space.-R3Vo

I love it when people use excuses like that, like other countries are completely free of rude people. Also, don't judge everyone based a few people you met.

[QUOTE="Second_Rook"][QUOTE="whoody12"][QUOTE="Second_Rook"][QUOTE="whoody12"][QUOTE="Second_Rook"][QUOTE="whoody12"]

- violating human rights : only can think of 1 example right now, Napalm

whoody12

WW2 was a cataclysmic event and could only be brought to an end with something as drastic and obscene as a nuclear weapon. Somebody had to do it.

plz, read a book about nuclear weapons before you ever post again on GS

thanks

What do you reccomend and which have you read?

start with the basic, nuclear weapons stand far from napalm

Is that so? I will need a title.

Napalm = a bomb with a certain combination of oil, that can reach a temperature of 1200C

nuclear = a way to split alot of atoms with a small explosion

one atom is split and that starts a chain reaction which results in the explosion.

[QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="whoody12"]

becouse they are easy targetted ? so many things US did wrong

and in OT it is common too confront somebody with its mistakes, not it's things he did

whoody12

-vietnam

-iraq

-soulja boy

-funding alquida(zomg spelling)

-violating human rights

and much more

the same can be said for any country. Seriously, you cant bash the US without being a hipocrite. Like that old saying, "let he without sin cast the first stone".

Except for Soulja Boy, I am ashamed my country has produced that.

We do have a certain arrogence to ourselves, however. I can remember travelling to Europe and Asia a few times and running into a few other Americans and being ashamed of them. In all honesty, however, I feel this arrogence is the result of them assuming they would be bashed while abroad, and thus projecting a aura of arrogence to shield themselves.

Honestly, though, I wish anyone who hated the US would just come here for a year. I wish leaders of Al Queda could come to San Francisco or New York and see that we have a Jewish temple one place, a Muslim mosque across the street, and a Catholic church up the street two blocks. And I saw far more anti-Muslim sentiments while in England than I ever have in the US. I go to a fairly conservative college (half the peeps are farmers) and I never once saw a muslim get discriminated against.

If you want to know what peace is, come to Northern California

[QUOTE="whoody12"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="whoody12"]

becouse they are easy targetted ? so many things US did wrong

and in OT it is common too confront somebody with its mistakes, not it's things he did

mrbojangles25

-vietnam

-iraq

-soulja boy

-funding alquida(zomg spelling)

-violating human rights

and much more

the same can be said for any country. Seriously, you cant bash the US without being a hipocrite. Like that old saying, "let he without sin cast the first stone".

Except for Soulja Boy, I am ashamed my country has produced that.

We do have a certain arrogence to ourselves, however. I can remember travelling to Europe and Asia a few times and running into a few other Americans and being ashamed of them. In all honesty, however, I feel this arrogence is the result of them assuming they would be bashed while abroad, and thus projecting a aura of arrogence to shield themselves.

Honestly, though, I wish anyone who hated the US would just come here for a year. I wish leaders of Al Queda could come to San Francisco or New York and see that we have a Jewish temple one place, a Muslim mosque across the street, and a Catholic church up the street two blocks. And I saw far more anti-Muslim sentiments while in England than I ever have in the US. I go to a fairly conservative college (half the peeps are farmers) and I never once saw a muslim get discriminated against.

If you want to know what peace is, come to Northern California

Your AQ spheel makes no sense, agents never had a change of mine when they stayed here in disguise before 9/11.. I am pretty certain the leaders would not change their mind either..

I love it when people use excuses like that, like other countries are completely free of rude people. Also, don't judge everyone based a few people you met.

firebreathing

Can I just point out that this criticism is repeated again and again and again, in this tiny forum and thousands just like it. With that many people saying the same thing, you can't accept that it might be even minutely possible that we have a point? Unless you think we've all met the same 3 rude Americans.

[QUOTE="firebreathing"]

I love it when people use excuses like that, like other countries are completely free of rude people. Also, don't judge everyone based a few people you met.

dsmccracken

Can I just point out that this criticism is repeated again and again and again, in this tiny forum and thousands just like it. With that many people saying the same thing, you can't accept that it might be even minutely possible that we have a point? Unless you think we've all met the same 3 rude Americans.

Then I guess it's okay to judge the other countries by the worst I've encountered on these forums? Some people choose to believe stereotypes....without any personal knowledge. Most of the world hasn't had one on one encounters with Americans...so how do they get these ideas? Oh yeah....stereotypes.:roll:

Why the United States are constantly bashed (and examples):

1. The illusion of the "American Dream" which has polluted the ideals of other nations.
2. The ideology that any way of doing things other than their own way is wrong, or undemocratic.
3. Involving themselves in situations where they are not needed or wanted.
4. A hyper-patriotic mindset that so many American citizens have.
5. Their general butchering of the English language.
6. Hypocrisy over Communist nations.
7. Ignores the UN.

