Good-Bye Nintendo (Part II) - Lying About Innovation

• A rayman sequel as a party game.
• A call of duty sequel
• A Wii Sports sequel
• A guitar hero port
• A guitar hero sequel
• An Animal Crossing sequel
• Yet another GTA portable title

the sheep are going to starve to death, if the don't have a ps3 or 360.Burning_Sun

I'm going to starve to death if Nintendo keeps holding the franchises I enjoy hostage. The rumors were that Zelda Wii or a new Kirby Crystal Shards were supposed to be coming. Instead we get ... this? And Nintendo says they're "caring" for their hardcore gamers? What Nintendo does to their "veterans" (their word... I love how they make us sound like victims of war) would quality in the real world as nursing home neglect.

Last year even after the god awful press conference, I hung onto hope seeng as the big three were just around the corner.

This time around there is no excuse.

I'll probably just stick around for animal crossing and then sell my wii.

DS can stay though...It's still good.

E3 sucked, but Zelda Wii has since been confirmed and Pikmin, Kid Icarus, and Mario are heavily hinted at. Kid IcarusMario/ZeldaZelda confirmedOld Pikmin linkfamicommander

Considering the Reggie interview on G4 about kid icarus, I HIGHLY doubt they have a kid icarus in production.

Well that's the problem with the "new" E3, it's more about impressing the industry (particularly the retail side) than impressing the fans. So rather than seeing MS, Nintendo and Sony try to one-up eachother by making the biggest splash, we get a bunch of presentations trying to convince the guys at EB/Gamestop, Best Buy and Wal-Mart to buy a couple hundred thousand more units of X, Y and Z. Why bother hyping the new Zelda when you can hype a game like Wii Sports Resort that will not only sell millions of copies on its own, but millions of Wii Motion Plus adaptors?

The only reason I am not more dissappointed by this lame excuse of a conference (I even enjoyed last year's because at least Mario Kart was shown) is because of the 3rd party games not shown. Fatal Frame, TOS2, Madworld, Conduit, as well as several others. That and the fact that Wii Motion PLus is guarenteed to be in the new Zelda.Saxsoon

Agreed, but it's kinda funny how everyone is jumping the boat all because the conferance was a lack luster suckfest but forgeting that Nintendo is actually making more games then what they show at e3.

[QUOTE="famicommander"]E3 sucked, but Zelda Wii has since been confirmed and Pikmin, Kid Icarus, and Mario are heavily hinted at. Kid IcarusMario/ZeldaZelda confirmedOld Pikmin linkice144

Considering the Reggie interview on G4 about kid icarus, I HIGHLY doubt they have a kid icarus in production.

Last year even after the god awful press conference, I hung onto hope seeng as the big three were just around the corner.

This time around there is no excuse.

I'll probably just stick around for animal crossing and then sell my wii.

DS can stay though...It's still good.

Shinobishyguy

DS is good because it gets a lot of hardcore support from third party devs. In the console world, those devs go to PC, 360, and PS3 where they can become the focus of the system. Even what few "core" games come from third parties to the Wii don't get focused on by Nintendo. Nintendo isn't showcasing the Conduit (which would boost sales) the way Sony is showcasing Resistance 2, and Microsoft is showcasing Gears of War 2.

Nintendo is forever, from this day on, barred from saying *anything* about innovation. You heard me Nintendo - shut the hell up. Yeah, that's right: SHUT. UP. FOREVER.

...Why?

[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"]

Last year even after the god awful press conference, I hung onto hope seeng as the big three were just around the corner.

This time around there is no excuse.

I'll probably just stick around for animal crossing and then sell my wii.

DS can stay though...It's still good.

subrosian

DS is good because it gets a lot of hardcore support from third party devs. In the console world, those devs go to PC, 360, and PS3 where they can become the focus of the system. Even what few "core" games come from third parties to the Wii don't get focused on by Nintendo. Nintendo isn't showcasing the Conduit (which would boost sales) the way Sony is showcasing Resistance 2, and Microsoft is showcasing Gears of War 2.

