The best way to answer your question is to direct you to the Mass Effect 2 PC demo available here :-

http://masseffect.bioware.com/

The demo is about 2gbs in size and comes with two missions that should give you a good idea of what the combat is like, My own personal view is that there isn't much strategy involved at all with Mass Effect 2 combat. But you might as well give the demo ago and see what you think. I can't really comment on which has more content because I have never played Dragon Age. But ME 2 took me close to 30 hours with my first playthrough and that was leaving some of the side missions out.

The value of the game is determined by the price you buy it for. And the "value for your money" can't be the same for everyone. Like I said, lots of people don't care for PC games or mods so, no, the value for your money is always subjective to what the customer wants. Again, lots of people don't care at all for the mods or the console. Some people may find better value in knowing that the 360 will be getting the official DLC first. It's all for the custommer to decide. But the core value of the game is always determined by the price you pay for it.

Read through the thread, maybe like uhhh I don't know the second post? I know vgchartz is **** I said it first.

Prexxus

I did not mention mods at all in my post, the improved graphics and cloud saving are part of the PC version and not part of the console version. So right there we are getting "more" than the console version are we not ? So you are arguing that the PC version which is cheaper and comes with better features than the console version is not "better value" I mean seriously come on here. I find it hard to see how anyone can argue that something that costs more and has fewer features is better value than something that costs less and has more features.

As for my last paragraph that was just me making a comment on topic, it was not specifically aimed at you but aimed at people that seem to still believe this kind of rubbish that gets posted time and time again.

Also, it dosen't take 2 copies retail to match 1 downloaded. Game companies barely spend anything in packaging/shipping because they have great partnerships and deals. Steam also takes cuts from the sales aswell as retail stores.Prexxus

The 2 copies scenario is probably slightly off the mark but not by much, there are clear cost savings with the PC version. In three key areas :-

Market Development Fund - paying for good product placement on shop shelves and instore shop advertising accounts for 5% of a games price. I believe this cost is not present in the DD versions.

Manufacturing costs and packaging - this accounts for another 5% of the games budget which again isn't present in the DD version of the game.

Distribution costs - eat up about 1.5% of the game budget again it is hard to see DD copies costing as much as that to distribute.

http://www.forbes.com/2006/12/19/ps3-xbox360-costs-tech-cx_rr_game06_1219expensivegames_slide_2.html?thisSpeed=undefined

So right there you have a 12% saving if your game is sold on any of the Digital Distribution channels. An extra 12% of revenue on the PC version that you won't see on the console version. So yeah whilst not exactly a "second copy" it is still a fairly significant amount in my books.

Sorry but this has stupid written all over it. The PC version has no more value then the others at all. If anything the PS3 version may be a bit more"valuable" because it's a blue ray disk... How you came up with the idea of the PC version having double or tripple the value is beyond me. *shaking head*Prexxus

It could be argued the PC version does have more value or at least "value for money" over the console version. In the UK Fallout NV is £24.99 on the PC and £37.99 on the consoles. So right there we are definitely getting more "value for our money". The PC also has enhancements over the console version such as better graphics and features such as cloud saving.

So we get essentially the same "game" as the consoles at a massively lower price and we get enhancements to the PC version that sounds like better value than the console version to me.

It could also be argued that the PC version is more "valuable" to publishers/developers too. They probably see more revenue per copy sold on the PC than they do on the console especially if that purchase has been done via steam (which is more than likely in this day and age). So to match the revenue from one copy sold on the PC you may find they need to sell at least 2 copies on the console due to reduced production and distribution costs involved with the PC version.

At the end of the day you have to ask this question "why are companies still producing PC versions of their games if they are selling as badly as VGchartz, NPD, the tooth fairy keep stating ?". The answer is simply because PC software sales do not do as badly as these fortune tellers try to make out but some gamers fall for the doom and gloom articles every time.

Well first off make sure you are not actually in first person mode, Fallout NV is designed to be played viewed either in first person or third person. Press the F key on your keyboard to toggle between first and third person view.

If that doesn't help the next step is to verify the files have downloaded correctly. To do this go to steam and RIGHT click on Fallout NV, from the drop down menu, select "properties". A box comes up in that box click the "local files" tab and on that screen click "verify integrity of game cache". This will make steam scan the downloaded files and check that the files have been downloaded correctly. After the scan has finished it will automatically redownload any corrupt files.

For the record I haven't seen anyone complaining about this issue you are having so it could be a difficult issue to solve.

I'm on the same level as you and agree with everything you said. Except i haven't yet encountered a bug that didn't let me finish a quest or screw up something.GeneralShowzer

The only quest killing bug I have come across is the monorail one (I won't say more for fear of spoiling it) suffice to say if you don't do the monorail quest in a specific way then it always ends in a bad outcome. The main annoyance for me at the moment is the constant crashing which can be either every 10 mins or the game can last hours without crashing. Needless to say I quick save every couple of minutes and main save every 30 minutes. I don't need to worry about cloud saving screwing things up because I play off line and thankfully it only takes 20 odd seconds to restart the game after a crash.