-------------------------

And the examples:

1. Other nations in the world wanting liberties or rights because America has them (In Germany, for example, people were protesting the non-existence of a minimum wage, when they were doing fine without one. However, because America has one, they want one). I fail to see how this is our fault. Yes, it our idea, if another country wants to adopt however it then becomes their concern and their problem. We did not force this upon them.
2. Critisism of North Korea for possession of nuclear weapons. Are you saying we shouldnt be scared of a small, poor country with a crazy dictator? Nuclear weapons have been used in one war, and never since then. I think it would be the duty of every country to make sure that those countries without nukes dont get them. While I do wish my own country would disarm, I understand why it won't (same with Russia) but that doesnt mean everyone should get nukes just because we do. I understand why this argument is confusing but I hope you see the reasoning.
3. Korean War, Vietnam, Iraq (twice), Afghanistan. It was called the Cold War. Nobody is proud of it, but everyone chose a side...Europe chose the West, and the East chosr Russia. Everyone shares the guilt for the majority of the conflicts there. As for Iraq, well, we were asked the first time, and the second time well thats our bad lol.
4. (Just view some above comment and you'll find some great examples) This is a stereotype. ""nuff said" you might say. Also, this classifies you as prejudiced.
5. Color, Labor, Center, "Speak English Good". Like someone said, language evolves. You might as well hate Mexico for ruining Spanish...
6. Hates Cuba, on good terms with China. China is Communist like the Pope is Jewish. China encourages private ownership and enterprise, freedom of religion, and other great things like that. Cuba essentially ruined their own people's lives, and lets not forget about the Cuban Missile Crisis.
7. Invasion of Iraq (well, that's obvious) I agree with you on this example. But what makes the UN right, and the US (or any other country for that matter) wrong? What if a country really did have nukes targeted at Israel? Are we supposed to wait and get proof? I think thats what happened before in Iraq and as a result a few hundred thousand Kurds got gassed because Saddam HID HIS LABS FROM UN INSPECTORS!

'Nuff said.ineedanap

[QUOTE="firebreathing"]

I love it when people use excuses like that, like other countries are completely free of rude people. Also, don't judge everyone based a few people you met.

dsmccracken

Can I just point out that this criticism is repeated again and again and again, in this tiny forum and thousands just like it. With that many people saying the same thing, you can't accept that it might be even minutely possible that we have a point? Unless you think we've all met the same 3 rude Americans.

[QUOTE="Dantes_Monkey"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="Dantes_Monkey"]

hiroshima, that was pretty damn bad. altrhough did effectively help end world war 2...which then lead right into the cold war >_dsmccracken

I do wish they hadn't dropped the bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, or more accurately I wish it hadn't been necessary. If only they could have just continued to firebomb the place into the stone age. It would have cost more Japanese lives, but at least the U.S. wouldn't be on record as the only nuclear aggressor on the planet.

explain the second bomb? the first was enough to show american superiority and end any war with japan.

The second bomb was a) because Japan didn't surrender after the 1st... and b) to prove that the first one wasn't a prototype, a unique "one-off."

still not sold buddy, but i do concede that i may not know everything about the incident. However, can you really justify the means by the ends?

[QUOTE="DireOwl"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="DireOwl"]I am an American. I really like America, but I do understand that it has it flaws. My question is what can we as regular citizens do to change these flaws? Lets say that I had proof, solid evidence that the government went after Iraq for personal gain and that the 911 incident was created by are government, you know damn well that I would disappear. There are to many ignorant citizens out there and everyone who tries to warn them or tell the truth will most likely be killed.LJS9502_basic

:roll: Please don't start the 911 conspiracy again....

your system is hardly ythe most democratic mehod though

Sorry, I am not trying to start it again, I just used it as an example. What I am trying to say is the government has are balls in a vice. And if you try and fight, you will loose.

Voting solves that.;)

your system is not as democratic as you like to think. could be worse though

[QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="firebreathing"]

I love it when people use excuses like that, like other countries are completely free of rude people. Also, don't judge everyone based a few people you met.

LJS9502_basic

Can I just point out that this criticism is repeated again and again and again, in this tiny forum and thousands just like it. With that many people saying the same thing, you can't accept that it might be even minutely possible that we have a point? Unless you think we've all met the same 3 rude Americans.