[QUOTE="subrosian"]
Nintendo is forever, from this day on, barred from saying *anything* about innovation. You heard me Nintendo - shut the hell up. Yeah, that's right: SHUT. UP. FOREVER.WAIW

...Why?

for promising the new and then giving us a sludgefest of sequels and ports.

Well that's the problem with the "new" E3, it's more about impressing the industry (particularly the retail side) than impressing the fans. So rather than seeing MS, Nintendo and Sony try to one-up eachother by making the biggest splash, we get a bunch of presentations trying to convince the guys at EB/Gamestop, Best Buy and Wal-Mart to buy a couple hundred thousand more units of X, Y and Z. Why bother hyping the new Zelda when you can hype a game like Wii Sports Resort that will not only sell millions of copies on its own, but millions of Wii Motion Plus adaptors?

PBSnipes

[QUOTE="WAIW"][QUOTE="Subrosian"]
Nintendo is forever, from this day on, barred from saying *anything* about innovation. You heard me Nintendo - shut the hell up. Yeah, that's right: SHUT. UP. FOREVER.lafigueroa

...Why?

for promising the new and then giving us a sludgefest of sequels and ports.

Too bad foryou, and who are you anyways ? I cant wait till wii music, wiisports resorts come out.blitzkid1

Maybe one day you can upgrade into being a gamer.

My God, get over yourself.

These press conferences are not intended to please YOU. They are intended to show the press and shareholders how these companies plan to make money. The real money comes from casual games. You saw it with Microsoft (Lips, 1 vs. 100), and Nintendo. And yes, Nintendo is going to make a boat load of money of the games they showed.

Anyways, we already know Pikmin 3, Zelda, Kid Icarus, and Disaster are all in development. Nintendo chose not to show them.

The gaming universe does not revolve around you.

Damn, MadWorld looks awesome. The problem with Nintendo is that they are burying the games that look interesting to play.

[QUOTE="subrosian"][QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"]

Last year even after the god awful press conference, I hung onto hope seeng as the big three were just around the corner.

This time around there is no excuse.

I'll probably just stick around for animal crossing and then sell my wii.

DS can stay though...It's still good.

Shinobishyguy

DS is good because it gets a lot of hardcore support from third party devs. In the console world, those devs go to PC, 360, and PS3 where they can become the focus of the system. Even what few "core" games come from third parties to the Wii don't get focused on by Nintendo. Nintendo isn't showcasing the Conduit (which would boost sales) the way Sony is showcasing Resistance 2, and Microsoft is showcasing Gears of War 2.

To be quite honest, the only game I'm buying on my DS in the next year is Bioware's Sonic RPG, and that's a *huge maybe*. That's only because I'm a fan of Bioware's works. I thought about getting a DS Lite, and lately even *that* system hasn't had enough hardcore games to keep me playing it. It hasn't offered something that PSN, LIVE, and STEAM digital content, or full games haven't been able to meet.

So yeah, I've said good-bye to Nintendo, as I said before, they said "good-bye' to us a long time ago. They don't genuinely focus enough on what they call "veteran gamers" to keep third parties alive on the Wii. Nintendo fans like to point at the Conduit - what did Nintendo do at E3 to help ensure that retailers buy tons of copies, and promote it heavily? What are they doing for mature-rated content on the system (no, that doesn't mean they're more mature games, but you miss out on stuff like Eternal Darkness 2 and the like if Nintendo is hesistant to promote offensive content).

My God, get over yourself.

These press conferences are not intended to please YOU. They are intended to show the press and shareholders how these companies plan to make money. The real money comes from casual games. You saw it with Microsoft (Lips, 1 vs. 100), and Nintendo. And yes, Nintendo is going to make a boat load of money of the games they showed.

Anyways, we already know Pikmin 3, Zelda, Kid Icarus, and Disaster are all in development. Nintendo chose not to show them.

The gaming universe does not revolve around you.