Now sure we shouldn't have to put up with this in this day and age but as games get more sophisticated and time constraints get worse then the situation is just going to get worse I am afraid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToKIkw3LIoQ

lol

FatSlasH

The funny thing about that "bug" is that it isn't a bug in the actual game :-

Hines also suggested that for the spinning head bug, players should re-verify their files on Steam as the problem stems from a "corrupt mesh file."Hines

http://www.vg247.com/2010/10/20/fallout-new-vegas-patches-on-the-way-says-bethesda/

Now I don't mean to defend Bethesda or Oblivion both Fallout 3 and NV were ambitious open world games. There seems to be a tradtion that open world games tend to be extremely buggy and that probably won't change any time soon. I think another part of the issue is the fact they are pushing the gamebryo engine beyond what it is capable of doing couple that with the fact it doesn't particularly sit well with new PC tech and it is just asking for problems.

Now bugs aside I have had a load of fun with the game so far, I have spent 71 hours playing Fallout NV since release and I will admit the bugs are annoying but I am still having lots of fun with the game and getting my money worth.

If you are not happy with the way Fallout NV turned out then all I can suggest is you chalk this up to a lesson learned. In future don't buy Bethesda products if you are expecting a 100% flawless game (that includes not buying the console version either because they aren't flawless).

If you decide to go with the digital version then save a bit of cash and stay well clear of the "Digital Deluxe Version" it really offers nothing above the standard version except a crappy collector armoured suit and a crappy collector gun. You probably won't use the armour once it is that rubbish, you may use the gun once, just long enough to see how crap it is and never use it again ;)

As to those waiting for a GOTY edition, I am not 100% convinced there is going to be one yet. The standard version of Mass Effect 2 comes on 2 discs, the DLC so far is coming close to maxxing out a third disc and there is more DLC rumoured to be coming. So a GOTY edition will require four discs this would make it prohibitively expensive on the xbox 360 not to mention it would require a crap load of disc swapping. I know this is a PC forum but I think we can safely say if they don't do a 360 version GOTY then they sure as hell won't bother with a PC version.

It should also be noted that in 2009 Microsoft had to ban 1 MILLION xbox consoles because of piracy :-

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13772_3-10395265-52.html

Not 100, not 1,000, not 10,000 but 1,000,000 xbox consoles and that was just those they could detect. It should also be noted that whilst those 1,000,000 consoles are now banned from xbox live it does not prevent them from playing single player games. So please don't try and pass piracy on the consoles off as some sort of "minor" inconvenience that has no impact. Now if you couple that with the problem of second hand sales and game rental on the consoles it isn't unfair to say that revenue loss on consoles is just as bad as revenue loss on the PC.

When I last looked into it the Xbox 360 required a mod chip which in total costes about £100. Also you need dual layer DVD's to burn which are expensive and rare. Also they games are always 12GB's which is massive. Nope PC piracy is easier!

Daytona_178

You might want to look again because all three of those facts you stated are wrong. Firstly an xbox can be modded without a chip, the process is somewhat convoluted but it can be done quite easily without a "modchip"(no I have never done it since I don't own an xbox). Secondly dual layer discs are incredibly cheap for the price of ONE xbox game you can buy FIFTY dual layer dvd's. Finally games on the xbox 360 are hardly ever 12gbs, an xbox dvd can hold around 6gbs (with the other 2gbs reserved for security and promotional purposes). So most xbox games are usually around 6 - 7gbs, in fact it is usually the case that the PC version is larger in size than the xbox version, a good example is GTA 4 which is around 6gbs on the xbox and 14gbs on the PC.

Piracy on the xbox is just as easy as it is on the PC, the only difference is that the PC is actually putting up a pretty good fight against zero day piracy with very few games these days being released before the actual release date in contrast to the xbox 360 which sees nearly all their games released on the "scene" nearly 3 weeks before the official release date.

The PC Gaming Alliance (oi stop laughing at the back we all know what a joke the organisation is) have estimated that world wide the percentage of sales via Digital Download is closer to 80%

http://www.videogamesblogger.com/2010/03/11/pc-gaming-revenue-tops-13-billion-in-2009-digital-downloads-now-80-of-pc-market.htm

Either way this is VGchartz we are talking about here, that alone makes the numbers suspiciously dubious. I believe VGchartz has such a bad rep that some forums and websites actively encourage their users to NOT use VGchartz as a source. Now couple that with the fact they sampled a few retail outlets in America where the PC is weakest and it isn't surprising they got such a low figure for PC game sales.

I have absolutely no doubt Fallout NV has been a commercial success on the PC and I have no doubt we will see the another Fallout on the PC. That at the end of the day is what should matter to us not all this pathetic "omgz how many copies did it sell".