Then I guess it's okay to judge the other countries by the worst I've encountered on these forums? Some people choose to believe stereotypes....without any personal knowledge. Most of the world hasn't had one on one encounters with Americans...so how do they get these ideas? Oh yeah....stereotypes.:roll:

[QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="Dantes_Monkey"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="Dantes_Monkey"]

hiroshima, that was pretty damn bad. altrhough did effectively help end world war 2...which then lead right into the cold war >_Dantes_Monkey

I do wish they hadn't dropped the bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, or more accurately I wish it hadn't been necessary. If only they could have just continued to firebomb the place into the stone age. It would have cost more Japanese lives, but at least the U.S. wouldn't be on record as the only nuclear aggressor on the planet.

explain the second bomb? the first was enough to show american superiority and end any war with japan.

The second bomb was a) because Japan didn't surrender after the 1st... and b) to prove that the first one wasn't a prototype, a unique "one-off."

still not sold buddy, but i do concede that i may not know everything about the incident. However, can you really justify the means by the ends?

Ive been to Hiroshima. I went to the museum. And that is exactly why the second bomb was dropped. The Japanese said so themselves.

And yes, I can justify the means. I mean, you add the word "nuclear" to anything and it becomes tainted but really...is it much worse than the alternative? These were the options:

1. Invade Japan, costing US and Japanese lives that would likely go to the millions (Japan was very much a bushido culture still, so surrender in the face of conventional warfare just wouldnt happen).

2. Keep firebombing. This is the worst, I actually wish they dropped the atom bomb earlier just to prevent this. But this would have kept occuring wel into the late 40s, devastating

3. Drop a couple atom bombs, shocking the Japanese into surrender.

And people think that Nagasaki and Hiroshima were just cities full of regular joes...they werent. Hiroshima was a military city. They produced weapons of war. The schools there were taken over by the military so kids would become soldiers and officers at age 15. It really was a valid target.

If you don't like us then go back to your 3rd world country where you make 5 cents a day. Fine by me.Ghost_702

[QUOTE="Ghost_702"]If you don't like us then go back to your 3rd world country where you make 5 cents a day. Fine by me.blackngold29

But they do in Israel. Now quick, go bash them! If ever a country deserved to be bashed, its the home of the Jews!

[QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="Ghost_702"]If you don't like us then go back to your 3rd world country where you make 5 cents a day. Fine by me.mrbojangles25

But they do in Israel. Now quick, go bash them! If ever a country deserved to be bashed, its the home of the Jews!

[QUOTE="mrbojangles25"]

[QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="Ghost_702"]If you don't like us then go back to your 3rd world country where you make 5 cents a day. Fine by me.quiglythegreat

But they do in Israel. Now quick, go bash them! If ever a country deserved to be bashed, its the home of the Jews!

[QUOTE="mrbojangles25"][QUOTE="whoody12"][QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="whoody12"]

becouse they are easy targetted ? so many things US did wrong

and in OT it is common too confront somebody with its mistakes, not it's things he did

sSubZerOo

-vietnam

-iraq

-soulja boy

-funding alquida(zomg spelling)

-violating human rights

and much more

the same can be said for any country. Seriously, you cant bash the US without being a hipocrite. Like that old saying, "let he without sin cast the first stone".

Except for Soulja Boy, I am ashamed my country has produced that.

We do have a certain arrogence to ourselves, however. I can remember travelling to Europe and Asia a few times and running into a few other Americans and being ashamed of them. In all honesty, however, I feel this arrogence is the result of them assuming they would be bashed while abroad, and thus projecting a aura of arrogence to shield themselves.

Honestly, though, I wish anyone who hated the US would just come here for a year. I wish leaders of Al Queda could come to San Francisco or New York and see that we have a Jewish temple one place, a Muslim mosque across the street, and a Catholic church up the street two blocks. And I saw far more anti-Muslim sentiments while in England than I ever have in the US. I go to a fairly conservative college (half the peeps are farmers) and I never once saw a muslim get discriminated against.

If you want to know what peace is, come to Northern California

Your AQ spheel makes no sense, agents never had a change of mine when they stayed here in disguise before 9/11.. I am pretty certain the leaders would not change their mind either..

sure they did. they got totally trashed off grain alchohol and went to stripclubs. that is something they definately could not do back home.

[QUOTE="quiglythegreat"][QUOTE="mrbojangles25"]

[QUOTE="blackngold29"][QUOTE="Ghost_702"]If you don't like us then go back to your 3rd world country where you make 5 cents a day. Fine by me.EboyLOL

But they do in Israel. Now quick, go bash them! If ever a country deserved to be bashed, its the home of the Jews!