Nickman71

5 yeara ago I might have agreed with you

but in this age of Live conference streaming over both the Internet and Television, every word is being judged LIVE by millions of gamers around the world. And the gamers watching these conferences aren't the majority of gamers, but the ones that generally buy the most games, so it's Nintendo's dudty to satisfy those customers if they expect those customers to remain loyal.

Subrosian,

Your right it was not a good E3 for Nintendo. Is it enoght to give up on the Wii. For me no. Maybe I am a Nintendo fanboy, I just can not see a point in time where I could go without Nintendo first party games. I enjoy them too much. There is information to look forward to that we got from E3.

First the Wii got 1 to 1 motion controller getting us even closer to VR gaming

Second we there be getting voice chat on the Wii

Third we found out the local 6 player could be done

Fourth Reggie stated after E3 that the Mario team and the Zelda team are working on games

Could E3 have been better and yes Nintendo have given us more information. You know the games are being made just have to wait to find out what they are.

The gaming universe does not revolve around you.

Nickman71

Indeed, it revolves around your grandmother playing sports on a videogame console, and murdering the act of playing musical instruments by random hand motions. Sales is what we truely want in the gaming universe, games, not so much. :)

Also on a side note, the 1:1 motion example was trash, not one thing in that demonstration, looked like anything beyond what the wii-mote can already do, the sword thing was awfully repetetive actions, you would have seen variety if it was perfectly 1:1, so I don't see any of the hype for it until a game actually uses it properly.

Well that's the problem with the "new" E3, it's more about impressing the industry (particularly the retail side) than impressing the fans. So rather than seeing MS, Nintendo and Sony try to one-up eachother by making the biggest splash, we get a bunch of presentations trying to convince the guys at EB/Gamestop, Best Buy and Wal-Mart to buy a couple hundred thousand more units of X, Y and Z. Why bother hyping the new Zelda when you can hype a game like Wii Sports Resort that will not only sell millions of copies on its own, but millions of Wii Motion Plus adaptors?

PBSnipes

This is what most fanboys don't understand. These confrences aren't for us... they never were, and are even less for us now then ever before.

If you didn't notice Microsoft is trying to market it's new services and justfiy them, they showed that they want a piece of the casual pie.

Sony didn't have much in their confrence either, it was mostly about services and not about making the hardcore gamers happy, though they did a little bit of that.

Nintendo really does understand what E3 is about though. That's why they are winning now. They use E3 to sell the main stream press on ideas, and games that Won't sell themselves.

If they released a new Zelda Game tomorrow it would sell, they don't need to hype what's already sold.

Subrosian,

Your right it was not a good E3 for Nintendo. Is it enoght to give up on the Wii. For me no. Maybe I am a Nintendo fanboy, I just can not see a point in time where I could go without Nintendo first party games. I enjoy them too much. There is information to look forward to that we got from E3.

First the Wii got 1 to 1 motion controller getting us even closer to VR gaming

Second we there be getting voice chat on the Wii

Third we found out the local 6 player could be done

Fourth Reggie stated after E3 that the Mario team and the Zelda team are working on games

Could E3 have been better and yes Nintendo have given us more information. You know the games are being made just have to wait to find out what they are.

HarlockJC

I wish they would have shown madworld, or at least shown a trailer or screenshot of the new zelda, but one thing confuses me with it's news.... Wii getting voice chat-- people in sw complained that wii had no voice chat of anykind.. and suddenly they get it and guess what sw people are complaining again. like (xbox live or psn or whatever already had voice chat..) N. fixed that prob and people still complained..:? what will make you people happy.. (Manticore not a sheep).

[QUOTE="Nickman71"]

My God, get over yourself.

These press conferences are not intended to please YOU. They are intended to show the press and shareholders how these companies plan to make money. The real money comes from casual games. You saw it with Microsoft (Lips, 1 vs. 100), and Nintendo. And yes, Nintendo is going to make a boat load of money of the games they showed.

Anyways, we already know Pikmin 3, Zelda, Kid Icarus, and Disaster are all in development. Nintendo chose not to show them.

The gaming universe does not revolve around you.

lafigueroa

5 yeara ago I might have agreed with you

but in this age of Live conference streaming over both the Internet and Television, every word is being judged LIVE by millions of gamers around the world. And the gamers watching these conferences aren't the majority of gamers, but the ones that generally buy the most games, so it's Nintendo's dudty to satisfy those customers if they expect those customers to remain loyal.

Your watching a confrence taht's not and never was intended for your eyes. I don't know why watching these things became a big deal, but your expecting a cat to lay an egg. The reaosn watching these events took off is because a few years ago, when it first happend they showed off some crazy good games... that' wasn't normal. This is the normal events...

Maybe the problem is that you listen to rumors and believed them.

As for E3, it was pretty bad all the way around. I'd wait till Spaceworld and see what else Nintendo has up its sleeves. Last year at E3, Nintendo didn't announce that much either, and later on, they announced SSBB after the conference was over. Mario Kart Wii was announced outside of E3 as well. So I think they will have something else to announce for the latter half of the year.

Also, E3 is no longer the gaming convention it used to be. Now it's just a media outlet for companies to talk about their sales and present some games, but it is no longer the gaming behemoth that it used to be.

[QUOTE="Nickman71"]

My God, get over yourself.

These press conferences are not intended to please YOU. They are intended to show the press and shareholders how these companies plan to make money. The real money comes from casual games. You saw it with Microsoft (Lips, 1 vs. 100), and Nintendo. And yes, Nintendo is going to make a boat load of money of the games they showed.

Anyways, we already know Pikmin 3, Zelda, Kid Icarus, and Disaster are all in development. Nintendo chose not to show them.

The gaming universe does not revolve around you.

lafigueroa

5 yeara ago I might have agreed with you

but in this age of Live conference streaming over both the Internet and Television, every word is being judged LIVE by millions of gamers around the world. And the gamers watching these conferences aren't the majority of gamers, but the ones that generally buy the most games, so it's Nintendo's dudty to satisfy those customers if they expect those customers to remain loyal.

If Nintendo were to come out and say "we don't care about hardcore gamers" and be honest, then fine, his point would be valid "get over yourself". Nintendo told us they would care about hardcore gamers, they talk about veteran gamers. In interviews they *claim* that hardcore gamers should be happy. "Look! Animal Crossing on the Wii and GTA on the DS!" Oh boy! Mainstream titles guaranteed to make sales, thanks for stepping out on that limb and putting money behind a project for us!

It's obvious what Nintendo did at this E3 - despite the fact that most of the observors are, themselves, core gamers (journalists, people watching streaming video, forumites, etc) and not the parents / grandparents / casuals that are buying the games shown, Nintendo chose to make the focus of the conferences on the games most of the people watching don't care about.

That speaks *volumes* about what they think of us - did MS and Sony focus on a broad audience too? Yes - but the first games, the big names, the big announcements - were the games for us. Nintendo spent the majority of their show discussing how well they were lining their pockets, and the parading the soccer-moms in front of us. Way to go - I'm glad they're making money, good for them, that makes them a good business - but y'know what's good for gamers? Games.

Yeah.

Games.

So - if Nintendo wants to claim to be innovative - they'd better show some innovative games. And here, they didn't. Hell, I would have given them credit for some *innovative casual titles*. They couldn't even do that! They made *sequels* to their *casual titles*. Wah? I mean - "innovatiion, finger waggle at traditional developers, creativity, progress" and "hey look a Star Wars game on the Wii! Hey look we made that music game we showed you two years ago!"

Overeacting much? How come I don't feel "being stabbed in the chest" by Nintendo?Willy105

My official diagnosis? you probably don't have enough gameplaying time in your day.

Solution: take a few hours off, play some Wii games.....you'll find there really aren't that many to play, and there's not too much to look forward to as far as first party hardcore titles go.

[QUOTE="HarlockJC"]

Subrosian,

Your right it was not a good E3 for Nintendo. Is it enoght to give up on the Wii. For me no. Maybe I am a Nintendo fanboy, I just can not see a point in time where I could go without Nintendo first party games. I enjoy them too much. There is information to look forward to that we got from E3.

First the Wii got 1 to 1 motion controller getting us even closer to VR gaming

Second we there be getting voice chat on the Wii

Third we found out the local 6 player could be done

Fourth Reggie stated after E3 that the Mario team and the Zelda team are working on games

Could E3 have been better and yes Nintendo have given us more information. You know the games are being made just have to wait to find out what they are.

Oroin

I wish they would have shown madworld, or at least shown a trailer or screenshot of the new zelda, but one thing confuses me with it's news.... Wii getting voice chat-- people in sw complained that wii had no voice chat of anykind.. and suddenly they get it and guess what sw people are complaining again. like (xbox live or psn or whatever already had voice chat..) N. fixed that prob and people still complained..:? what will make you people happy.. (Manticore not a sheep).

Wii Chat is even better then a head set IMO... maybe not in pratice but I love the idea.

Nintendo completely sold out. they suck now.

[QUOTE="Willy105"]Overeacting much? How come I don't feel "being stabbed in the chest" by Nintendo?lafigueroa

My official diagnosis? you probably don't have enough gameplaying time in your day.

Solution: take a few hours off, play some Wii games.....you'll find there really aren't that many to play, and there's not too much to look forward to as far as first party hardcore titles go.

Sure there are, just because they weren't shown off at the press confrence doesn't mean they don't exist. They might be on teh floor, they might be shown later in teh week like SSBB was.

Overeacting much? How come I don't feel "being stabbed in the chest" by Nintendo?Willy105

Because, as you've told us, you don't care about hardcore gaming, graphics, sound, etc. You've called yourself a sheep, and if I remember correctly, are a young gamer. You're not a veteran gamer, you don't view games as art, and you weren't alive during the NES era.

I mean none of that as an insult, but you have no way of possibly understanding where I, and other core gamers, are feeling, or where we're coming from. Of course you don't feel stabbed - you're Nintendo's favorite new audience.

I wish they would have shown madworld, or at least shown a trailer or screenshot of the new zelda, but one thing confuses me with it's news.... Wii getting voice chat-- people in sw complained that wii had no voice chat of anykind.. and suddenly they get it and guess what sw people are complaining again. like (xbox live or psn or whatever already had voice chat..) N. fixed that prob and people still complained..:? what will make you people happy.. (Manticore not a sheep).

Oroin

I wish they would have also. It not like the games are not coming out. Just Nintendo has yet to make state what they are. Nintendo is Nintendo they like their secrets.

Nintendo completely sold out. they suck now.

JPOBS

Crying because they had a press confrence focused on the new and less established fanbase, and not on you a gamer who is established and is going to keep gaming no matter what?

What if they annouce a bunch of new Hardcore titles in the next few month, still a sell out? Because they focus on the people who they are less sure about?

A goodbye at this point is pointless, they're already gone.

The Wii is selling like crazy and instead of putting the money into something of quality Nintendo is putting it into the mass market crap games. You can't blame them, they're a business. Microsoft and Sony would too if they could, thankfully they can't so they're forced to focus on us instead.

Still, the Wii is not for quality, it is for mass consumption (the ps2 was both, high sales used to eqaute to most AAA's and AA's, not any more.)

Overeacting much? How come I don't feel "being stabbed in the chest" by Nintendo?Willy105

Me too. Yeah the conference was disappointing, and maybe even embarrassing, but I still have faith in Nintendo especially with some the news recently like a Zelda game in the works. And beside they did show some cool stuff like Wii Speak and Wiimote plus(or whatever it call) and Animal Crossing look good. Also E3 is not over yet so there may be some more stuff from Nintendo. The Conference isn't the whole E3 you know.